Saturday, February 02, 2013
Amor Bravío #118 (Uni 113) Fri 2/1/13 It’s More of the Ruh-Roh Redux Rhumba For Camila As Daniel Struggles Through The Double-Time Quicksand Shuffle And Dionicio Jives With Another Snappy, Surreptitious Jig For Joy
Cap
118
Lo
del Pasado:
Ok. Daniel and Camila,
both still reeling from the shock of seeing Miriam and child risen from the
dead, are seriously wishing he could clone a twin at this point. B-I-L Abraham
effing-Farca and Dan have been playing footsie with the truth, speaking in
oblique terms about why Dan and Abe's whereabouts was so hard for each other to
pin down, so Daniel can keep delicate Miriam ignorant of the truth about her
scum-bucket of a crooked cop brother. (Old
Abe, our Chilean crime crusader, definitely turned in his buen hombre bonafides
when he got Dan thrown into prison, managed somehow to throw away the key, and
then to top it off, tortured his unwitting and innocent B-I-L with the lie of
the century that Miriam and their little baking bun were both pushing up
daisies.) Camila has run to the kitchen
to keep from crumbling under the burden of the bad luck blues and the
stupefying reality that she’ll be giving Dan up just like Louis before. She and Gussie agreed that it’s Dan and Abe’s
place to deliver the harsh truth to Miriam about what’s occurred during the
past 9-12 months on both continents.
Camila will just have to cope in her cabana as Mama serves the tea sans
the sympathy. (How Dan successfully
fought the urge to wring his B-I-L’s scrawny neck after having knocked the
S.O.B.’s teeth out first, and demanded an explanation is still a mystery to
Viewerville.) Dan and Miriam are left to
re-discover themselves while Dio diverts to the study with Abe, and Caridad
changes Baby Aggie upstairs somewhere.
Lo Del Nuevo:
Mariano tries convincing Cayetano to
rethink this Isadora thing. ( I have two words for Mariano: incompetency
trial!) The fact he already found out
from his mama, says the arrogant old adder, will save him time with
explanations. “—Tell her to sign the
divorce papers already, and that she’s should thank her lucky stars [darse de
santos = boast to the saints] that I’ve given her the house in Mexico City and
a huge monthly stipend." Mar tells him
he’s opposed to his signing over the BV to Isadora to avoid having to divvy it
up with Mama Rocio. "--Yep that's the way it is, cuz there’s nothing
left between us and no reason to discuss anything any further! You make her realize that she’d better sign
those papers like yesterday because it’s only going to be worse for her if we
go to court and the whole seedy story is made public [relucir=glisten, sparkle,
to reveal]." “—It’s too bad things have
gone this far, Dad.” “—Yeah, pretty painful.”
Snort. "--I think putting
the ranch in Isadora’s name is a pretty low down [pésima = nasty, wretched] idea just to humiliate Mother.”
Iliana just happens to be eavesdropping all of this out in the hallway.
Mar shows a bit of much appreciated
pique here. “--It’s outrageous to think
that you’ve put the whole of it and your trust into the hands of a woman you
hardly know besides behaving so viciously towards Camila and her family.“ Cayetonto bristles as Mar's toungue lashing whistles past the graveyard and Cay’s scraggy tufts of ear-fluff. He rants himself and says he could give a
flip what happens to the Monterde’s at this point. “—They’re the ones who’ve acted crappy
towards her! She’s shown herself to be
solid [de una sola pieza= a single piece "De una sola pieza" is the
crappy CC mess up I think, tho' the dictionary says "de una pieza”. So I suppose we could say that means Cayatonto
is emphatically impressed with Issa's so called outstanding character traits.] "--But
don’t worry. The cession of property is
only temporary." She signed in front of a
notary and swore before the notary in the power of attorney that she would
return it in a few months, the alter kaker says, after the divorce is
finalized. Mar’s still puzzling and processing here. “—I still don’t get it. You’d prefer to trust that woman before any
of us?” Yep. “—That’s just the way things are. I can’t leave it to Pablo, though it pains me
he’s not here, but he’s a Monterde. Yago
is resentful and acts on his emotions.
[Look who’s talkin’, Pops!] And,
you are too [noble] decent. You’re
likely as not to hand it over to your mother because you’d think it was the fair
thing to do and to protect her.” “—So,
that means that basically you believe that not giving her part of the ranch is
unjust.” [Gotcha!] Cay says no, that’s
what you’d do, not me. “--Since you’ve
got more sway with your mother, tell her if she knows what’s good for her
she’ll sign and the faster the better. I
want to be rid of her ASAP!”
Illy races off to Yago just before
Mariano storms out of the study and gives him the news. Brat Girl, of course, is only worried about
what’ll happen to her once Issa takes over and moves in. (Somehow I am sure she’ll find a way to worm
her way into Issa’s confidence.) Yago
goes ape shit. He yells at her that he
could give a crap about her. He’s got
his half-senile father giving over his property to god damnable woman now to
worry about! “--Get lost already! Stupid fool.”
Meanwhile, Issa goes luxury SUV
shopping to pass the time. She tells the
salesman that she’ll be back with her fiancé; and if he really wants to sell
them the one she wants, then he’ll have to go along with her protesting the
price and such. Pretend he doesn’t know
her and then continue to insist when she decides on it finally. No problem.
Now, er…what’s her name, again? Albarrán. Isadora de Albarrán. [Viewerville fights another gag reflex.]
Back at La Malquerida—the moniker the
unfortunate Miriam has just now inherited—Piedad comes upstairs to Luzma’s room
to give her and Refugio the 411 on the missing persons update. Pie describes the hubbub downstairs in the
living room and in the kitchen. They’ve
got to wait till Pablo comes back with the details to see if Piedad’s guessed
wrong or not. “—Let’s hope you’ve made a
mistake about the people from Chile. It
would be horrible for Sra. Camila if Daniel had another wife.” (Now that’s the understatement of the year!!) All three women are wide-eyed-and-horrified impactadas.
Downstairs Daniel hears from Miriam Abe’s
second biggest lie: that Dan supposedly never went looking for work in Chile
once she fell into the coma cuz he wouldn’t leave her side. He asks if she believed him and she is
surprised he’d ask such a silly question; he knows that she’d have done the
same for him if the situation was reversed.
He excuses himself and admits that he’s so happy and surprised to see
them both alive and in the flesh that he hardly knows what he’s saying. (--Ain’t
that the truth!) She would have died, says Miriam, if something had happened to
him. He tells her then, choosing his
words carefully, that when he “imagined her” possibly dying he couldn’t stand
it; it was just too painful for him.
Not to worry, she says, because he sees that it’s all in the past and
they’re all together now, safe and sound.
She kisses him sensually. He is
still too impactado to kiss back. She
doesn’t seem to notice his lackadaisical lip lock. (Aw who knows; maybe she’s
forgotten what it’s like to have a man kiss her back passionately in response.)
As Dan and she embrace, he wonders if Abe ever bothered to tell her that he
told Dan she was dead and had him unjustly jailed for her murder. Of course not. He wonders why, though. (Join the club, Dan my man. Join. The. Club.)
At the same time, Abe is chatting over
things with Dio. It would seem that
Dio’s signed him on as a new, unwitting confederate in crime ala Aloco-lonzo. He
tells Dio he’s glad that so far so good; that Dan’s understood the double speak
[mixed messages=dobles mensajes].. “--I
was afraid he wouldn’t and that he would confront Miriam.” (Oh, like, uh with
the TRUTH and the facts about all the scummy crap you pulled, you mean?? You
scum sucking invertebrate!) Dio reassures him.. “--Well, as you see, he didn’t.” Abe explains how the doctors were stunned by
his sister’s recovery and chalked it up to her intense need to see Daniel
again. “--That’s why they authorized the
trip here to Mexico.” Well, says Dio,
it’s pretty obvious she loves him greatly.
Abe agrees. “--She adores him.” He
then admits that from early on he never believed Dan was anything more than a
fortune-hunter and that he was a no-body no-account who’d married her for the
money. “--But, it wasn’t that way; they
both married very much in love with one another.” Dio can’t resist digging it in a bit with Dan. “—He and Camila have just returned from their
honeymoon. What a coincidence it is that he always marries the rich ones.”
Abe asks why Dio never bothered to
tell him that before when they spoke.
“—Well, it wouldn’t have mattered, but now that Miriam’s shown up alive,
obviously the marriage to Camila is nonbinding.
Er…your sister needs Dan’s love to fully recover, doesn’t she? Isn’t that right?” (Sneaky bastard!) Righhhht, but Abe says he still has the
feeling that Dio is hiding something from him.
(Oh, now Abe decides to
put on his detective’s mouseket-ears!) “--Your
attitude disturbs me.” Abe seems actually a bit miffed at having been
snookered. (Shoes on the other foot now, Abie boy.) “--Oh, Abraham! You and I are still getting to know each
other. What I should really say is that
I could be very useful to you,.as you would be for me. Therefore, it’s best for the both of us to
become allies.” Abe asks him why he
can’t speak more plainly. He says he
will be when the time is right. He and DDA
don’t trust each other, so just remember that nobody must know about the
agreement between the two of them. Don’t mention his name to anybody
either. (Ok. Now, is that going to raise
the old policeman’s antennae nor not? In
fact, did he even think to check this dude out before traveling up to
Mexico? And this guy calls himself a
cop???) Abe says first he’s got to know
just what this agreement of theirs consists of.
“Oh, you will in good time. Cheers!”
Abe and he toast to whatever that might
be…. Dio then pauses to thinks to
himself that now he’ll finally have Dan and Cam separated forever and that though she may distrust him now, he’ll be her only option. Bwahahahaha! (This is one
sick puppy old houn’ dawg!)
Cam, of course, (lest we forget her)
is heartsick and has returned, in the meanwhile, to their favorite bonfire haunt
where she remembers all her memorable moments with Daniel in the buff and in the
boudoir. She cries enough tears to drown
out the fire and moans that she simply won’t be able to live without him! (Whew! After reliving scenes like those, I can
totally relate!) FF>>
Back in the study with Abe and Dio
again, Abe asks his new “ally” why he’s so interested in all of this,
anyway. “--Why? Well, a woman! That’s what motivates a man, isn’t it?”
“—Ah? Who?” Errr…what
do you mean? His wife, of course! He wants to please his wife. He’d give his life for her. (Yeah, that’s the ticket!) He’s suffered a
great deal from all of DDA’s manipulating and controlling Camila so that he
just doesn’t want the guy around anymore. (Give me a break! The Gag-o-meter is
off the charts with this one! Is Abe
even close to thinking this is so plastic he can see right through the dawg or
not?) As far as Dio’s concerned he can’t
return to Chile fast enough! (I wonder
of Abe has any clue how many levels down Dio’s Devil-dawg Elevator Express actually
goes before it reaches the burning bottom.)
Now Cam is back in the cabaña’s
bedroom and she sees the stars Dan hung from the wall all those many months
ago. (Doesn’t it seem like years rather
than simply months?) She remembers what
he wrote her when he stuck them up on the ceiling that time: “Remember that,
come what may, no matter what may come between us, there’ll always be a
tomorrow.” It’s just too much for her
and she bursts out into boatloads of tears again. She calls Viviana but can’t control
herself. Viv realizes the honeymoon is
definitely over and that her friend is in dire emotional straits. “—What’s the
matter? Is it Daniel?’’ “—Nooooowowowowoh! It’s not Daniel. It’s his past!” Cam can’t explain over the phone she is so
distraught, and begs Viv to hurry over for a face to face with her. Viv hangs up and races to get ready.
Upstairs in the main house, Pablo
finally returns to see about Luzma and relates the events from earlier in the
day. So, he sums up for Luzma, no,
nobody knew that Daniel’s wife and child were still alive, least of all Daniel
who was as tongue-tied and drop-jawed, saucer-eyed-impactado as everyone else—as
was Camila, of course! Piedad speaks up.. “—What a travesty!!! Something always gets in the way of her
happiness, that poor girl.” Luzma wants
to immediately go and comfort Cam, but the others have to force her back into
bed for the baby’s sake. Pablo promises
to find Cami and tell her she needs to come up, that Luzma wants to see her;
and once she’s there Luzma can give her a hug.
That seems to work for now with Luzma.
Now it’s Yago’s turn to race in and
read the riot act to his fool of a father.
He has lost all respect for him, he says. Respect has to be earned with deeds [hechos],
just like he’s always preached to Yago.
Now tho’ Dad’s turned into some half-senile old fart and all over Isadora
Lazcano!! He’s signed the ranch and their inheritance over to her! --Not at all, says the conceited Cay. It’s
only for a while. (Yeah, keep telling
yourself that, you hoary old hound-dawg.]
He explains again what he explained to Mariano, but Yago doesn’t trust
her to return the property any more than Mariano or Rocio did. “—And you believe her? Six months is a long time! Lots can happen in six months!!” Good gawd, don’t be such a doubting tomas, scolds
Cayetonto. You’ll all get the rancho, just
like I got it from my daddy way back when.
“--Don’t worry. I’ll be watching
my back, looking over my shoulder. Your Mama may have hoodwinked me, but nobody
else will ever do it to me!” (Yeah. Famous last words.) Yago calms down. “—Fine.
I just hope the woman doesn’t give you a nasty surprise.”
Yago asks then if Pablo’s going to be
getting out of the way and letting him as Cayetonto’s true Son of Alabarrán,
take full advantage of the name with all its rights and privileges without
Pablo’s sticking his nose in anymore.
Cay says yes, but not because of Yago’s emotionally blackmailing him but
because Pablo’s just such a decent kid.
Yago sniffs and snorts. He
insists it wasn’t emotional blackmail, only what he deserves was all. Either way, Papa Tonto warns Yago, he’s not
to try it again or he’ll come up short.
He’ll now allow Yago to get involved with the day-to-day of his business
and he only hopes that Yago will prove worthy of the opportunity. Yago assures his daddy with a smug,
self-assured smirk.. “Winning is in my blood.”
In town, Natalia and Amanda are
leaving the clinic where she’s given blood.
She’s going to come back to see the doctor the next day for the results
and to find out why she feels so blah all the time now. (Viewerville has seen it all before. They know, even if Mama Amanda still hasn’t
got a clue!) This little trip has brought them together again. Nat loves being babied. FF>>
~~~end parte uno~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Parte 2
Aggie’s been changed (what a relief!) and now is ready for feeding. Dan gets to struggle through his first time
giving the baby her bottle. (Viewerville
stops to savor the moment and let out a simultaneous “Awwwww!” Gussie walks out with a tea tray and suggests
Miriam is ready for a nap along with the baby.
(No, more like the rest of us in the damned audience are. I’m exhausted from this reunion!) She then delights in snidely mentioning that
Cam has gone to the cabaña and asked her to give her apologies. If Miriam noticed the slight, she doesn’t
show it. Dan does, tho’. Abe and Dio return to the living room and
join the others. Abe accepts coffee and
reminds Miriam she needs to give the baby over to Caridad and go up for some
rest, per the doctors’ instructions and the conditions set when they allowed
her to travel to Mexico. Miriam asks Dan
to take her and the baby up to his room.
Dio and Gussie hide their smirks.
Dio offers the room next to his and Gussie’s for the three of them,
choking on a nasty guffaw. Miriam tells
Dan she wants to give him back all the time he’s missed being with little Aggie
while he’s been away. (I love Dan’s way
with the little baby actress. He
certainly seems to love babies.) She
thanks Abe for bringing her to Mexico and giving her the best present she could
ever ask for: being once again at her beloved hubby’s side, the man she will
love forever and a day….. (Viewerville reaches for the bottle of Excedrin on
the coffee table and eats a few dry.)
They head upstairs.
Back in town at Vivi’s, Rafael finds out Viv’s on her way to see Cam and
that there’s trouble in Lovers’ Paradise.
He says he’s coming too.
Back at the hacienda, Gussie shows the happy family their room and tells
Miriam she hopes she likes it. This
gives Miriam the chance to reply that she’d love anywhere her hubby is, as long
as the two of them are together. Mir
plumps the pillows somewhat suggestively, a gesture which does not go unnoticed
by either Gussie or Dan. Dan knows he’s
in it up to his neck and sinking fast.
Gussie sure as Hell isn’t going to throw him a life-line, either! Mir starts opening the drawers of the
nightstand and dressers and remarks there’s nothing in them. Odd.
“—Where are all your things, my love?”
He makes some excuse that he’s got a smaller room outside on the
property somewhere that he’s been using in order to maintain his privacy
[intimidad]. Gussie’s eyes sparkle
mischievously. Don’t worry, says she,
she’ll take chage of making sure every bit of his personal property is brought
up there for him. He stutteres and says
that won’t be necessary, but then gets the brilliant idea of suggesting Aggie,
Mir and Caridad stay in the room together for the time-being since she needs
her rest and he’ll just continue sleeping where he’s been doing so all
along. Nice plan, nothin’ doin’ says
Miriam says.. She’s going to sleep next
to her hubby after so long away, so he can stay with her up there or she’ll
come to wherever he’s got the other bed.
“—We’re husband and wife and we have to sleep together like we’ve always
done, till death do us part.” Gussie has
the look of the Cheshire cat when he’s just caught himself a giant rat. (Grrrr!)
Cami is now thinking back to their honeymoon and all the lovely, love
they made and all the lovely promises they made to each other. “—We think that only death will separate us,
eh? Well, now your wife and baby are
here.” Cam tells Dios that it’s darned difficult
to understand why He’s done what He has and then shrugs. She takes off the locket Dan gave her and
puts it up in her box of keepsakes before collapsing into an easy chair. Suddenly there’s a knock at the door. It’s Dio and he tells her that he’s got Abe
there who is anxious to speak with her.
Won’t she let him in? “—Wouldn’t he be better off talking to Daniel?”
Dio asks again, saying Abe’s got something very important to discuss with her. (You’d better, Cam if you want to stay on our
good side! We’re dying to see this
confrontation!)
Cam opens the door. Abe excuses
the interruption and says Dio’s filled him in on the relationship between Dan
and her, so that’s why he felt he needed to speak with her now. Cam mewls pitifully that he better be
there to explain just what’s going on and why they’re there. Abe says that’s exactly what he’s there to do
for her.
Meanwhile, Gussie observes Dan stuck in the muck, squirming and
struggling, and only sinking further down while uselessly trying to divert
Miriam from her one objective—reclaiming him and their earlier life
together. Miriam now suggests they get
another room for the baby and Caridad close to theirs. Heck yeah, says Gussie with a huge
smile. Miriam says they won’t be a
problem, their stay [estancia] there is only temporary. Dan’s a mess. “—Wh-hat??”
“--Well, sure, I supposed that once you sell your part of the ranch
we’ll head back to Chile. Right?” Dan’s tongue-tied. He stutters a bit and says that things didn’t
turn out like he’d thought so things have changed. Fine, says Miriam, they aren’t in a hurry,
either, exactly, now are they. But since
Dan’s doesn’t know the first thing about raising bulls for the ring, it’s not
like he’s interested in the place, now is he?
It’s just a matter of time. “—And
if it isn’t a matter of time?” Miriam
says she’s fine either way. If he’s
staying in Mexico, then she’ll stay there with him, of course. Gussie, satisfied with the way this
conversation’s heading, takes off to see about the baby’s room.
Caridad leaves with the baby.
Miriam is a bit upset and confused.
She mentions that it’s like everyone there is walking on eggshells
around them. What’s the reason? Dan (and all of Viewerville) would love to
blurt out the truth, that the fact is that everyone’s been tap-dancing around
the truth, avoiding it like the plague, to keep her from having a relapse and
another heart-attack; but he’s too decent to risk running his mouth off like
the rest of us keep wishing he would.
(Remember, blogger buds, telenovela rules state that we wait till the telenovela
gods are good and ready and have stretched our nerves till they’re ready to
snap like a rubber band. Might as well
settle in and surround yourself with plenty of aspirin and adult beverages.) “—The truth is that we’re all so taken by
surprise is all. We weren’t expecting
you.” Well, I can understand the
surprise, but I feel like there’s some sort of embarrassment and confusion
[desconcierto], It’s as if you’d seen a ghost!
(Now, that’s rich.) He insists it’s nothing like that, just that
the last thing anybody, especially he expected, was to see her out of her coma
and visiting with her baby in her arms.
He’s still not over the shock, he admits.
Miriam needs assurances. “--Aren’t
you happy to see me?” Of course, he says
and they hug…but well…Ok. She should
rest and he’s got to leave now to go for his and their other things. He’ll be right back, he tells her and races
out the door.
Cami has finally pulled herself together and let the rage simmer down
long enough to get her Mr. Spock on.
“—When I accused Daniel, I must acknowledge that I was blinded by rage
and the pain. My sister was hovering
between life and death.”
“Rigggghhhht. That gives you the
right to lie to everyone. Telling Daniel
that his wife and child were dead, but not only him, there was Dionisio and the
rest of us as well. He did tell you
that, Dionisio, right?” Dio chimes in
that yes, yes, that’s what he was told. So that’s what he told them. “But, it was Abraham that told you,
correct?” “Yes.”. Uhuh.
Cam says she can understand the rage thing but to tell every one of them
the same story? “--Why lie to
Dionisio?” Abe says he knowed he done
wrong. --But it was the only way he saw
to keep them away and out of his family’s life, especially Miriam’s, if she was
ever going to recover. “—You are
extremely cruel and you have an arresting (pun definitely intended) lack of
scruples, sir.” There it is. She gives it to him right between the
eyes! (Bonus points for style,
Cam! Some of us, dare I say, would have been much more earthy with the nature of our response.) The jerk wad begs her not to judge him. (No need to judge you. I'd settle for you getting a good neuter job, though, and nix the Novocaine!) “—You have no idea, you cannot imagine what
must have been going through my mind at that point in time. I hadn’t a single bit of proof or evidence
that would substantiate Daniel’s innocence.
Quite the contrary: it all implicated him. Everything pointed to him as the one who’d
shot my sister.”
Cam doesn’t let him off that easy.
“—But you knew him. You knew he
was incapable of such a thing.” Her
voice starts to quiver and she’s about to let go, but Dio steps in to avoid a
scene and asks her to give him a chance to talk. Abe asks her to give him a chance to explain
what things were like. “—When Dan
escaped from his cell all of us thought he’d
died. But, without a body, we couldn’t
declare him legally dead.” “--So you
didn’t assume he was dead.” “-- No.” Dio jumps in nervously. “--Well, they sent us
a death certificate,” Abe is confused and stammers out a mention of
Al’s urgent call a few days after Dan’s escape asking him for a death
certificate for Daniel and even offering a bribe if he’d send one. He didn’t’ take the bribe and didn’t know
about any death certificate, bottom line.
“—I might have been unjust and cruel like you’ve said, but a corrupt cop—NEVER!” Dio says, well it came and he, supposedly
thinking it was official, handed it over to her. So it wasn’t you, Abe? (What a crock of sh!t.) No, says Abe adamantly, It definitely didn’t
come from him. He looks pointedly over at Dio. “--You apparently got if from somebody else! Dio nervously clears
his throat. (Stop while you’re ahead here, Dio.)
Cam asks when Miriam came out of the coma. It was six weeks ago. The baby came early and this apparently
jarred her out of the coma. She woke
up. Once the baby was born things she
found were far different from when she’d entered into that coma. (Shades of the Twilight Zone or Alfred Hitchcock
Presents anyone?)
If anybody realizes it, Dan sure does.
He thinks back to the evening Trench bullied his way into the apartment,
their struggle for the gun and the shot that was meant to kill Dan hitting
Miriam instead. He then remembers
looking at her through the glass in her hospital room in intensive care while
she was unconscious.. (My, what a difference a 9 month coma makes….) He bangs his head against the French doors
and thinks about his wedding day with Camila, La Bienquerida, and then the
shock of seeing Miriam there in the drive of La Malquerida—need I say now which
is which? (Dan’s got to have come to the
revelation that Miriam’s a part of his past and that Camila is now his future—at
least that’s what Viewerville is certain is happening here.) He shakes himself out of his reverie and
heads downstairs.
Pablo has just left Gussie cuz he’s got to get Luzma some pills, but he’ll
avoid speaking to her for now. Dan comes
down the stairs to a screeching rant from his M-I-L. “--I always knew you’d bring bad luck and
misfortune to my family! I curse the
hour in which you appeared in our lives.”
Dan politely—wayyyyy too politely—defends himself and his honor. “—Sra. I remind you that I’m not here for the
pleasure of it. All of this you can lay
at the feet of your brother-in-law, Don Daniel.
He was the reason I came here to La Malquerida. Therefore, nothing,
absolutely none of what’s going on here is my fault! (Amen to that!
Word up, woman!) “—Any you’re not responsible for having two wives at one
time, either?” “—That either, because I
thought my wife and child were dead, having died by Julian’s hand, the man that
Leoncio killed here at the ranch. He was
the one that came to my apartment trying to kill me and ending up wounding
Miriam instead. (Got that Helmet Head? Does he need to spell it out or what?)
She refuses to see it that way, which begs the question is she really a
dildo head or just enjoys pretending to be one?
“—Well what do you mean? It can’t
be!” “—Well it is! Do you really think I am going to forget the
face of the man who tried to kill me and ended up nearly killing my wife
instead???” (Naw, but she’d sure like to
think so. If she’s that dense then
everyone else must be that way, too, right??
It’s all a matter of cock-eyed perspective, you see.) “—Well, no matter
now. He’s dead and my wife and daughter
are alive.” Gussie jerks her head up so
high we can all see the nose hairs as she snorts at him. “--That’s precisely why my daughter is
suffering so greatly! So, if you truly
love her then I demand that you take your wife and daughter and return to Chile. --And you must never see Camila ever again!!” Cara de I’m f’d but good de Daniel.
Labels: bravio
Comments:
IMHO Abe has very possibly gotten what he was after where Dan is concerned. He needed to find a way to get Dan out of his sister's life. So, the escape to Mexico along with the belief that his wife and child were dead and the 9-12 months of getting to know Cami, living and working with her day-to-day, have all managed to accomplish that goal. Dan may love Miriam still, but it's not the passionate love a man has for his wife, it's probably mellowed and now is more brotherly in nature. He's transferred that passion to the more immediate and that means Camila. Something tells me he'll come to face that and explain it in those terms to Miriam eventually. So, now that Abe sees how delicate Miriam is, he'll recognize how he's made things worse at this point for her emotionally.
Reasons Augustina doesn’t like Daniel:
She didn’t like him even before she met him (or hadn’t realized that he was Andres) for usurping Camila as heir and because she assumed that he was the bastard of Don Daniel.
She liked him when he was Andres until she found out that he had abused the trust she had placed in him by having an affair with Camila.
Daniel distrusts Dio and has accused him of a number of misdeeds and crimes. Augustina is in deep denial about Dio. People who are in denial become really angry and hostile towards anyone who tries to chip away at it. This is how she is reacting to Dan.
She hates his father.
She is not comfortable that his relationship with Camila started out as a lie. Camila had the same problem when she first learned Daniel’s identity. They don’t like being lied to. It took Camila a looooong time to get past it and Augustina hasn’t gotten past it yet.
She loves Camila and is trying to protect her from a man that she doesn’t like or trust. We may see that protection as misguided, but that is how Augustina sees it and that is what motivates her.
She pigeon holes people and she doesn't handle changes in people's status very well – Pablo, Amanda, Nat and Dan are all examples of that. Camila does not share this trait with her mom at all, and seems to be exceptionally good at going with the flow.
She has a hard time in general with and distain for women who have sex outside of marriage and also has a huge problem with children born out of wedlock. Even though she now knows Daniel is not a bastard, she originally pigeon holed him as that so it continues to be a problem.
That’s all that I can come up with right now. I left out the speculation about being jealous and insecure because I haven’t seen support from that in anything she has actually said or done.
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As usual, Agustina continues to be her crazy ass self accusing Daniel of bringing misfortune in the monterdes I mean he didn't know Miriam was alive. He'll have to tell her the truth sooner or later, whether abraham likes it or not.
Permalink posted by 
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 9:24:00 AM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 9:24:00 AM EST
Plus he didn't shoot Miriam like he said, Julian did and Abraham lied to him about Miriam being dead, so he, camila, and Miriam are all victims of this horrible thing. Daniel does not have to go back to chile, he can stay if he wants to.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 9:29:00 AM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 9:29:00 AM EST
Totally agree, Anonymous. Honestly, doesn't Augustina get any kind of a light bulb going off about Dio being one of the liars who said Miriam was dead? How much is it going to take for her to fight back? I mean she already knows he's involved with Isa, no matter how she tries to believe her oh so unadoring husband.
Daniel should not leave Chile, not leave Camila, even if he has to take some time to unravel all this for Miriam's sake.
Abraham should rot in hell. He won't be lonely, not with this group out there.
Daniel should not leave Chile, not leave Camila, even if he has to take some time to unravel all this for Miriam's sake.
Abraham should rot in hell. He won't be lonely, not with this group out there.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:03:00 AM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:03:00 AM EST
I meant Daniel should not go to Chile and not leave Mexico...but I guess you know that...haha.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:05:00 AM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:05:00 AM EST
Gussy sure is enjoying turning the screws on Dan, isn't she? She's almost enjoying it as much as Dio.
Great title Jardinera. Looking forward to the recap!
Great title Jardinera. Looking forward to the recap!
So right, Vivi. I think that's why Gussy's on my last nerve. She claims to love her daughter but it's almost like she'd rather be right....and probably she's still angry with Camila for her worries about her marriage to Dio.
Yes, great title, Jardinera!
Yes, great title, Jardinera!
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:39:00 AM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:39:00 AM EST
Vivi,
"Gussy sure is enjoying turning the screws on Dan, isn't she?"
and Marta,
"...Gussy's on my last nerve."
Augustina had me cracking up last night. Who knew that she has such a sweetly vicious sadistic streak? She had poor Dan squirming even as she was being the perfectly gracious hostess to Miriam.
Here all along I had her sized up as pitifully dull and slow-witted. Last night she was like that clunky cat in Cinderella slyly tormenting the hapless and (for the moment anyway) helpless Dan.
Carlos
"Gussy sure is enjoying turning the screws on Dan, isn't she?"
and Marta,
"...Gussy's on my last nerve."
Augustina had me cracking up last night. Who knew that she has such a sweetly vicious sadistic streak? She had poor Dan squirming even as she was being the perfectly gracious hostess to Miriam.
Here all along I had her sized up as pitifully dull and slow-witted. Last night she was like that clunky cat in Cinderella slyly tormenting the hapless and (for the moment anyway) helpless Dan.
Carlos
I'm too sad and confused to say much now. I suspect that more time, more coffee, and Jardinera's recap will help.
Though Gussie doesn't mean to be cruel, her self-righteousness and blindness make her as cruel as those who are deliberately so. Last night, I wanted to strangle her. I'm beginning to doubt that she can be redeemed. The only thing that could save her is her being Camila's mother, but I no longer think that's enough. (I hide my emotions so well, don't I?)
Not much else to say right now. So that 6-month old baby was born six weeks ago? Hmmm.... I see she has already had her ears pierced (unless what I saw was just a piece of dirt on my TV screen, but I don't think so).
I took a look at Gato Viejo's site just now, trying to understand the use of the word "pieza" in last night's episodio. What I saw at the site was Cayetonto's claim that Hissadora "es una mujer que me ha demostrado que es dena sa pieza." What does "dena sa pieza" mean? Or what did he actually say, if the subtitles are wrong? Muchas gracias por adelantado.
Though Gussie doesn't mean to be cruel, her self-righteousness and blindness make her as cruel as those who are deliberately so. Last night, I wanted to strangle her. I'm beginning to doubt that she can be redeemed. The only thing that could save her is her being Camila's mother, but I no longer think that's enough. (I hide my emotions so well, don't I?)
Not much else to say right now. So that 6-month old baby was born six weeks ago? Hmmm.... I see she has already had her ears pierced (unless what I saw was just a piece of dirt on my TV screen, but I don't think so).
I took a look at Gato Viejo's site just now, trying to understand the use of the word "pieza" in last night's episodio. What I saw at the site was Cayetonto's claim that Hissadora "es una mujer que me ha demostrado que es dena sa pieza." What does "dena sa pieza" mean? Or what did he actually say, if the subtitles are wrong? Muchas gracias por adelantado.
One more thought: Abraham seemed much more wary and uncomfortable with Dionisio than I had expected. I wonder whether he (Abraham) will ultimately help bring Dio down.
Great title Jardinera very apropos to the episode.
Vivi, right on about Augustonta; even though I was cracking up at her enjoyment in seeing Dan squirming; I found her very cruel and out of place telling Dan to skip town -- can't wait for her comeuppance.
Dio is still delusional with his obsession of Cam that he doesn't see the bigger picture--he's scoring points with his small gains but he always fail to anticipate that he can't control people's emotions and reactions.
In contrast with Isadora; she manipulates her target (Alonso, Ximena, Cayentonto) emotions and reactions to reach her desired goal--always almost successful in obtaining it.
Was that CdlF playing with the baby? That scene feels out-of-character to Dan's current mental state.
I feel for Camila; but she's feeling defeating too soon for my taste.
Dan has the heaviest burden in this triangle--he panicked at the possibility of returning to Chile; he's not pleased at the prospect of sharing a room with his legal wife; he's tense and he's not saying I love you back ...
Miriam is in a bubble right now; she feels there's something amiss but can't quite put her finger on it because the last thing on her mind is that "her Daniel" has stopped loving her.
Day 2 of the Saga Cam-Dan-Miriam
Myo--
Vivi, right on about Augustonta; even though I was cracking up at her enjoyment in seeing Dan squirming; I found her very cruel and out of place telling Dan to skip town -- can't wait for her comeuppance.
Dio is still delusional with his obsession of Cam that he doesn't see the bigger picture--he's scoring points with his small gains but he always fail to anticipate that he can't control people's emotions and reactions.
In contrast with Isadora; she manipulates her target (Alonso, Ximena, Cayentonto) emotions and reactions to reach her desired goal--always almost successful in obtaining it.
Was that CdlF playing with the baby? That scene feels out-of-character to Dan's current mental state.
I feel for Camila; but she's feeling defeating too soon for my taste.
Dan has the heaviest burden in this triangle--he panicked at the possibility of returning to Chile; he's not pleased at the prospect of sharing a room with his legal wife; he's tense and he's not saying I love you back ...
Miriam is in a bubble right now; she feels there's something amiss but can't quite put her finger on it because the last thing on her mind is that "her Daniel" has stopped loving her.
Day 2 of the Saga Cam-Dan-Miriam
Myo--
Juanita- He said "de una pieza", meaning she's a woman of integrity (a good person/a fine upstanding woman). Ha!
Can we stop complaining/commenting about the size of newborns and near-newborns on television? That's done for health and safety reasons and they are required to use identical twins.
Yes, the baby's ears are pierced. I've seen this before.
Abe did look uncomfortable and I hope he does help bring the devil down.
I promise you all I will thoroughly rake that metiche Gussie over the coals on Monday. Whether she is just stupid beyond belief or vicious at Camila for trying to open her eyes about El Diablo doesn't matter to me at this point. She broke her promise to Camila to stay out of this and let her and Daniel work it out. That should make Camila good and mad when she finds out.
Yes, the baby's ears are pierced. I've seen this before.
Abe did look uncomfortable and I hope he does help bring the devil down.
I promise you all I will thoroughly rake that metiche Gussie over the coals on Monday. Whether she is just stupid beyond belief or vicious at Camila for trying to open her eyes about El Diablo doesn't matter to me at this point. She broke her promise to Camila to stay out of this and let her and Daniel work it out. That should make Camila good and mad when she finds out.
Daniel is such a wimp.
And from time to time, there is a flash of connections being made in Abe's mind. Particularly, how he is being used by Dio. But then, since Abe is in here for the money, his integrity evaporates every time he opens his mouth.
All three men last night revealed a great display of male stupidity, arrogance, and scheming.
And from time to time, there is a flash of connections being made in Abe's mind. Particularly, how he is being used by Dio. But then, since Abe is in here for the money, his integrity evaporates every time he opens his mouth.
All three men last night revealed a great display of male stupidity, arrogance, and scheming.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 11:23:00 AM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 11:23:00 AM EST
I also suspect Abe may rise to the occasion and help in Diablo's demise. I think he probably started out as an upright law-abiding/enforcing guy but was waylaid by this misfortune of Shakespearean proportion and blinded by his prejudices. He may be brought to his knees by it, but methinks he'll come around.
As for CdelaF playing with the baby; I actually thought it was a realistic bit of stage business for a guy who is center stage in an awkward situation, blind-sided by untenable circumstances and not knowing exactly what moves to make. I've found myself playing with somebody's kids when I was in an uncomfortable social situation and it gives relief and comfort. So I can see it as natural.
Can't wait for Jardinera's treatment of the Redux Rhumba.
—Agnes in NJ
As for CdelaF playing with the baby; I actually thought it was a realistic bit of stage business for a guy who is center stage in an awkward situation, blind-sided by untenable circumstances and not knowing exactly what moves to make. I've found myself playing with somebody's kids when I was in an uncomfortable social situation and it gives relief and comfort. So I can see it as natural.
Can't wait for Jardinera's treatment of the Redux Rhumba.
—Agnes in NJ
Cut Daniel at least this much slack: He was led to believe that Miriam was dead. He had no reason to think that this would happen and he's in shock.
Abe is not on El Diablo's payroll. He doesn't know him from a hole in the wall. He is realizing he made a huge mistake about Daniel and is feeling like an idiot.
El Diablo is delusional and he will be until he encounters Camila's left hook, knees, and fingertips (in his eyes) when he tries something with her.
Camila and Daniel need to confront Abe together. Abe can redeem himself by helping to bring the devil down. That is the only way he can earn anyone's forgiveness.
Abe is not on El Diablo's payroll. He doesn't know him from a hole in the wall. He is realizing he made a huge mistake about Daniel and is feeling like an idiot.
El Diablo is delusional and he will be until he encounters Camila's left hook, knees, and fingertips (in his eyes) when he tries something with her.
Camila and Daniel need to confront Abe together. Abe can redeem himself by helping to bring the devil down. That is the only way he can earn anyone's forgiveness.
Looking forward to insight on Abe's conversations with Dio. I know they drank to their partnership, but there seems to be a certain hesitancy on Abe's part. Or is that wishful thinking on my part?
Hmm, my new buddy Dio didn't mention Dan was married?
Did Dio set up Miriam for a shock? Did he encourage Abe to not only come to Mexico, but to bring Miriam, or was it just that there was no telling her no once Abe let it slip he was off to see Dan?
OT: this talk recently of Destinos has recalled to mind that theoretically, I'm trying to improve my Spanish via watching TN. But to be real, keeping up with a current show just doesn't allow for going back over sections, hitting the dictionary, etc.
Is there an existing page or forum on Caray about using TN for closer study? Any suggestions about other/older titles where the plot, acting, and such might stand up to closer viewing?
just hit up the net for early capitulos of AB? Are any TN legally available in complete, or at least not totally chopped, DVD versions?
I intend to start with Destinos, but from a sampling, while "better" (at least more interesting) than conjugation drills from my old h.s. French class, I'm just not sure I will be captivated enough to enjoy "dwelling within" that world enough to not feel like I'm working. and I'm lazy enough that if it feels like work...
I still don't know the precise derivation of "beanie" here, and I gather that AB is actually less reliant on extraordinary coincidence, incredible stupidity, and such, than most, but while I may come to love them as part of the charm of TNs, for now beanie moments tend to irritate me and I think too many would make it difficult for me to remain sufficiently invested in the characters to sustain prolonged immersion.
Maybe I should also ask Carlos to chime in with advice on one that will also be agradabla a la vista. :) (nothing too risque, I'll be watching "in company" so I suppose suggestions as to something muy romantico with a particularly involving leading pareja would be best).
Thanks.
Chris in FL
Hmm, my new buddy Dio didn't mention Dan was married?
Did Dio set up Miriam for a shock? Did he encourage Abe to not only come to Mexico, but to bring Miriam, or was it just that there was no telling her no once Abe let it slip he was off to see Dan?
OT: this talk recently of Destinos has recalled to mind that theoretically, I'm trying to improve my Spanish via watching TN. But to be real, keeping up with a current show just doesn't allow for going back over sections, hitting the dictionary, etc.
Is there an existing page or forum on Caray about using TN for closer study? Any suggestions about other/older titles where the plot, acting, and such might stand up to closer viewing?
just hit up the net for early capitulos of AB? Are any TN legally available in complete, or at least not totally chopped, DVD versions?
I intend to start with Destinos, but from a sampling, while "better" (at least more interesting) than conjugation drills from my old h.s. French class, I'm just not sure I will be captivated enough to enjoy "dwelling within" that world enough to not feel like I'm working. and I'm lazy enough that if it feels like work...
I still don't know the precise derivation of "beanie" here, and I gather that AB is actually less reliant on extraordinary coincidence, incredible stupidity, and such, than most, but while I may come to love them as part of the charm of TNs, for now beanie moments tend to irritate me and I think too many would make it difficult for me to remain sufficiently invested in the characters to sustain prolonged immersion.
Maybe I should also ask Carlos to chime in with advice on one that will also be agradabla a la vista. :) (nothing too risque, I'll be watching "in company" so I suppose suggestions as to something muy romantico with a particularly involving leading pareja would be best).
Thanks.
Chris in FL
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 11:41:00 AM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 11:41:00 AM EST
Just a quick comment, waiting for what I'm sure will be a Jardinera-special. We are indeed in some special territory in this novela!
I want to say that while I am rooting for Camila -- how could I not -- Daniel really did love Miriam not that long ago and now they have a baby (6 weeks old????, as someone has already said) together. Independent of uncovering Dio's tricks and helping to contribute to Isadora's demise, Daniel is in one heck of a pickle. Unlike in most novelas, neither of these women has been duplicitous or hateful. His life with Camila is fresher, newer and must seem more like love. But it's all happened pretty darn fast. I just hope that we get to a mature decision rather than killing someone off in the resolution!
Do they all have to be at the hacienda together?
We have to wait for news on Natalia. Iago -- ick!!! He's getting worse with each episode.
I want to say that while I am rooting for Camila -- how could I not -- Daniel really did love Miriam not that long ago and now they have a baby (6 weeks old????, as someone has already said) together. Independent of uncovering Dio's tricks and helping to contribute to Isadora's demise, Daniel is in one heck of a pickle. Unlike in most novelas, neither of these women has been duplicitous or hateful. His life with Camila is fresher, newer and must seem more like love. But it's all happened pretty darn fast. I just hope that we get to a mature decision rather than killing someone off in the resolution!
Do they all have to be at the hacienda together?
We have to wait for news on Natalia. Iago -- ick!!! He's getting worse with each episode.
Welcome: Chris in FL.
I am stopping in for a moment to give my brain a rest. (Happens more often than not these days, I'm sure.) Enjoying the give and take of the discussion here. Chris, yes I'm glad you've found a soul mate--if only a sole mate--among us blogging femmes. He'll help you with beanie tightening so that blood circulation to the brain is not too constricted. Roll with the mellow of the drama and you'll do fine. At least, you will be more likely to look at yourself in the mirror and not cringe.
Ok. Back to it....
I am stopping in for a moment to give my brain a rest. (Happens more often than not these days, I'm sure.) Enjoying the give and take of the discussion here. Chris, yes I'm glad you've found a soul mate--if only a sole mate--among us blogging femmes. He'll help you with beanie tightening so that blood circulation to the brain is not too constricted. Roll with the mellow of the drama and you'll do fine. At least, you will be more likely to look at yourself in the mirror and not cringe.
Ok. Back to it....
Chris- Melinama, our Caray Caray blog mom, has another blog post on learning Spanish through telenovelas: http://www.squidoo.com/telenovela-learning
Also, one of our commentors, Gato Viejo, has a site where you can find side by side spanish-english translations (mostly accurate) of the AB script by the next morning-- you can also go back and look at previous episodes: http://users.frii.com/markzimm/ambrav/latest
As for tns, it depends on the kind of tn you like. Everyone has different tastes. Most people know the ones that are REALLY bad. But there is a range in the ones people consider to be good. Do you only want drama, or do you like comedy too? I would look through some comments on older tns recapped on this site to see which ones people really liked.
You can find most older tns on Dailymotion or YouTube. You can also find AB on YouTube right now, but it's usually tricky to find tns currently playing in the US online (other than Hulu) because the networks scrub the web getting rid of them. When we find a site that has them, we have learned to keep quiet about it on the blog because the networks actually scan sites like ours to see where they need to go sweep for videos. You can usually e-mail a recapper personally and ask, as they often know where to find the videos.
Also, one of our commentors, Gato Viejo, has a site where you can find side by side spanish-english translations (mostly accurate) of the AB script by the next morning-- you can also go back and look at previous episodes: http://users.frii.com/markzimm/ambrav/latest
As for tns, it depends on the kind of tn you like. Everyone has different tastes. Most people know the ones that are REALLY bad. But there is a range in the ones people consider to be good. Do you only want drama, or do you like comedy too? I would look through some comments on older tns recapped on this site to see which ones people really liked.
You can find most older tns on Dailymotion or YouTube. You can also find AB on YouTube right now, but it's usually tricky to find tns currently playing in the US online (other than Hulu) because the networks scrub the web getting rid of them. When we find a site that has them, we have learned to keep quiet about it on the blog because the networks actually scan sites like ours to see where they need to go sweep for videos. You can usually e-mail a recapper personally and ask, as they often know where to find the videos.
Jardinera - Fab title.
I hope they don't kill off Miriam. It's only been a half-hour or so, but Miriam will soon realize "her Dan" is no longer there. Dan is incapable of faking it. If Miriam is strong enough to fight against her family to marry Dan, live on his modest income, and spend nearly a year recovering her health, she can handle the truth. Plus she's got an adorable baby to give her strength. Dan will be there for his baby. And Dante won't pass up the chance to live his dream with Miriam.
I hope they don't kill off Miriam. It's only been a half-hour or so, but Miriam will soon realize "her Dan" is no longer there. Dan is incapable of faking it. If Miriam is strong enough to fight against her family to marry Dan, live on his modest income, and spend nearly a year recovering her health, she can handle the truth. Plus she's got an adorable baby to give her strength. Dan will be there for his baby. And Dante won't pass up the chance to live his dream with Miriam.
Niece -
From your lips to the novela gods' ears. Excellent resolution -- I hope that's where we are headed.
TL
From your lips to the novela gods' ears. Excellent resolution -- I hope that's where we are headed.
TL
Chris, in addition to Melinama's discussion of using telenovelas to learn Spanish there are two more I know of. One is Paula's very impressive account of how she did it at http://www.redshift.com/~bonajo/spantnstudy.htm. Paula is a CarayCaray participant.
The other discussion is from someone named Andrew, who has an entire site devoted to learning Spanish. The telenovela piece is at http://howlearnspanish.com/2010/11/the-telenovela-method/.
And yes, do give Destinos a try. It's perhaps best if you're starting your study of Spanish, but it's really quite compelling and helpful.
The other discussion is from someone named Andrew, who has an entire site devoted to learning Spanish. The telenovela piece is at http://howlearnspanish.com/2010/11/the-telenovela-method/.
And yes, do give Destinos a try. It's perhaps best if you're starting your study of Spanish, but it's really quite compelling and helpful.
You're welcome Juanita. He might even have said "de una sola pieza" and the text/subtitles just got a bit jumbled as they sometimes do.
Niecie- I also hope that Miriam comes out alive at the end, and with a new love.
Niecie- I also hope that Miriam comes out alive at the end, and with a new love.
I always thought that it was too soon for D'Andres (remember him?) to be pursuing Camila so ardently. I guess it was like a rayo (lightning strike) or something that he couldn't resist. He hadn't even had a chance to mourn due to having to flee and lay low, but he headed right into another love. Who would have ever dreamed of this kind of consequence, though?
I also noticed the playing with the baby and thought it seemed too soon and out of place. I get that he wouldn't reject the baby, and there's no doubt of paternity, but it seems like there would be more of a "getting to know you" period, as well as waiting to be out of shock, before doing trompetillas and stuff.
TN4ever
I also noticed the playing with the baby and thought it seemed too soon and out of place. I get that he wouldn't reject the baby, and there's no doubt of paternity, but it seems like there would be more of a "getting to know you" period, as well as waiting to be out of shock, before doing trompetillas and stuff.
TN4ever
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 1:31:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 1:31:00 PM EST
Was I the only one yelling at Dan to 'Just Tell Her'? It would be so much simpler that way.
Dio was trying to get Abraham to think that Dan only married Cam for her money. He's trying to sway Abraham's opinion against Dan again by getting him to think he is only in it for the money this time too. But I was glad to see Abraham looking sideways at Dion when he was talking to Camila when she mentioned something that went against him and Dion butted in with a lie.
Dio was trying to get Abraham to think that Dan only married Cam for her money. He's trying to sway Abraham's opinion against Dan again by getting him to think he is only in it for the money this time too. But I was glad to see Abraham looking sideways at Dion when he was talking to Camila when she mentioned something that went against him and Dion butted in with a lie.
What struck me yesterday was the scene where Dan leaves Miriam and walks into the hallway, he looked so tired and defeated, but what can you expect from a guy that just got his wife back from the dead?
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 3:10:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 3:10:00 PM EST
Abe was definitely suspicious of Dio last night. Learning that Dio hid the fact that Dan had a new wife, and hearing Cami's version of events definitely set off red flags about Dio for him. Since he loves his sister above all else, I am sure he'll join the Scoobies in their quest to take down those responsible for his sister's near death-- Dio and Isa.
Elle- That scene with Dan in the hallway was very sad. He was fighting back tears, clearing his throat, and trying really hard to hold it together, look strong, and not fall apart.
Elle- That scene with Dan in the hallway was very sad. He was fighting back tears, clearing his throat, and trying really hard to hold it together, look strong, and not fall apart.
I was yelling at Camila to ask Dio to butt out and talk to Abraham one on one.
She's in such shock and pain that she didn't seem to notice how Abe kept looking at Dio, but she really ought to know that Dio is not ever up to any good.
I am also thinking that Abe will come around and help them bring down Dio. He still needs to figure out what is going on, but I am trusting that as a cop, a detective no less, that he has some pretty good BS detection abilities.
She's in such shock and pain that she didn't seem to notice how Abe kept looking at Dio, but she really ought to know that Dio is not ever up to any good.
I am also thinking that Abe will come around and help them bring down Dio. He still needs to figure out what is going on, but I am trusting that as a cop, a detective no less, that he has some pretty good BS detection abilities.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 3:25:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 3:25:00 PM EST
It was dumb of Camila to let Dionisio in with Abe. She should have let Abe in, but should have kicked Dionisio out. What was she thinking? She knows him - or if he was in, she should have told him to keep quiet, I'm talking to Abe, not you! She should have said right then and there (to Abe in front of Dio), "How do I know you're telling the truth? You seem to be all buddy/buddy with Dionisio here and yet, HE was the one that hired Julian to kill Daniel and instead, shot your sister. Why do you think he ran to Chile to cover his tracks?" Even though Dionisio would have denied it, of course, and come up with a smooth lie, the cop in Abe would have have become instantly suspicious.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 3:27:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 3:27:00 PM EST
Carolina- I think it's actually good that Dio is in the room, because both Cam and Abe can watch him dance around the truth and have to come up with excuses on the spot. It's easier to catch him in a lie when he's not one on one with someone.
Hi Chris and welcome,
You’ve already gotten some great advice and links to address your question, but I thought I’d add my two cents since professionally I am a researcher in Second Language Acquisition and this is a special area of interest to me.
I’ve been able to enrich what I learn from AB by doing the following:
I watch with the Spanish captions on. Any language input is enhanced by having more than one input ‘channel’ in operation. I listen and read simultaneously, so sometimes I get the meaning one way and sometimes the other. This technique utilizes your strengths while building your weaknesses. I disagree that this is a matter of preference or learning style. It may be more natural for some who feel comfortable doing this right away and others may need some time and practice to get used to it, but everything we know about second language learning supports the idea that the richer the context, the better the learning.
Translation is not really that helpful in learning the target language. It certainly has a place in helping to sort out confusion at times, and it can be very satisfying to learn the exact meaning of a word or phrase, there is no harm in that, but in general it is better to simply try to work out the meaning in the target language and not worry about the exact meaning in English. A lot of times there isn’t even an exact equivalent anyhow. It is much better to enter the world of the target language and stay in that world than to waste your time and mental energy going back and forth from Spanish to English one. So …
Don’t watch TV with the English captions on.
Also don’t spend too much time looking at translated dialogs. I like the recaps here because they give me just enough help to fill in the gaps without translating the whole show word by word.
I watch each episode a second time with On Demand with the Spanish captions on. This is really helpful because I can stop and replay scenes and look up words in the dictionary and jot down notes and so forth. I also like to entertain myself by pausing to mimic strongly stated expressions that I just heard. Sometimes it takes me a couple of hours to go through an episode in this way, but this is when the real learning takes place.
I often watch episodes again on YouTube as well, and sometimes just some favorite scenes. I have been able to find all the episodes there so far with the exception of only one or two. There are no captions, so this is more challenging for me, but if it’s the third time through, it is amazing how much more I can understand than I could the first time. I also peek ahead at future episodes sometimes because I can’t resist, and then it’s fun to watch the show and see what I understood and what I muffed.
Hope that helps!
You’ve already gotten some great advice and links to address your question, but I thought I’d add my two cents since professionally I am a researcher in Second Language Acquisition and this is a special area of interest to me.
I’ve been able to enrich what I learn from AB by doing the following:
I watch with the Spanish captions on. Any language input is enhanced by having more than one input ‘channel’ in operation. I listen and read simultaneously, so sometimes I get the meaning one way and sometimes the other. This technique utilizes your strengths while building your weaknesses. I disagree that this is a matter of preference or learning style. It may be more natural for some who feel comfortable doing this right away and others may need some time and practice to get used to it, but everything we know about second language learning supports the idea that the richer the context, the better the learning.
Translation is not really that helpful in learning the target language. It certainly has a place in helping to sort out confusion at times, and it can be very satisfying to learn the exact meaning of a word or phrase, there is no harm in that, but in general it is better to simply try to work out the meaning in the target language and not worry about the exact meaning in English. A lot of times there isn’t even an exact equivalent anyhow. It is much better to enter the world of the target language and stay in that world than to waste your time and mental energy going back and forth from Spanish to English one. So …
Don’t watch TV with the English captions on.
Also don’t spend too much time looking at translated dialogs. I like the recaps here because they give me just enough help to fill in the gaps without translating the whole show word by word.
I watch each episode a second time with On Demand with the Spanish captions on. This is really helpful because I can stop and replay scenes and look up words in the dictionary and jot down notes and so forth. I also like to entertain myself by pausing to mimic strongly stated expressions that I just heard. Sometimes it takes me a couple of hours to go through an episode in this way, but this is when the real learning takes place.
I often watch episodes again on YouTube as well, and sometimes just some favorite scenes. I have been able to find all the episodes there so far with the exception of only one or two. There are no captions, so this is more challenging for me, but if it’s the third time through, it is amazing how much more I can understand than I could the first time. I also peek ahead at future episodes sometimes because I can’t resist, and then it’s fun to watch the show and see what I understood and what I muffed.
Hope that helps!
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 4:17:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 4:17:00 PM EST
Miriam told Dan that she'd stay in Mexico with him. That's important because at the beginning of the show she was adamant about staying in Chile.
Augustina may demand Daniel go back to Chile with Miriam & the baby ASAP but even if he does, he owns at least 33% of La Malquerida so he'll still be in Camila's life in some form unless he gives his portion to Camila and/or Pablo.
And because Dan owns/will own at least 33-50% of La Malquerida (since he & Cami expressed a desire to share with Pablo), Augstina cannot DEMAND or ORDER Daniel to leave his own property.
That's Augustina's problem: she does not and refuses to recognize Daniel as a part dueno of LMQ. She still thinks of him as the lowly choffer and will continue to treat him as just the lowly choffer. He's been real patient with her because of his love for Camila but it's time for Daniel and/or Camila to tell Augustina to sit down and have a stadium full of seats or she can leave LMQ ASAP.
It is not Augustina's place to scrunch up her nose at Pablo, Luz Maria, Miriam, Natalia or anyone else staying or invited to stay at the ranch. It is not and never was her property! She has NO authority! The only reason she was ever allowed to stay at LMQ is because of Amparo & Camila. Otherwise she'd be living elsewhere.
I think that's the root problem of Augustina: she thinks she is, what she is NOT:
She thinks she's a good mother; she is NOT (competing w/Camila; Ximena's whole existence)
She thinks she's a great catch; she is NOT (dissing Osvaldo)
She thinks she is the Duena of LMQ; she is NOT (just a glorified house guest of the past 20 years)
She thinks she has a great marriage; she does NOT (self explanatory)
She thinks she knows everything; she does NOT (that's why she's so easily tricked)
Augustina's comeuppance/redemption won't occur until she realizes she is too stupid to live, and begs Dan & Camila for forgiveness.
Augustina may demand Daniel go back to Chile with Miriam & the baby ASAP but even if he does, he owns at least 33% of La Malquerida so he'll still be in Camila's life in some form unless he gives his portion to Camila and/or Pablo.
And because Dan owns/will own at least 33-50% of La Malquerida (since he & Cami expressed a desire to share with Pablo), Augstina cannot DEMAND or ORDER Daniel to leave his own property.
That's Augustina's problem: she does not and refuses to recognize Daniel as a part dueno of LMQ. She still thinks of him as the lowly choffer and will continue to treat him as just the lowly choffer. He's been real patient with her because of his love for Camila but it's time for Daniel and/or Camila to tell Augustina to sit down and have a stadium full of seats or she can leave LMQ ASAP.
It is not Augustina's place to scrunch up her nose at Pablo, Luz Maria, Miriam, Natalia or anyone else staying or invited to stay at the ranch. It is not and never was her property! She has NO authority! The only reason she was ever allowed to stay at LMQ is because of Amparo & Camila. Otherwise she'd be living elsewhere.
I think that's the root problem of Augustina: she thinks she is, what she is NOT:
She thinks she's a good mother; she is NOT (competing w/Camila; Ximena's whole existence)
She thinks she's a great catch; she is NOT (dissing Osvaldo)
She thinks she is the Duena of LMQ; she is NOT (just a glorified house guest of the past 20 years)
She thinks she has a great marriage; she does NOT (self explanatory)
She thinks she knows everything; she does NOT (that's why she's so easily tricked)
Augustina's comeuppance/redemption won't occur until she realizes she is too stupid to live, and begs Dan & Camila for forgiveness.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 4:23:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 4:23:00 PM EST
Vivi, I think that if Camila were as sharp as she normally would be, I would see your point. By she is so shell-shocked, she isn't picking up on obvious clues at the moment. I think Abe is not comfortable being aligned with Dio and would be more likely to tell the truth to Camila if Dio wasn't breathing down his neck.
Time will tell about Abe. Right now I am thinking that he's going to turn out to be a good guy, but they are going to have to separate him from Dio.
Time will tell about Abe. Right now I am thinking that he's going to turn out to be a good guy, but they are going to have to separate him from Dio.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 4:32:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 4:32:00 PM EST
Carolina- True. She is too emotionally raw right now to pick up on some of these hints that something is going on between Dio and Abe. But hopefully, later when she's more calm, she'll think back to their reactions and put some pieces together.
Carlos - Love your description of Gussy last night. Definitely great acting. You described it so well!
I for one have absolutely no faith in Abraham, although they may redeem him by having him join the anti-Dio team. This man accused Daniel of killing his sister, lied when he said she was dead. For me, this does not demonstrate a man with any kind of integrity, who has some kind of sick thing with Miriam, and given his profession, whatever his skills may be, he's a real low life.
I for one have absolutely no faith in Abraham, although they may redeem him by having him join the anti-Dio team. This man accused Daniel of killing his sister, lied when he said she was dead. For me, this does not demonstrate a man with any kind of integrity, who has some kind of sick thing with Miriam, and given his profession, whatever his skills may be, he's a real low life.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 4:47:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 4:47:00 PM EST
"Augustina's comeuppance/redemption won't occur until she realizes she is too stupid to live, and begs Dan & Camila for forgiveness. " Anon207, you said it! Exactamente.
Jardinera, you never disappoint! Part 1 was magnifico. So many wonderful lines. I kept shaking my head yes, Yes, YES! in agreement with statements such as "The Gag-o-meter is off the charts with this one!" and "(I wonder of Abe has any clue how many levels down Dio’s Devil-dawg Elevator Express actually goes before it reaches the burning bottom.)" And I think you've finally nailed Cayetonto: "alter kaker" fits him PERFECTLY!
Fabulous Part 1, Jardinera! I absolutely love all of your references to Abe, scum of the earth. I couldn't agree more.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 6:04:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 6:04:00 PM EST
Jardinera,
You certainly read viewerville's mind and asides to self so very well. What a great recap, Part 1.
There were so many choice parts, but I'm giggling at the moment at your recreation of the scene with the tres impactadas in Luzma's room, with eyes bugging out of heads with the news of Daniel's two wives.
I look forward to Part 2, and thank you for taking so much of your weekend in entertaining us.
You certainly read viewerville's mind and asides to self so very well. What a great recap, Part 1.
There were so many choice parts, but I'm giggling at the moment at your recreation of the scene with the tres impactadas in Luzma's room, with eyes bugging out of heads with the news of Daniel's two wives.
I look forward to Part 2, and thank you for taking so much of your weekend in entertaining us.
Thanks Jardinera for a great part 1
Thanks guys for the comments on resources for learning Spanish from the novelas.
As far as Dan playing with the baby, my take on that is: I've noticed in every tn I've watched the importance that has been put on babies. Part of the reward for being a good guy is acquiring a baby. (Remember in Fuego de la sangre that Sofia refused the test that would distinguish between her baby and the adopted baby). Ino ther words, it seemed to me that this was supposed to be a plus to the type guy he is that as confused as he is about the 2 women, there is no denying his love for the baby. It also tells me that no matter which woman he ends up with, the baby will be in his life forever.
My guesses are always wrong so I don't mind saying that I think that Miriam is fatally ill and that's why she's on medication and why they continue to mention her fragile condition.
Thanks guys for the comments on resources for learning Spanish from the novelas.
As far as Dan playing with the baby, my take on that is: I've noticed in every tn I've watched the importance that has been put on babies. Part of the reward for being a good guy is acquiring a baby. (Remember in Fuego de la sangre that Sofia refused the test that would distinguish between her baby and the adopted baby). Ino ther words, it seemed to me that this was supposed to be a plus to the type guy he is that as confused as he is about the 2 women, there is no denying his love for the baby. It also tells me that no matter which woman he ends up with, the baby will be in his life forever.
My guesses are always wrong so I don't mind saying that I think that Miriam is fatally ill and that's why she's on medication and why they continue to mention her fragile condition.
Great job Jardinera, I forgot about the Nat blood test part. Sheesh, Amanda, you've been pregnant before and it hasn't even crossed your mind that it's a possibility? And Nat, surely you've missed a period?!? Wake up ladies.
Caye thinks he's so smart, cheating Rocio out of money. I am rooting for Isadora in this small part, but I'm hoping that she gets caught for all the murders before it's too late for the property to go back to the Albarrans. But I want Caye to realize what an idiot he really is.
Caye thinks he's so smart, cheating Rocio out of money. I am rooting for Isadora in this small part, but I'm hoping that she gets caught for all the murders before it's too late for the property to go back to the Albarrans. But I want Caye to realize what an idiot he really is.
To clarify my last comment, I didn't mean that I want Isa to get caught after it was too late for the property to go back to the Albarrans, but in time for it to go back to them.
Gracias Jardi! Over the top for an over the top epi. I could quote ad infinitum, but then, I might as well just read the whole thing over again. You are a genius!
This had got to be the best TN I've ever seen. So dense with complicated plot detail, such high-quality acting and directing, so unpredictable. Glad I don't have to fly off anywhere for a couple of months. Now I can sit tight and enjoy it with everybody else. The weekends are a treat. I keep checking in to see what everybody has to say. Never a dull moment. But of course, tomorrow night, I'll be watching Downton Abbey.
This had got to be the best TN I've ever seen. So dense with complicated plot detail, such high-quality acting and directing, so unpredictable. Glad I don't have to fly off anywhere for a couple of months. Now I can sit tight and enjoy it with everybody else. The weekends are a treat. I keep checking in to see what everybody has to say. Never a dull moment. But of course, tomorrow night, I'll be watching Downton Abbey.
Jardinera....It's already been said, but I'll say it again. You are a genius! Thank you for your incredible recap.
AB is the best novela on TV, and I'm clueless as to how this nightmare is going to be resolved for Dan & Cam. I want Dan to take Abe out to the courtyard of Malquerida and do to him what he did to Leoncerdo out there---beat the living bejesus out of him. Then I want to see Augustina dumped in a pool of icewater so that maybe she'll get a clue about her scumbag husband and grow up.
And Nat, going to have Yago's kid??? OMG!! I'm hoping she too wakes up and marries Rodolfo who really loves her.
The only thing I can't stand about AB is the presence of useless, smarmy Skankgirl. What purpose does she possible serve in this novela or on the planet???
AB is the best novela on TV, and I'm clueless as to how this nightmare is going to be resolved for Dan & Cam. I want Dan to take Abe out to the courtyard of Malquerida and do to him what he did to Leoncerdo out there---beat the living bejesus out of him. Then I want to see Augustina dumped in a pool of icewater so that maybe she'll get a clue about her scumbag husband and grow up.
And Nat, going to have Yago's kid??? OMG!! I'm hoping she too wakes up and marries Rodolfo who really loves her.
The only thing I can't stand about AB is the presence of useless, smarmy Skankgirl. What purpose does she possible serve in this novela or on the planet???
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 8:34:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 8:34:00 PM EST
How wonderful to come back home to tons of great comments and a fabulous Part 1. ITA Jardinera- you really channeled Viewerville's thoughts, and made them funny. Can't wait for the rest!
While we wait, here's a nice pic of the folks in our current love triangle: http://twitter.com/silvianavarro_/status/250331286844108800/photo/1
By the way, Lisset (Miriam) is Mexican, not Chilean, and the wife of Lisardo who played Agustin in CME, the villain obsessed with Renata (Silvia N).
And here’s a recent article in Mujeres Magazine on Silvia N. She’s the cover girl, and they do a nice interview with her. Flip through to page 27 for the article and maximize to read. http://issuu.com/publimetro_mexico/docs/20121213_mx_mujerespublimetro
While we wait, here's a nice pic of the folks in our current love triangle: http://twitter.com/silvianavarro_/status/250331286844108800/photo/1
By the way, Lisset (Miriam) is Mexican, not Chilean, and the wife of Lisardo who played Agustin in CME, the villain obsessed with Renata (Silvia N).
And here’s a recent article in Mujeres Magazine on Silvia N. She’s the cover girl, and they do a nice interview with her. Flip through to page 27 for the article and maximize to read. http://issuu.com/publimetro_mexico/docs/20121213_mx_mujerespublimetro
Jardinera - thanks for part one. Waiting with baited breathe for part two. I also enjoyed your description of Abe the snake. Though I did think he is now realizing Dio is not to be trusted but why drink to partnership? He takes one step forward and three back.
Marta in NY - you hit the nail on the head w/Gussy. Her desire to be right trumps all and it doesn't matter who she hurts (now her daughter) or what reality shows.
Anon207 - yes perfectly summed up Gussy's problems.
Carolina - thank you so much for sharing your info on second language acquisition. It took me a while to realize grasping the context was more important than word-for-word translation and this blog really helped me get over that. I still have to learn many basics of the language and your advice was helpful.
Agnes - OT/Downton Abbey did you see last week? Can you believe what happened? I'm shell-shocked again like I am here b/c of Miriam actually showing up.
Cayetonto - I'm hoping he has a near death experience b/c of Isa so he can see her for who she truly is. He'll have to apologize to his entire family for his foolishness.
Marta in NY - you hit the nail on the head w/Gussy. Her desire to be right trumps all and it doesn't matter who she hurts (now her daughter) or what reality shows.
Anon207 - yes perfectly summed up Gussy's problems.
Carolina - thank you so much for sharing your info on second language acquisition. It took me a while to realize grasping the context was more important than word-for-word translation and this blog really helped me get over that. I still have to learn many basics of the language and your advice was helpful.
Agnes - OT/Downton Abbey did you see last week? Can you believe what happened? I'm shell-shocked again like I am here b/c of Miriam actually showing up.
Cayetonto - I'm hoping he has a near death experience b/c of Isa so he can see her for who she truly is. He'll have to apologize to his entire family for his foolishness.
Parte Dos is up and ready. Glad you all enjoyed parte uno so much....je je. This week's episodio's has had my head spinning. Great stuff to recap and the team has really done it right! Thanks!!
Jardinera- The whole recap was wonderful. I appreciate you suggesting we all settle in with a bottle of aspirin and an adult beverage to deal with this painful love triangle. We certainly need it! I just feel so bad for all three of them.
Oh my gosh! That whole bedroom scene was SOOOO painful. Great description of Gussy as the Cheshire Cat. She was really enjoying seeing Dan squirm. And we saw the beginnings of Miriam questioning why everyone is acting so strange. She’ll only grow more aware of this as time passes, unless they all learn how to be better actors.
Loved, loved, loved Dan/CdlF and the baby. He’s really natural with her, and she also seemed to take to him. She was really chewing on his finger in the living room.
I’m glad Cami didn’t let Abe off the hook. I’m looking forward to seeing the rest of that conversation on Monday. Abe was definitely not on board with the way Dio was trying to steer the conversation at times. It should be very interesting to see how his character evolves and interacts with everyone else, including Dio.
Oh my gosh! That whole bedroom scene was SOOOO painful. Great description of Gussy as the Cheshire Cat. She was really enjoying seeing Dan squirm. And we saw the beginnings of Miriam questioning why everyone is acting so strange. She’ll only grow more aware of this as time passes, unless they all learn how to be better actors.
Loved, loved, loved Dan/CdlF and the baby. He’s really natural with her, and she also seemed to take to him. She was really chewing on his finger in the living room.
I’m glad Cami didn’t let Abe off the hook. I’m looking forward to seeing the rest of that conversation on Monday. Abe was definitely not on board with the way Dio was trying to steer the conversation at times. It should be very interesting to see how his character evolves and interacts with everyone else, including Dio.
Great recap, Jardinera. Excellent...as always.
There certainly was a lot of squirming, especially Dan and Abraham, but suddenly Augustina was firmly and clearly comfortably in her element.
How awkward and awful for all of us, but as I declared last week when the inevitable became inevitable, I'm backing Miriam. It's the right thing to do.
Shame on you, Abraham.
Welcome Chris,
If I were to recommend a single TN as must see, I would choose La Pola. It recently aired on Telefutura which is not as widely available as Univision but is, as I understand it, a part of the Univision family. La Pola is based on an historical heroic figure and is breathtaking.
My sentimental favorite is Un Gancho al Corazón. As far as I'm concerned it has one of the most talented collection of actors ever. Interestingly there are some here at Caray, Caray who would include it on their worst TN ever list.
Carlos
There certainly was a lot of squirming, especially Dan and Abraham, but suddenly Augustina was firmly and clearly comfortably in her element.
How awkward and awful for all of us, but as I declared last week when the inevitable became inevitable, I'm backing Miriam. It's the right thing to do.
Shame on you, Abraham.
Welcome Chris,
If I were to recommend a single TN as must see, I would choose La Pola. It recently aired on Telefutura which is not as widely available as Univision but is, as I understand it, a part of the Univision family. La Pola is based on an historical heroic figure and is breathtaking.
My sentimental favorite is Un Gancho al Corazón. As far as I'm concerned it has one of the most talented collection of actors ever. Interestingly there are some here at Caray, Caray who would include it on their worst TN ever list.
Carlos
Silvia Navarro attend casting for Mejia new novela, La Tempestad,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpCLYuWL6KY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpCLYuWL6KY
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:40:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:40:00 PM EST
http://www.latempestadtelenovela.blogspot.com.es/2013/01/video-presentacion-de-las-candidatas-en.html?m=1
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:51:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:51:00 PM EST
Thank you, Jardinera, for a brilliant recap. Really enjoyed all of it and especially:
“Viewerville reaches for the bottle of Excedrin on the coffee table and eats a few dry.”
“Dan knows he’s in it up to his neck and sinking fast. “
“She refuses to see it that way, which begs the question is she really a dildo head or just enjoys pretending to be one?”
I also loved the title.
Foxy, Mexicans are crazy about babies, no doubt about it.
Karen, glad to help.
“Viewerville reaches for the bottle of Excedrin on the coffee table and eats a few dry.”
“Dan knows he’s in it up to his neck and sinking fast. “
“She refuses to see it that way, which begs the question is she really a dildo head or just enjoys pretending to be one?”
I also loved the title.
Foxy, Mexicans are crazy about babies, no doubt about it.
Karen, glad to help.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:53:00 PM EST
: Saturday, February 2, 2013 at 10:53:00 PM EST
This was a hell of an episode and Jardinera, this is a great piece. I can't begin to name all the great lines.
Anon207, you nailed Gussie perfectly.
More tomorrow; I need to catch a few zzz's. More Beethoven tomorrow afternoon.
Anon207, you nailed Gussie perfectly.
More tomorrow; I need to catch a few zzz's. More Beethoven tomorrow afternoon.
J. - Inspired. "Cara de I'm f'd but good de Daniel" is an hilarious, excellent ending and summary of the situation!
Vivi - Thanks for link to article about and interview of SN. I enjoyed it.
To Downton buddies, looking forward to tomorrow night.
Vivi - Thanks for link to article about and interview of SN. I enjoyed it.
To Downton buddies, looking forward to tomorrow night.
Jardinera: thanks for the great recap. These past two eps certainly has been exhausting. Love the way you called the baby “little baby actress”.
I thought Vivi was taking an awfully long time to get to Cam considering how distraught she was.
Agustina’s gloating is grating. She’s going to get hers—and I hope we don’t have to wait until Ultimas Semanas.
I noticed Cam took off her necklace and not her wedding rings. And speaking of wedding rings. I would have thought Miriam would notice Dan isn’t wearing hers. He’s waved his hands in front of her face enough times.
I think Agustina is so blinded by her rejection from Don Daniel that she can’t bring herself to be fair to Dan.
Carlos: Agustina has shown flashes of intelligence before. She’s definitely not ENTIRELY stupid. She’s basically a good person so I hope, when it comes, her punishment for her blindness re: Dio will not be too horrific. But I do want to see her punished.
Myo: “but he always fail to anticipate that he can't control people's emotions and reactions.”—good observation. I also felt it was a little bit odd at how happily Dan was playing with the baby during some of their scenes together.
Vivi: Abe will definitely join the Scoobies if/when he finds out Dio sent Julian to kill Dan and got Miriam instead. Love of his sister has been his motivation for a lot of what he’s done.
I wondered why Nat and Amanda didn’t think Nat might be pregnant. Wouldn’t it be horrible if it turns out she’s not, but she’s gotten some fatal disease. Now wouldn’t we all feel really guilty for thinking they’re both a bit clueless?
LXV: Finally going to see Downtown Abbey soon. I’m now #2 on the cue at my library for Series one and #3 for Series two and have been recording the current one. Looking forward to it. I love Masterpiece Theatre.
AB would edge CME out of first place for my favorite TN, if it wasn’t for CdlF. I’ve never been able to be entirely on board with him.
Nanette
I thought Vivi was taking an awfully long time to get to Cam considering how distraught she was.
Agustina’s gloating is grating. She’s going to get hers—and I hope we don’t have to wait until Ultimas Semanas.
I noticed Cam took off her necklace and not her wedding rings. And speaking of wedding rings. I would have thought Miriam would notice Dan isn’t wearing hers. He’s waved his hands in front of her face enough times.
I think Agustina is so blinded by her rejection from Don Daniel that she can’t bring herself to be fair to Dan.
Carlos: Agustina has shown flashes of intelligence before. She’s definitely not ENTIRELY stupid. She’s basically a good person so I hope, when it comes, her punishment for her blindness re: Dio will not be too horrific. But I do want to see her punished.
Myo: “but he always fail to anticipate that he can't control people's emotions and reactions.”—good observation. I also felt it was a little bit odd at how happily Dan was playing with the baby during some of their scenes together.
Vivi: Abe will definitely join the Scoobies if/when he finds out Dio sent Julian to kill Dan and got Miriam instead. Love of his sister has been his motivation for a lot of what he’s done.
I wondered why Nat and Amanda didn’t think Nat might be pregnant. Wouldn’t it be horrible if it turns out she’s not, but she’s gotten some fatal disease. Now wouldn’t we all feel really guilty for thinking they’re both a bit clueless?
LXV: Finally going to see Downtown Abbey soon. I’m now #2 on the cue at my library for Series one and #3 for Series two and have been recording the current one. Looking forward to it. I love Masterpiece Theatre.
AB would edge CME out of first place for my favorite TN, if it wasn’t for CdlF. I’ve never been able to be entirely on board with him.
Nanette
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:08:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:08:00 AM EST
OT: Thanks to all for the tips on novela-learning.
Juanita, I had seen the site by Andrew before, but hadn't followed up. In fact, the squidoo site from Melinama looks familiar. Still, if I hadn't at least checked in at those sites, I might not have started watching telenovelas and found CarayCarary to be reminded of them again, now.
Vivi, I will be looking at Hulu options. I had't realized that there were telenovela on Hulu. Then again, I don't think I'd ever noticed anything not in English on Hulu. I assume you mean Hulu plus, the paid version, and I will look more deeply.
Carolina, I haven't even figured out how to get English subtitles on my current TV feed of AB via Verizon. It may be "in there" but I haven't found them. But, I think you're right, and I can safely continue to put off sorting out subtitle language issues.
I do have a version of Corazon Salvaje on DVD, but there are two fundamental problems. First, it is so severely edited down to under 4 hours that the "plot" just doesn't make sense. Second, the only subtitles available are in English, and that just doesn't really help in general. I have gone back and turned them on when I just couldn't get a clue what the dialog was, but as an ongoing proposition, I agree, it takes too much focus away from the Spanish.
As for the Spanish subtitles generally, they do sort of convert it from a listening experience to reading, and I can imagine coming to a stage where it would be better to "rewind" from time to time for the difficult bits, at this point I have great difficulty separating the sounds into specific words, much less sorting out the conjugations and such, and without the spanish subtitles, I get so lost, so fast, sigh.
Carlos, I suspect that some folks had the same reaction to the apparent boxing theme of at least the promos and early stages of Un Gancho that we've seen here to the bull-fighting.
La Pola looks very, very interesting. War and Peace should get such an extended treatment instead of being crammed into one regular movie! Unfortunately, while I was mentioning the chop-job done on Corazon Salvaje (a title suggested as a classic that would stand up to close viewing) LaPola seems to be only available on a $120 or so completely unedited version and even that only available from out of US providers I'm not familiar with. But I will poke around youtube, hulu, and such for it. Looks like there were 190+ episodes of that one. Wow.
BTW, I know that I said it would be too much effort for me to pay the kind of attention and take the kind of time necessary to apply the sorts of techniques that seem to be set out in the learn-spanish-by-telenovela sites and also keep up with AB and the conversation about it here in real time, but I do understand that that is exactly the type of time and commitment that the Recappers have made, and have been making, for years. Thank you, thank you.
Someone said something to the effect that sitting alone in the dark making snarky remarks about telenovelas was just sad, and while hyper-analyzing them in the pursuit of language acquistion may be less pitiful, it is pretty much just as lonely. While there is some positive effect to just casually watching more Spanish language programming, to add to the pedagogical value by being exposed to reflection on the show, and its language, well, that's just a bonus when it is just so much more fun watching the novela with CarayCaray in the first place.
Finally, my apologies to those wading through this when they were just looking for more comments based on Jardinera's fantastic recap.
Why I didn't post my questions about using the novelas for more structured educational purposes on the separate page about Destinos? I don't know. So, I'll be copying this over to that item, and invite anyone else with educational type comments to post there?
Chris in Florida
Juanita, I had seen the site by Andrew before, but hadn't followed up. In fact, the squidoo site from Melinama looks familiar. Still, if I hadn't at least checked in at those sites, I might not have started watching telenovelas and found CarayCarary to be reminded of them again, now.
Vivi, I will be looking at Hulu options. I had't realized that there were telenovela on Hulu. Then again, I don't think I'd ever noticed anything not in English on Hulu. I assume you mean Hulu plus, the paid version, and I will look more deeply.
Carolina, I haven't even figured out how to get English subtitles on my current TV feed of AB via Verizon. It may be "in there" but I haven't found them. But, I think you're right, and I can safely continue to put off sorting out subtitle language issues.
I do have a version of Corazon Salvaje on DVD, but there are two fundamental problems. First, it is so severely edited down to under 4 hours that the "plot" just doesn't make sense. Second, the only subtitles available are in English, and that just doesn't really help in general. I have gone back and turned them on when I just couldn't get a clue what the dialog was, but as an ongoing proposition, I agree, it takes too much focus away from the Spanish.
As for the Spanish subtitles generally, they do sort of convert it from a listening experience to reading, and I can imagine coming to a stage where it would be better to "rewind" from time to time for the difficult bits, at this point I have great difficulty separating the sounds into specific words, much less sorting out the conjugations and such, and without the spanish subtitles, I get so lost, so fast, sigh.
Carlos, I suspect that some folks had the same reaction to the apparent boxing theme of at least the promos and early stages of Un Gancho that we've seen here to the bull-fighting.
La Pola looks very, very interesting. War and Peace should get such an extended treatment instead of being crammed into one regular movie! Unfortunately, while I was mentioning the chop-job done on Corazon Salvaje (a title suggested as a classic that would stand up to close viewing) LaPola seems to be only available on a $120 or so completely unedited version and even that only available from out of US providers I'm not familiar with. But I will poke around youtube, hulu, and such for it. Looks like there were 190+ episodes of that one. Wow.
BTW, I know that I said it would be too much effort for me to pay the kind of attention and take the kind of time necessary to apply the sorts of techniques that seem to be set out in the learn-spanish-by-telenovela sites and also keep up with AB and the conversation about it here in real time, but I do understand that that is exactly the type of time and commitment that the Recappers have made, and have been making, for years. Thank you, thank you.
Someone said something to the effect that sitting alone in the dark making snarky remarks about telenovelas was just sad, and while hyper-analyzing them in the pursuit of language acquistion may be less pitiful, it is pretty much just as lonely. While there is some positive effect to just casually watching more Spanish language programming, to add to the pedagogical value by being exposed to reflection on the show, and its language, well, that's just a bonus when it is just so much more fun watching the novela with CarayCaray in the first place.
Finally, my apologies to those wading through this when they were just looking for more comments based on Jardinera's fantastic recap.
Why I didn't post my questions about using the novelas for more structured educational purposes on the separate page about Destinos? I don't know. So, I'll be copying this over to that item, and invite anyone else with educational type comments to post there?
Chris in Florida
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:18:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:18:00 AM EST
Chris: I have Verizon Fios and can't get English subtitles. When I asked an agent about it, they told me it wasn't available. I was thinking maybe it wasn't available on my box. Maybe one has to have an upgraded set top box. Don't know.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:26:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:26:00 AM EST
Highpoints:
Vivi talks Cam out of her sad mood (re: her mother) while getting ready for the wedding.
Aaron has wise words regarding love is for the living.
Ana is back.
Iago’s a skunk but he treats Ana well.
Don Dan’s poetic explanation of the importance of the charro suit.
Nice moment between Cam and Agustina when A. blesses her.
Stunning wedding gown.
Hat salute.
Beautiful wedding.
Dante and Dan have a joyous reunion.
Os gets in Dio’s face.
Agustina throws kisses to Cam at the reception.
Amanda warns Agustina about Dio and genuinely wishes she realize her mistake before it’s too late.
Amanda stands up to Dio.
Rodolfo’s thought bubble about loving Nat.
Nice to see Nat and Luz continue their friendship.
Cam constantly playing with her shawl.
Cayetano can’t tell Pablo he’s not his birth father.
Rodolfo calls off the plan with Ileana.
Nana does not put up with Rocio’s victim spiel.
Nana sees Dio with Isa.
Cayetano does the stand up thing and accepts Pablo as his “blood”. He also humbly states he hopes Pablo doesn’t reject him when he learns the truth.
Nana arrives to take care of our Luz.
Nat tells Dio she knows about some of his dirty dealings.
Pablo tells Rocio off—and GOOD.
Nat and Amanda make up.
Mariano tells Pablo he loves him just as much as before, that Caye still loves him and that he belongs.
Pablo shows maturity in his confrontation with Iago (who is years older than him).
Caye proposes to Isa.
Isa accepts.
Luz is in agreement with Pablo about moving. They are the perfect couple and I am jealous.
Pablo sacrifices his position in the family for that Rat B*****D brother of his. Pablo is a man. RB is a, well, mouse.
Mariano continues to let Pablo know he loves him.
Agustina is glad to see Cam whe she and Dan return from their honeymoon.
Cam welcomes Pablo to the family.
Cam tells Pablo he should have a stake in the ranch.
Cam is on board with Pablo and Luz’s idea and thought enough of Luz on her honeymoon to buy her maternity clothes.
Dan’s interactions with the baby.
Pablo supports Cam when Miriam shows up.
Our Luz wants to go to Cam to comfort her.
Caye thinks he won’t be hoodwinked by a woman again (HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! excuse me while I stop rolling on the floor). Caye has turned out to be the comedy relief in this TN.
Miriam’s finally realizing something’s not right at the hacienda. At least she’s not stupid.
Cam calls Abe out on his actions.
Dio is almost caught out re: the death certificate.
Abe seems a little suspicious of Dio.
Vivi talks Cam out of her sad mood (re: her mother) while getting ready for the wedding.
Aaron has wise words regarding love is for the living.
Ana is back.
Iago’s a skunk but he treats Ana well.
Don Dan’s poetic explanation of the importance of the charro suit.
Nice moment between Cam and Agustina when A. blesses her.
Stunning wedding gown.
Hat salute.
Beautiful wedding.
Dante and Dan have a joyous reunion.
Os gets in Dio’s face.
Agustina throws kisses to Cam at the reception.
Amanda warns Agustina about Dio and genuinely wishes she realize her mistake before it’s too late.
Amanda stands up to Dio.
Rodolfo’s thought bubble about loving Nat.
Nice to see Nat and Luz continue their friendship.
Cam constantly playing with her shawl.
Cayetano can’t tell Pablo he’s not his birth father.
Rodolfo calls off the plan with Ileana.
Nana does not put up with Rocio’s victim spiel.
Nana sees Dio with Isa.
Cayetano does the stand up thing and accepts Pablo as his “blood”. He also humbly states he hopes Pablo doesn’t reject him when he learns the truth.
Nana arrives to take care of our Luz.
Nat tells Dio she knows about some of his dirty dealings.
Pablo tells Rocio off—and GOOD.
Nat and Amanda make up.
Mariano tells Pablo he loves him just as much as before, that Caye still loves him and that he belongs.
Pablo shows maturity in his confrontation with Iago (who is years older than him).
Caye proposes to Isa.
Isa accepts.
Luz is in agreement with Pablo about moving. They are the perfect couple and I am jealous.
Pablo sacrifices his position in the family for that Rat B*****D brother of his. Pablo is a man. RB is a, well, mouse.
Mariano continues to let Pablo know he loves him.
Agustina is glad to see Cam whe she and Dan return from their honeymoon.
Cam welcomes Pablo to the family.
Cam tells Pablo he should have a stake in the ranch.
Cam is on board with Pablo and Luz’s idea and thought enough of Luz on her honeymoon to buy her maternity clothes.
Dan’s interactions with the baby.
Pablo supports Cam when Miriam shows up.
Our Luz wants to go to Cam to comfort her.
Caye thinks he won’t be hoodwinked by a woman again (HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! excuse me while I stop rolling on the floor). Caye has turned out to be the comedy relief in this TN.
Miriam’s finally realizing something’s not right at the hacienda. At least she’s not stupid.
Cam calls Abe out on his actions.
Dio is almost caught out re: the death certificate.
Abe seems a little suspicious of Dio.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:27:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:27:00 AM EST
Low Points:
Cam is sad getting ready for her wedding because Agustina is being a butthead about her marrying Dan.
Agustina is rude to Nat (blaming her for her parents “affair”—why am I not surprised?).
Iago lies to Mariano that he doesn’t have a relationship with Nat.
Iago ogles the stewardess (dude, you are NOT God’s gift).
Snotty Bitch CONTINUES to diss our Luz.
Agustina is pouty and sullen throughout the ceremony.
Dio hugs Cam. Creepy
Mariano has to tell Ana that her grand parents are separating and Nana is with Pablo and Luz. Poor kid loses a lot of family in one go.
Agustina has words with Amanda at the wedding.
Agustina is ungracious to Piedad regarding Luz staying in the house.
Nat decides not to take the secretary position at LMQ--leaving the way open for NG?
Iago tells Pablo he’s not an Alberran.
Fear Ileana may be about to go Fatal Attraction on Rodolfo.
Snotty Bitch continues to play the victim card.
Iago’s continuing skunkness. Iago is becoming the star of the LP list. Rat B*****D.
Isa wants to get married without anyone knowing so the La B boys won’t be able to stop it.
Nat might be pregnant.
How to put this? Hmmm. Miriam is alive.
Abe is a lying skunk. He DID tell Dan that Miriam was dead. We all in Viewerville SAW it. Damn his eyes.
Mariano is being a little too innocent regarding what his dad is doing.
Caye is trying to cheat Snotty Bitch out of everything.
Agustina gets a dig in at Dan re: being part of the family.
Cam’s heart is shattered.
Agustina can’t seem to manage to comfort her daughter because she’s too busy saying completely inappropriate things.
Abe keeps lying and lying and lying and why hasn’t his nose gotten longer.
Miriam keeps putting the screws to Dan by being so sweet and loving.
Caye is a freakin’ cad.
Isa is already starting to spend the Alberran’s boy’s inheritance.
Abe, the digusting, lying creep teams up with Dio, the disgusting, lying, DELUSIONAL creep (seriously, YOU’RE Cam’s only option? Have you forgotten the fair Mariano?)
Iago continues whining about being “a true Alberran”. I hate whiners.
Agustina’s gloating at Dan’s predicament.
Gussie gets on her freakin’ high horse (from which there will be a very long, hard fall in the future [a high point] demanding Dan leave LMQ.
Cam is sad getting ready for her wedding because Agustina is being a butthead about her marrying Dan.
Agustina is rude to Nat (blaming her for her parents “affair”—why am I not surprised?).
Iago lies to Mariano that he doesn’t have a relationship with Nat.
Iago ogles the stewardess (dude, you are NOT God’s gift).
Snotty Bitch CONTINUES to diss our Luz.
Agustina is pouty and sullen throughout the ceremony.
Dio hugs Cam. Creepy
Mariano has to tell Ana that her grand parents are separating and Nana is with Pablo and Luz. Poor kid loses a lot of family in one go.
Agustina has words with Amanda at the wedding.
Agustina is ungracious to Piedad regarding Luz staying in the house.
Nat decides not to take the secretary position at LMQ--leaving the way open for NG?
Iago tells Pablo he’s not an Alberran.
Fear Ileana may be about to go Fatal Attraction on Rodolfo.
Snotty Bitch continues to play the victim card.
Iago’s continuing skunkness. Iago is becoming the star of the LP list. Rat B*****D.
Isa wants to get married without anyone knowing so the La B boys won’t be able to stop it.
Nat might be pregnant.
How to put this? Hmmm. Miriam is alive.
Abe is a lying skunk. He DID tell Dan that Miriam was dead. We all in Viewerville SAW it. Damn his eyes.
Mariano is being a little too innocent regarding what his dad is doing.
Caye is trying to cheat Snotty Bitch out of everything.
Agustina gets a dig in at Dan re: being part of the family.
Cam’s heart is shattered.
Agustina can’t seem to manage to comfort her daughter because she’s too busy saying completely inappropriate things.
Abe keeps lying and lying and lying and why hasn’t his nose gotten longer.
Miriam keeps putting the screws to Dan by being so sweet and loving.
Caye is a freakin’ cad.
Isa is already starting to spend the Alberran’s boy’s inheritance.
Abe, the digusting, lying creep teams up with Dio, the disgusting, lying, DELUSIONAL creep (seriously, YOU’RE Cam’s only option? Have you forgotten the fair Mariano?)
Iago continues whining about being “a true Alberran”. I hate whiners.
Agustina’s gloating at Dan’s predicament.
Gussie gets on her freakin’ high horse (from which there will be a very long, hard fall in the future [a high point] demanding Dan leave LMQ.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:28:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:28:00 AM EST
Great recap Jardinera! Great H-L Nanette! Great comments everyone!
What do you think will happen when Miriam sees Rafa? Do you think she will try to be friends with Vivi, to be couple friends since Rafa was their friend in Chile?
I want to see the next Cam and Dan scene. He shares his deepest feelings with her so that should be interesting. I would think that they would just break down in each other's arms.
Dan's love for Cam seems to trump Miriam. I like the line that someone posted yesterday about Dan being a serial monogomist. He is feeling something for Miriam, but not enough to physically or emotionally "cheat on" Cam.
What do you think will happen when Miriam sees Rafa? Do you think she will try to be friends with Vivi, to be couple friends since Rafa was their friend in Chile?
I want to see the next Cam and Dan scene. He shares his deepest feelings with her so that should be interesting. I would think that they would just break down in each other's arms.
Dan's love for Cam seems to trump Miriam. I like the line that someone posted yesterday about Dan being a serial monogomist. He is feeling something for Miriam, but not enough to physically or emotionally "cheat on" Cam.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 1:23:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 1:23:00 AM EST
Chris, don't worry if you feel like you are doing more reading than listening; that's normal. Keep at it and you will find that you are understanding more and more from listening. I can see my progress when I watch an episode on youtube every now and then, or you could just turn off the Spanish captions and rewatch an episode to see your improvement over time.
And don't worry if you are having trouble distinguishing word boundaries, that is completely normal at the early stages, too. Reading and listening simultaneously is perhaps the best practice that exists for helping you get past that.
And don't worry if you are having trouble distinguishing word boundaries, that is completely normal at the early stages, too. Reading and listening simultaneously is perhaps the best practice that exists for helping you get past that.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 2:47:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 2:47:00 AM EST
Re. Augustina: That's one fugly sweater she be wearing. Wowsie.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 2:52:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 2:52:00 AM EST
Jardinera, thanks for the great recap. I loved your following remarks:
"I have two words for Mariano: incompetency trial!" and
" she remembers all her memorable moments with Daniel in the buff and in the boudoir. She cries enough tears to drown out the fire and moans that she simply won’t be able to live without him! (Whew! After reliving scenes like those, I can totally relate!)".
Gussie has truly shined these 2 episodes. I too loved her wry observation of yesterday when she pointed out that Daniel had adapted so well that he was like family. LOL! And, she continued to excel in her role as the person who has run the household the past four years she has lived at MQ when she was so graciously helpful in Miriam's accommodations. Gussie is relentless in trying to protect Camila from threats she perceives will hurt her daughter such a lying, deceitful man that she herself trusted and who has brought a world of hurt to her daughter today. You go girl!
Nanette, "I've decided to like Miriam. I think it will lead to a more interesting viewing, if I'm conflicted." Funny but true!
And, the absolutely BEST comment of the past 2 days is Variopinta's:
"I hate when people drop by w/o calling 1st."
"I have two words for Mariano: incompetency trial!" and
" she remembers all her memorable moments with Daniel in the buff and in the boudoir. She cries enough tears to drown out the fire and moans that she simply won’t be able to live without him! (Whew! After reliving scenes like those, I can totally relate!)".
Gussie has truly shined these 2 episodes. I too loved her wry observation of yesterday when she pointed out that Daniel had adapted so well that he was like family. LOL! And, she continued to excel in her role as the person who has run the household the past four years she has lived at MQ when she was so graciously helpful in Miriam's accommodations. Gussie is relentless in trying to protect Camila from threats she perceives will hurt her daughter such a lying, deceitful man that she herself trusted and who has brought a world of hurt to her daughter today. You go girl!
Nanette, "I've decided to like Miriam. I think it will lead to a more interesting viewing, if I'm conflicted." Funny but true!
And, the absolutely BEST comment of the past 2 days is Variopinta's:
"I hate when people drop by w/o calling 1st."
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 2:59:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 2:59:00 AM EST
Barbara, I agree with you about Gussie, but we are clearly in the minority around here.
However, that sweater alone merits at least a teapot to be dropped on her. ;)
Also agree about Variopinta's comment. The BEST.
However, that sweater alone merits at least a teapot to be dropped on her. ;)
Also agree about Variopinta's comment. The BEST.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:09:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:09:00 AM EST
Carolina, Mark Twain said,
“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.” :)
“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.” :)
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:32:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:32:00 AM EST
I love Mark Twain. :)
And I think it's a really tough crowd here when it comes to mothers. I know a heck of a lot of people who would trade their mala moms for Gussie in a heartbeat. That tends to make me a bit more forgiving towards her.
And I think it's a really tough crowd here when it comes to mothers. I know a heck of a lot of people who would trade their mala moms for Gussie in a heartbeat. That tends to make me a bit more forgiving towards her.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:37:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:37:00 AM EST
EXCEPT FOR THAT SWEATER.
It's a crime against fashion!
It's a crime against fashion!
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:38:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:38:00 AM EST
Nanette: I always have to stop and read those H/L lists of yours. This week I chose these as the best combo's:
"How to put this? Hmmm. Miriam is alive./Cam’s heart is shattered."
....and.....
"Don Dan’s poetic explanation of the importance of the charro suit./Hat salute."
IMNSHO this one belongs in the L's. (Je-Je-Je.)
Caye proposes to Isa.
Isa accepts.
"How to put this? Hmmm. Miriam is alive./Cam’s heart is shattered."
....and.....
"Don Dan’s poetic explanation of the importance of the charro suit./Hat salute."
IMNSHO this one belongs in the L's. (Je-Je-Je.)
Caye proposes to Isa.
Isa accepts.
IMHO Abe has very possibly gotten what he was after where Dan is concerned. He needed to find a way to get Dan out of his sister's life. So, the escape to Mexico along with the belief that his wife and child were dead and the 9-12 months of getting to know Cami, living and working with her day-to-day, have all managed to accomplish that goal. Dan may love Miriam still, but it's not the passionate love a man has for his wife, it's probably mellowed and now is more brotherly in nature. He's transferred that passion to the more immediate and that means Camila. Something tells me he'll come to face that and explain it in those terms to Miriam eventually. So, now that Abe sees how delicate Miriam is, he'll recognize how he's made things worse at this point for her emotionally.
Nanette- Gracias amiga for the HPLP list. Wow! What a week. We started off the week with Cam and Dan getting married, and ended with them both in emotional turmoil and in an invalid marriage due to the unexpected arrival of the Chileans. And of course Pablo and Nat’s paternal dramas, and Cayetonto falling completely into Isa’s trap. What will next week bring?
I am also on Team Miriam, in that I want her to be told the truth, and I think she deserves to be with a man who is as madly in love with her as she is with him. But that man isn’t Dan anymore.
Gussy’s sweater was a character all on its own these last episodes. I noticed that her hair was extra spiky too, making her look like a porcupine or some other bristly creature ready to wound a perceived enemy—Dan.
I am also on Team Miriam, in that I want her to be told the truth, and I think she deserves to be with a man who is as madly in love with her as she is with him. But that man isn’t Dan anymore.
Gussy’s sweater was a character all on its own these last episodes. I noticed that her hair was extra spiky too, making her look like a porcupine or some other bristly creature ready to wound a perceived enemy—Dan.
Judging by Univision’s latest ratings, we are obviously not the only non-Hispanics/Latinos watching telenovelas. See the following news on ratings last week.
Univision Ranked #2 In Adults 18-34 Last Week In Primetime:
For the entire primetime ratings week (January 21-27, 2013), Univision ranked #2 among Adults 18-34, out-delivering ABC, NBC, and CBS. Also, for the third consecutive Friday, the network ranked #1 on Friday among Adults 18-34 and Adults 18-49.
At 8 p.m., Univision’s novela POR ELLA SOY EVA (For Her, I’m Eva) helped Univision rank as the #2 network for the hour (M-F) among Adults 18-34 and #3 for Adults 18-49. POR ELLA SOY EVA averaged 4.3 Million Total Viewers 2+, 2.3 Million Adults 18-49, and 1.1 Million Adults 18-34.
Univision’s 9 p.m. novela AMORES VERDADEROS (True Love) helped Univision rank as the #3 network among Adults 18-34 and #4 for Adults 18-49 for the hour (M-F). AMORES VERDADEROS averaged 5.0 Million Total Viewers 2+, 2.8 Million Adults 18-49, and 1.3 Million Adults 18-34.
Univision’s 10 p.m. novela AMOR BRAVIO (Fierce Love) helped Univision rank as the #1 network for the hour (M-F) among Adults 18-34 and #3 for Adults 18-49. AMOR BRAVIO averaged 3.9 Million Total Viewers 2+, 2.0 Million Adults 18-49, and 904,000 Adults 18-34.
Univision Ranked #2 In Adults 18-34 Last Week In Primetime:
For the entire primetime ratings week (January 21-27, 2013), Univision ranked #2 among Adults 18-34, out-delivering ABC, NBC, and CBS. Also, for the third consecutive Friday, the network ranked #1 on Friday among Adults 18-34 and Adults 18-49.
At 8 p.m., Univision’s novela POR ELLA SOY EVA (For Her, I’m Eva) helped Univision rank as the #2 network for the hour (M-F) among Adults 18-34 and #3 for Adults 18-49. POR ELLA SOY EVA averaged 4.3 Million Total Viewers 2+, 2.3 Million Adults 18-49, and 1.1 Million Adults 18-34.
Univision’s 9 p.m. novela AMORES VERDADEROS (True Love) helped Univision rank as the #3 network among Adults 18-34 and #4 for Adults 18-49 for the hour (M-F). AMORES VERDADEROS averaged 5.0 Million Total Viewers 2+, 2.8 Million Adults 18-49, and 1.3 Million Adults 18-34.
Univision’s 10 p.m. novela AMOR BRAVIO (Fierce Love) helped Univision rank as the #1 network for the hour (M-F) among Adults 18-34 and #3 for Adults 18-49. AMOR BRAVIO averaged 3.9 Million Total Viewers 2+, 2.0 Million Adults 18-49, and 904,000 Adults 18-34.
Jardinera, I agree that Daniel was being too gentlemanly with Augustina. Her Karmageddon can't come soon enough for me over this.
While I think she knows she screwed up in marrying Francisco Javier, she can't face even the possibility that Camila could improve on that. She is also running away from the reality that she has screwed up again.
Even without knowing that El Diablo is a criminal she is accepting unacceptable treatment from him. He treats her badly, ignores her needs (sexual and otherwise), and insults her. He hasn't done any of this in public, so any accusation she could make against him would be ignored by anyone who doesn't know more about him. She has ignored every warning about him.
At this rate I'm not sure there is anything in the universe that would convince her he is rotten to the core.
Is it possible that she also envies Camila's intelligence and her independent nature?
Regarding Univision's ratings: I completely believe we are not the only gringos who watch them. However, they get the lion's share of Hispanics because they have the most popular series and because there are fewer viewing choices for people who like their entertainment en espanol. The Spanish Premium Tier that I pay an extra $5 a month for to Time Warner consists of channels that are not universally available.
While I think she knows she screwed up in marrying Francisco Javier, she can't face even the possibility that Camila could improve on that. She is also running away from the reality that she has screwed up again.
Even without knowing that El Diablo is a criminal she is accepting unacceptable treatment from him. He treats her badly, ignores her needs (sexual and otherwise), and insults her. He hasn't done any of this in public, so any accusation she could make against him would be ignored by anyone who doesn't know more about him. She has ignored every warning about him.
At this rate I'm not sure there is anything in the universe that would convince her he is rotten to the core.
Is it possible that she also envies Camila's intelligence and her independent nature?
Regarding Univision's ratings: I completely believe we are not the only gringos who watch them. However, they get the lion's share of Hispanics because they have the most popular series and because there are fewer viewing choices for people who like their entertainment en espanol. The Spanish Premium Tier that I pay an extra $5 a month for to Time Warner consists of channels that are not universally available.
UA - I'm with you on regarding Gussy. Even if she doesn't believe what so many have told her, Dio treats her like crap so what's up with that? And I do think she's jealous of her own daughter's independence and strength of character, someone who refuses to take crap from a man.
Vivi - Totally agree on Miriam needs to be told what's going on. Of course, I have the feeling that they're going to drag this out for weeks....not sure I can take it...haha.
Vivi - Totally agree on Miriam needs to be told what's going on. Of course, I have the feeling that they're going to drag this out for weeks....not sure I can take it...haha.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 9:50:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 9:50:00 AM EST
I think that Dan will not be able to even sleep in the same bed as Miriam, so she's going to figure this out pretty quickly. I hope the truth gets told pretty quickly too.
That retirement scam that Aggie sold will also come to light and she can't NOT blame Dion for that. That's all him and she knows it. But knowing Dion, he will tell her that he was scammed by it too, but since her name is on everything, she's the one who has to go to jail for it, but he will work on her defense while she's in there. And he promises to get her out as soon as he can, lol.
That retirement scam that Aggie sold will also come to light and she can't NOT blame Dion for that. That's all him and she knows it. But knowing Dion, he will tell her that he was scammed by it too, but since her name is on everything, she's the one who has to go to jail for it, but he will work on her defense while she's in there. And he promises to get her out as soon as he can, lol.
Uuf! so many comments! What a lively weekend community. I love it! Kind of glad I haven't stumbled across something like this for Downton Abbey or I would never get off my butt.
@Chris: Welcome! Carolina is right when she says, "...don't worry if you are having trouble distinguishing word boundaries, that is completely normal at the early stages, too. Reading and listening simultaneously is perhaps the best practice that exists for helping you get past that."
Also, pay attention to the ads. You will see/hear the same thing over and over again, ad infinitum. Repeat them out loud to yourself. Eventually, they will be burned in your memory, and guess what? you'll be able to speak complete Spanish sentences, perfectly inflected and with expression & correct intonation. Then, when you need to form a construction in conversation, it will be there for you. You just change out the particulars. (Not that ads are perfectly grammatical, but they are colloquial.)
As for War and Peace, the Russian version is 16 hours long. Those people wouldn't let anyone mess with a single line of their Tolstoy.
@Nanette: Muchas gracias for your H-L lists. I also thought Vivi was taking way too long fussing with her dangly earrings when Cami was in such obvious distress.
@Jardinera: "So, now that Abe sees how delicate Miriam is, he'll recognize how he's made things worse at this point for her emotionally." Agreed! (and gracias for parte dos)
—Agnes in NJ
@Chris: Welcome! Carolina is right when she says, "...don't worry if you are having trouble distinguishing word boundaries, that is completely normal at the early stages, too. Reading and listening simultaneously is perhaps the best practice that exists for helping you get past that."
Also, pay attention to the ads. You will see/hear the same thing over and over again, ad infinitum. Repeat them out loud to yourself. Eventually, they will be burned in your memory, and guess what? you'll be able to speak complete Spanish sentences, perfectly inflected and with expression & correct intonation. Then, when you need to form a construction in conversation, it will be there for you. You just change out the particulars. (Not that ads are perfectly grammatical, but they are colloquial.)
As for War and Peace, the Russian version is 16 hours long. Those people wouldn't let anyone mess with a single line of their Tolstoy.
@Nanette: Muchas gracias for your H-L lists. I also thought Vivi was taking way too long fussing with her dangly earrings when Cami was in such obvious distress.
@Jardinera: "So, now that Abe sees how delicate Miriam is, he'll recognize how he's made things worse at this point for her emotionally." Agreed! (and gracias for parte dos)
—Agnes in NJ
Jardinera - Fabulissimo recap of everything in this jam-packed episode. Thanks for all the details and the vocab, especially "darse de santos."
On Dan playing with his daughter, in the midst of all that anguish I too would retreat in the delight of suddenly having a baby. Most men in his circumstance would've probably gone to the bar and had a stiff drink.
On Dan playing with his daughter, in the midst of all that anguish I too would retreat in the delight of suddenly having a baby. Most men in his circumstance would've probably gone to the bar and had a stiff drink.
I'm sure that's what Iago will do when Natalia gets her bad news.
I was quite surprised when Mariano didn't remind his father about how Hissadora was Duena for a Moment at LMQ and what she tried to do to it and its people. But that might be just as useless as anyone trying to talk reason to Gussie.
I was quite surprised when Mariano didn't remind his father about how Hissadora was Duena for a Moment at LMQ and what she tried to do to it and its people. But that might be just as useless as anyone trying to talk reason to Gussie.
I'm thinking the only way to resolve the Miriam/Camila situation without having Miriam die is for her to fall in love with someone else when she fully realizes Dan's not feeling it for her.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 10:30:00 AM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 10:30:00 AM EST
Nanette, I loved your H-L list, especially "Abe keeps lying and lying and lying and why hasn’t his nose gotten longer" and "Gussie gets on her freakin’ high horse (from which there will be a very long, hard fall in the future [a high point] demanding Dan leave LMQ." However, I had the same thought as Jardinera that the following two belong on the LOW list:
Caye proposes to Isa.
Isa accepts.
I'm not sure what people mean when they say they're on Miriam's side. Do they want Dan to leave Camila?? That's not what I want, and I suspect that that's not what the TN writers have in store for us. I think they've made Miriam seem unperceptive and excessively saccharine so that our loyalties remain with Camila. That's not to say that I want something bad to happen to Miriam. ¡Para nada! I hope she soon understands what the situation is, and I also hope that Dante will win her love, as he had wished long ago. She deserves someone who can passionately and unambivalently love her, and that person is no longer Dan.
For me, the fly in this ointment is the baby. I haven't figured out how the writers will handle this. But that's one of the things I love about this TN: it keeps me guessing.
Caye proposes to Isa.
Isa accepts.
I'm not sure what people mean when they say they're on Miriam's side. Do they want Dan to leave Camila?? That's not what I want, and I suspect that that's not what the TN writers have in store for us. I think they've made Miriam seem unperceptive and excessively saccharine so that our loyalties remain with Camila. That's not to say that I want something bad to happen to Miriam. ¡Para nada! I hope she soon understands what the situation is, and I also hope that Dante will win her love, as he had wished long ago. She deserves someone who can passionately and unambivalently love her, and that person is no longer Dan.
For me, the fly in this ointment is the baby. I haven't figured out how the writers will handle this. But that's one of the things I love about this TN: it keeps me guessing.
A couple of quick thoughts on the good conversations about language learning and novelas and about Agustina.
My Spanish has improved a thousand percent with novelas, doing some of the tricks over the years that are recommended in the great sites that Vivi posted. I recommend novelas always to friends trying to learn Spanish; unfortunately, not everyone gets hooked on the stories! The small suggestion I would add is that watching even 15 minutes of the news a couple of times a week is a great supplement to the novelas. The announcers speak clear, non-idomatic Spanish, mild accents, etc. If nothing else, it will show you far you've come in understanding Spanish as a result of the more linguistically challenging novela watching.
Agustina is a class and status snob, not as bad as Rocio, but with many of the same prejudices. She is occasionally very gracious and kind (she was nice to Pablo the other night), but always within the limits of the role of the hacienda duena, a role she hoped to formalize with Daniel the tio. Amanda has many important roles in this story, including as a counter type to Agustina; Amanda is warm and free of these class prejudices and narrow expectations. She was smart enough to escape Dio and embrace Osvaldo, too.
My Spanish has improved a thousand percent with novelas, doing some of the tricks over the years that are recommended in the great sites that Vivi posted. I recommend novelas always to friends trying to learn Spanish; unfortunately, not everyone gets hooked on the stories! The small suggestion I would add is that watching even 15 minutes of the news a couple of times a week is a great supplement to the novelas. The announcers speak clear, non-idomatic Spanish, mild accents, etc. If nothing else, it will show you far you've come in understanding Spanish as a result of the more linguistically challenging novela watching.
Agustina is a class and status snob, not as bad as Rocio, but with many of the same prejudices. She is occasionally very gracious and kind (she was nice to Pablo the other night), but always within the limits of the role of the hacienda duena, a role she hoped to formalize with Daniel the tio. Amanda has many important roles in this story, including as a counter type to Agustina; Amanda is warm and free of these class prejudices and narrow expectations. She was smart enough to escape Dio and embrace Osvaldo, too.
Chris in FL-
Some more thoughts on learning Spanish. Not sure if you took actual classes to learn, I started with that, taking classes at the local community college. Then I started to read simple books, and I don't mean children's books, I can't stand those. I read Harlequin Romances in spanish. I was able to get them at my library. They are not great novels, but at least they are for adults, and they are in very simple Spanish, so the vocab wasn't so hard to grasp. Usually I could skip over the words I didn't know because I could grasp the meaning by the context, but on the rare times I couldn't, I just looked them up. You would be amazed at how quickly you get better at reading by reading those kind of books. They use everyday language that most people use and they don't use big or unusual words very much. And eventually you will be able to read them without having to constantly translate everything in your mind because the words will become so familiar to you, that you can just know their meanings without literally translating them to English first.
It also helped me to watch the TNs with spanish ccs. Once I started doing that, i.e. reading the ccs while hearing the words spoken, my listening comprehension soared. I noticed that as I took a spanish conversation class. I could follow a conversation in Spanish so much better. Now I can watch a TN online, and get most of what is being said, although there are the mumblers and I rarely get what they say. This TN doesn't have very many mumblers, except Camila. She can mumble with the best of them.
Some more thoughts on learning Spanish. Not sure if you took actual classes to learn, I started with that, taking classes at the local community college. Then I started to read simple books, and I don't mean children's books, I can't stand those. I read Harlequin Romances in spanish. I was able to get them at my library. They are not great novels, but at least they are for adults, and they are in very simple Spanish, so the vocab wasn't so hard to grasp. Usually I could skip over the words I didn't know because I could grasp the meaning by the context, but on the rare times I couldn't, I just looked them up. You would be amazed at how quickly you get better at reading by reading those kind of books. They use everyday language that most people use and they don't use big or unusual words very much. And eventually you will be able to read them without having to constantly translate everything in your mind because the words will become so familiar to you, that you can just know their meanings without literally translating them to English first.
It also helped me to watch the TNs with spanish ccs. Once I started doing that, i.e. reading the ccs while hearing the words spoken, my listening comprehension soared. I noticed that as I took a spanish conversation class. I could follow a conversation in Spanish so much better. Now I can watch a TN online, and get most of what is being said, although there are the mumblers and I rarely get what they say. This TN doesn't have very many mumblers, except Camila. She can mumble with the best of them.
One more thought: I didn't like seeing El Diablo present at the meeting of Camila and Abe. She has to know that he has manipulated the situation somewhat.
And here's hoping that Abe can get his brain cells back and be a detective.
Finally (since I have to go out again) one more comment on brains: How can El Diablo hope to erase Camila's brain? Because that is what he would have to do to get her to be with him (especially since he still intends to bump uglies with Hissadora).
And here's hoping that Abe can get his brain cells back and be a detective.
Finally (since I have to go out again) one more comment on brains: How can El Diablo hope to erase Camila's brain? Because that is what he would have to do to get her to be with him (especially since he still intends to bump uglies with Hissadora).
Great stuff Jardinera, como de costumbre & a tough episode.
I might not be able to wait until Mon.to continue this mess.
When Augustina 1st met (ran into) "Andres" she thought he was wonderful.
She is cut of the same cloth as Rocio, a lowly chofer getting it on with her daughter! I can understand some concern about the past lies, but Auggie is too dense to understand the reason, mainly due to her blindness about Dionicio. She definitely has tunnel vision. She's like a kid, "neh, neh, neh, neh, neh. How do you spell neh?
Abe says he not corrupt, I disagree. He throws Daniel in la carcel w/o proof & lies to him about Miriam & bebe, that's corruption. Wait until he finds out Dionicio is responsible for almost killing his sister.
Dante had a thing for Miriam b/f Daniel, maybe that's why he is in Mex I bet.
Pablo is a rock.
I don't like any of my favorites to work for Mejia, he is just awful, remember Corozon Salvaje 2009, he messed that one up so bad they changed the time to midnight. And the worse novela "Fuego en la sangre". We are faced with Mejia after AB,"Que bonito amor"
Univision has some kind of deal with ABC. I just saw Jorge Ramos on Geo Stephanpoulus.
I might not be able to wait until Mon.to continue this mess.
When Augustina 1st met (ran into) "Andres" she thought he was wonderful.
She is cut of the same cloth as Rocio, a lowly chofer getting it on with her daughter! I can understand some concern about the past lies, but Auggie is too dense to understand the reason, mainly due to her blindness about Dionicio. She definitely has tunnel vision. She's like a kid, "neh, neh, neh, neh, neh. How do you spell neh?
Abe says he not corrupt, I disagree. He throws Daniel in la carcel w/o proof & lies to him about Miriam & bebe, that's corruption. Wait until he finds out Dionicio is responsible for almost killing his sister.
Dante had a thing for Miriam b/f Daniel, maybe that's why he is in Mex I bet.
Pablo is a rock.
I don't like any of my favorites to work for Mejia, he is just awful, remember Corozon Salvaje 2009, he messed that one up so bad they changed the time to midnight. And the worse novela "Fuego en la sangre". We are faced with Mejia after AB,"Que bonito amor"
Univision has some kind of deal with ABC. I just saw Jorge Ramos on Geo Stephanpoulus.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:08:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 12:08:00 PM EST
Anon- I also hope that SN is not chosen for, or chooses, the new Mejia project with WL. Although both SN and WL play tender and playful well, and are also great criers, so it might be interesting to see them together on screen. I can't quite picture them playing a couple though-- maybe siblings.
We'll see how Que Boninto Amor turns out. I haven't heard anything about how it's being received in Mexico. I'm sure it will get many viewers here because Jorge S. and Pablo M. are favorites with a lot of fans. But people really loved Hija de Mariachi, and I'm not sure if it really needed to be remade so soon. I also don't get how it will be set in Mexico, since the whole point was that the galan was on the run from Mexico, and in a place where mariachi music was exotic.
We'll see how Que Boninto Amor turns out. I haven't heard anything about how it's being received in Mexico. I'm sure it will get many viewers here because Jorge S. and Pablo M. are favorites with a lot of fans. But people really loved Hija de Mariachi, and I'm not sure if it really needed to be remade so soon. I also don't get how it will be set in Mexico, since the whole point was that the galan was on the run from Mexico, and in a place where mariachi music was exotic.
Anon,
"Dante had a thing for Miriam b/f Daniel, maybe that's why he is in Mex I bet."
Didn't Dante also believe that Miriam was dead? If not, then he should have told Daniel before the wedding that she is alive.
Carlos
"Dante had a thing for Miriam b/f Daniel, maybe that's why he is in Mex I bet."
Didn't Dante also believe that Miriam was dead? If not, then he should have told Daniel before the wedding that she is alive.
Carlos
Vivi,
I got the impression that Sylvia Navarro is going to play the bad girl in La Tempestad. I think that would be fun.
Carlos
I got the impression that Sylvia Navarro is going to play the bad girl in La Tempestad. I think that would be fun.
Carlos
Oooh! That would be fun Carlos. I still don't know if I'd subject her to Mejia just to see her play a bad girl.
Vivi (and probably everyone else here as well),
Is Salvador Mejía really all that bad? I loved La Madrastra and didn't we have a blast here with FELS?
Here's a link about SN's participation.
Carlos
Is Salvador Mejía really all that bad? I loved La Madrastra and didn't we have a blast here with FELS?
Here's a link about SN's participation.
Carlos
LOL Carlos! While Mejia provides us with majorly snark-worthy gems that are LOTS of fun to comment on, I'm not sure I want SN in a tn that will be prominently featured on the Soup, as La Madrastra, FELS, Triunfo, and Corazon Salvaje (2009) were.
To Chris and anyone else looking to improve their listening comprehension and general Spanish skills, this site is very helpful:
http://www.newsinslowspanish.com/
There are some sample materials for free and then quite reasonable prices to subscribe.
http://www.newsinslowspanish.com/
There are some sample materials for free and then quite reasonable prices to subscribe.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 1:14:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 1:14:00 PM EST
FIRST--Jardinera, thanks for getting us through a truly awful episode. Thank goodness there are some threads of hope for Camila and Daniel. You told the story in the best light possible. I was actually able to sleep Friday night.
SECOND--As promised, I am preparing a new Posting for Nanette's HPLP lists since she began creating them. It'll be titled Operation Shine the Light, Part II.
SECOND--As promised, I am preparing a new Posting for Nanette's HPLP lists since she began creating them. It'll be titled Operation Shine the Light, Part II.
Is it possible that she also envies Camila's intelligence and her independent nature?
--------------------
No, I don't think Augustina envies Camila's intelligence/nature (I think she admires it). But I do think Augustina envies Camila's social position and luck with men. Camila has had SIX men sniffing around her on this show.
The man Augustina really wanted sniffing her never would & the rest were just using her. She didn't want Osvaldo b/c he wasn't exciting enough.
Camila didn't care about losing her social position to shack up with the choffer. Social position is something Augustina values since she only has it through Camila. She was only able to live at LMQ after her first husband's death because of Don Daniel's affection for Camila (and I'm sure Amparo lobbied for Augustina to be able to stay, too). She is only able to be choffered around and boss the staff around & meet Dionisio because Camila is the duena of LMQ.
All she has is because of Camila & Cami's relationship with Daniel threatens that.
Also, Augustina feels that Daniel is *that one* who will take Camila away from her. She had no such concerns about Alonso & Luis taking Camila away from her because they wouldn't. But Camila would give up everything for Daniel, including Augustina and she knows that.
So there's nothing Daniel can do to make Augustina accept him because he'll always be the person who took Camila away from her. The only way she'll ever accept him is to realize that he & Camila were RIGHT about Dionisio & were/are trying to protect her from him.
--------------------
No, I don't think Augustina envies Camila's intelligence/nature (I think she admires it). But I do think Augustina envies Camila's social position and luck with men. Camila has had SIX men sniffing around her on this show.
The man Augustina really wanted sniffing her never would & the rest were just using her. She didn't want Osvaldo b/c he wasn't exciting enough.
Camila didn't care about losing her social position to shack up with the choffer. Social position is something Augustina values since she only has it through Camila. She was only able to live at LMQ after her first husband's death because of Don Daniel's affection for Camila (and I'm sure Amparo lobbied for Augustina to be able to stay, too). She is only able to be choffered around and boss the staff around & meet Dionisio because Camila is the duena of LMQ.
All she has is because of Camila & Cami's relationship with Daniel threatens that.
Also, Augustina feels that Daniel is *that one* who will take Camila away from her. She had no such concerns about Alonso & Luis taking Camila away from her because they wouldn't. But Camila would give up everything for Daniel, including Augustina and she knows that.
So there's nothing Daniel can do to make Augustina accept him because he'll always be the person who took Camila away from her. The only way she'll ever accept him is to realize that he & Camila were RIGHT about Dionisio & were/are trying to protect her from him.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 1:57:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 1:57:00 PM EST
Just weighing in for Chris in FL and telenovela viewing/learning:
To us it is worth the $7.99/month for HuluPlus and access to recent Univision telenovelas on the Internet. That lets us catch up with something we mossed, or even watch something again of we wish. With that and Gato Viejos bilingual caption pages for AB, you can go back to earlier episodes of AB and at your leisure watch, -and replay if needed, with the script (captions) in hand.
You'll have to make sure the broadcast dates match on the episodes because the numbering is different.
To us it is worth the $7.99/month for HuluPlus and access to recent Univision telenovelas on the Internet. That lets us catch up with something we mossed, or even watch something again of we wish. With that and Gato Viejos bilingual caption pages for AB, you can go back to earlier episodes of AB and at your leisure watch, -and replay if needed, with the script (captions) in hand.
You'll have to make sure the broadcast dates match on the episodes because the numbering is different.
I've had a couple of comments about putting the proposal and acceptance on th HP list. For the boys, it is a low point, but I'm so disgusted by Caye's behavior that I want Isa to take him down. That's why I usually put the things Isa does in connection with Caye on the HP list.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 2:28:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 2:28:00 PM EST
The blog gremlins are among us, anon12:08 was me.
Oh no, I hope Silvia doesn't do La tempestad, she's way too good for Mejia's basura.
Tks Carolina, I forgot about news in slow Spanish also.
Oh no, I hope Silvia doesn't do La tempestad, she's way too good for Mejia's basura.
Tks Carolina, I forgot about news in slow Spanish also.
I still am not buying Gussy feeling jealous of Camila and threatened by her and so on because I haven't seen support for that in the show. What I have seen is that she loves her daughter, however imperfectly expressed it has been at times. The bottom line is that she wants the best for her daughter, as she sees it.
I do think she may never like Daniel, though, because of his dad. We saw clearly how she feels about FX and sooner or later she may throw that in Daniel's face. 'You're a horrible person, just like your dad.'
I do think she may never like Daniel, though, because of his dad. We saw clearly how she feels about FX and sooner or later she may throw that in Daniel's face. 'You're a horrible person, just like your dad.'
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:54:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 3:54:00 PM EST
I think Gussie doesn't like Dan because Dan accuses Dion of being a bad man. And that's one of her problems with camila too.
cathyx,
Yes, I think that is the main reason for Gussy’s antagonism toward Daniel and that has been made very clear to us. I was adding a additional reason that I haven’t seen anyone else mention here, that she isn’t likely to like the child of a man she loathes.
Yes, I think that is the main reason for Gussy’s antagonism toward Daniel and that has been made very clear to us. I was adding a additional reason that I haven’t seen anyone else mention here, that she isn’t likely to like the child of a man she loathes.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 5:25:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 5:25:00 PM EST
While I understand what some of you are saying about Augustina's feelings re: Daniel because of his father and his dislike of Dio, what I don't understand is that before she knew of his background she really liked Daniel. Doesn't any of that mean something to her? If not, then she's someone who likes and dislikes people because of name or social status, not what they are truly inside. Add to that the fact that she accepts the way Dio treats her, horrible as it is, then I'm not really impressed with her character. However, in spite of it all, I feel bad for her and hope she wakes up soon or it's going to be curtains for her, I think.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 5:51:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 5:51:00 PM EST
How does that explain Ximena, who is also the child of Francisco Javier? Gussie didn't hate her so much as been irritated with the traits she had in common with him.
I don't think Gussie hates Camila, but her kind of love is smothering. Had this happened any sooner Camila would have flown -- not run -- away.
I don't think Gussie hates Camila, but her kind of love is smothering. Had this happened any sooner Camila would have flown -- not run -- away.
Oh, I don't think Gussie hates Camila at all. I believe she loves her, but imo she's not going to go against Dio, who has made it clear he does not like Dan.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:06:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:06:00 PM EST
I think most mothers find a way to love their own child even if they divorced and now hate their father. Other women's children? Not so much.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:07:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:07:00 PM EST
Good point about other women's children, Carolina!
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:08:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:08:00 PM EST
That was actually me. Hit send too fast, re: good point, Carolina!
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:10:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:10:00 PM EST
I don't think Gussie hates Camila, either. Quite the opposite.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:12:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:12:00 PM EST
Marta-- Your comment..."she's someone who likes and dislikes people because of name or social status, not what they are truly inside."
She did a 180 on Amanda. Once she learned (wrongly) that she'd had a child out of wedlock, she doesn't want to have anything to do with her.
Also, Pablo has now come down in her estimation, for the same reason, although we all know there is an added reason--Big Don Dan had no interest in her and loved un-titled Agatha, despite her being "a su altura," (always judging by social position).
She did a 180 on Amanda. Once she learned (wrongly) that she'd had a child out of wedlock, she doesn't want to have anything to do with her.
Also, Pablo has now come down in her estimation, for the same reason, although we all know there is an added reason--Big Don Dan had no interest in her and loved un-titled Agatha, despite her being "a su altura," (always judging by social position).
I don't mean to imply that Aggie hates Camila. I said that she has a problem with Camila because Camila agrees with Dan and thinks that Dion is a bad man.
Aggie did like Dan up until he was revealed as Dan and no longer Andres because that's when Dan said all those bad things about Dion. Remember he said that Dion wanted Andres to kill Dan.
Aggie did like Dan up until he was revealed as Dan and no longer Andres because that's when Dan said all those bad things about Dion. Remember he said that Dion wanted Andres to kill Dan.
I believe Auggie's dislike of Daniel has evovled, 1st because he was a lowly chofer after her hija, then when she & Dio became an item & everyone revealed how they distrusted Dio, that became the reason.
Anita - Good points about Amanda and Pablo. Suddenly they're not good enough, two of the most beautiful people you'd ever wish to have in your life.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:45:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 6:45:00 PM EST
Reasons Augustina doesn’t like Daniel:
She didn’t like him even before she met him (or hadn’t realized that he was Andres) for usurping Camila as heir and because she assumed that he was the bastard of Don Daniel.
She liked him when he was Andres until she found out that he had abused the trust she had placed in him by having an affair with Camila.
Daniel distrusts Dio and has accused him of a number of misdeeds and crimes. Augustina is in deep denial about Dio. People who are in denial become really angry and hostile towards anyone who tries to chip away at it. This is how she is reacting to Dan.
She hates his father.
She is not comfortable that his relationship with Camila started out as a lie. Camila had the same problem when she first learned Daniel’s identity. They don’t like being lied to. It took Camila a looooong time to get past it and Augustina hasn’t gotten past it yet.
She loves Camila and is trying to protect her from a man that she doesn’t like or trust. We may see that protection as misguided, but that is how Augustina sees it and that is what motivates her.
She pigeon holes people and she doesn't handle changes in people's status very well – Pablo, Amanda, Nat and Dan are all examples of that. Camila does not share this trait with her mom at all, and seems to be exceptionally good at going with the flow.
She has a hard time in general with and distain for women who have sex outside of marriage and also has a huge problem with children born out of wedlock. Even though she now knows Daniel is not a bastard, she originally pigeon holed him as that so it continues to be a problem.
That’s all that I can come up with right now. I left out the speculation about being jealous and insecure because I haven’t seen support from that in anything she has actually said or done.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:07:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:07:00 PM EST
This seems to be an Agustina discussion weekend, and I wanted to put my two cents in.
Does Gussie love Camila? Yes, no doubt. But I think her reaction to Dan has more to do with Agatha than anything else including his being the son of Francisco.
She disliked Dan before meeting him. I think her dislike of him was less because he was a bastard and more because she thought he was the son of Don Daniel, the love of her life and Agatha the love of his life, besides Dan inheriting the ranch out from under Cam.
She liked Andres until she found out her daughter was sleeping with the chofer.
She liked Nat until she found out that she was who she thinks is the love child of a Dio and Amanda affair. I think, in this case too, it was less about Nat being “illegitimate” than it was about Dio having a child by another woman. Though I’m not sure in this case Gussie would think of this, but Amanda was the best friend of Agatha.
I am puzzled by her treatment of Pablo. She treats him pretty well even though she doesn’t think he or Luz should be in the big house.
I think Agustina is a good person. I’m hoping her downfall will humble her and make her a better mother, mother-in-law and grandmother. She needs to start judging people on their merits and not on the particulars of their birth.
Regarding Gussie’s acting like La Duena. I know I’m probably in the minority here, but I understand why she acts that way. Camila gave her duena rights over the household.
To sum up. Gussie’s a snob. She’s also not gotten over Don Daniel’s repeated rejection of her. I think the thing I find hard to accept from Gussie: when Cam was sobbing her heart out she should have comforted her and not let her opinion of Dan get in the way of that. If she was concerned for Cam and her relationhisp with Dan, then that discussion should have come at a better time. She felt it more important for her to say “I told you so” than to comfort her grieving child. Once again, Vivi is the one Cam turns to for that.
Does Gussie love Camila? Yes, no doubt. But I think her reaction to Dan has more to do with Agatha than anything else including his being the son of Francisco.
She disliked Dan before meeting him. I think her dislike of him was less because he was a bastard and more because she thought he was the son of Don Daniel, the love of her life and Agatha the love of his life, besides Dan inheriting the ranch out from under Cam.
She liked Andres until she found out her daughter was sleeping with the chofer.
She liked Nat until she found out that she was who she thinks is the love child of a Dio and Amanda affair. I think, in this case too, it was less about Nat being “illegitimate” than it was about Dio having a child by another woman. Though I’m not sure in this case Gussie would think of this, but Amanda was the best friend of Agatha.
I am puzzled by her treatment of Pablo. She treats him pretty well even though she doesn’t think he or Luz should be in the big house.
I think Agustina is a good person. I’m hoping her downfall will humble her and make her a better mother, mother-in-law and grandmother. She needs to start judging people on their merits and not on the particulars of their birth.
Regarding Gussie’s acting like La Duena. I know I’m probably in the minority here, but I understand why she acts that way. Camila gave her duena rights over the household.
To sum up. Gussie’s a snob. She’s also not gotten over Don Daniel’s repeated rejection of her. I think the thing I find hard to accept from Gussie: when Cam was sobbing her heart out she should have comforted her and not let her opinion of Dan get in the way of that. If she was concerned for Cam and her relationhisp with Dan, then that discussion should have come at a better time. She felt it more important for her to say “I told you so” than to comfort her grieving child. Once again, Vivi is the one Cam turns to for that.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:29:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:29:00 PM EST
Anita: I'm flattered by your thinking my lists deserve a special edition of Operation Shine the Light. I'm blushing.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:33:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:33:00 PM EST
I'm with Anita, Nanette. Your list is awesome!
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:48:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:48:00 PM EST
I wanted to give some background on the “shattered heart” quote I used for Cam. It comes from the movie Love Comes Softly.
*SPOILER ALERT*
When Clark (Dale Midkiff) goes into the bunkhouse to bring his belongings back to the house after Marty (Katherine Heigl) has left, he prays to God: “Father, I don't know why you brought Marty into my life only to have her leave like this. I don't always understand your plan, but I ask you, with a shattered heart please help me to accept it. Amen.”
*END OF SPOILER*
I thought it was one of the most beautiful pieces of movie dialogue I’d ever heard and beautifully delivered.
*SPOILER ALERT*
When Clark (Dale Midkiff) goes into the bunkhouse to bring his belongings back to the house after Marty (Katherine Heigl) has left, he prays to God: “Father, I don't know why you brought Marty into my life only to have her leave like this. I don't always understand your plan, but I ask you, with a shattered heart please help me to accept it. Amen.”
*END OF SPOILER*
I thought it was one of the most beautiful pieces of movie dialogue I’d ever heard and beautifully delivered.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:48:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 7:48:00 PM EST
Carolina,
"She has a hard time in general with and disdain for women who have sex outside of marriage..."
and I agree with that, but didn't she and Dionysio actually engage in a little unlicensed boinking before they got married?
Carlos
"She has a hard time in general with and disdain for women who have sex outside of marriage..."
and I agree with that, but didn't she and Dionysio actually engage in a little unlicensed boinking before they got married?
Carlos
Nanette,
Here I just thought you were a Stones' fan. :)
Laughter, joy, and loneliness
And sex and sex and sex and sex
And look at me, I'm in tatters
I'm all shattered, shattered
All this chitter-chatter
Chitter-chatter, chitter-chatter 'bout shmata, shmata, shmata
I can't give it away on 7th Avenue
This town's been wearin' tatters, uh-huh
You've been shattered
Work and work for love and sex ain't you hungry for success?
Success, success, success, does it matter?
I'm all shattered, does it matter?
Ah, look at me, I'm all shattered
I'm all shattered
Look at me, I'm all shattered, yeah
Shattered
Here I just thought you were a Stones' fan. :)
Laughter, joy, and loneliness
And sex and sex and sex and sex
And look at me, I'm in tatters
I'm all shattered, shattered
All this chitter-chatter
Chitter-chatter, chitter-chatter 'bout shmata, shmata, shmata
I can't give it away on 7th Avenue
This town's been wearin' tatters, uh-huh
You've been shattered
Work and work for love and sex ain't you hungry for success?
Success, success, success, does it matter?
I'm all shattered, does it matter?
Ah, look at me, I'm all shattered
I'm all shattered
Look at me, I'm all shattered, yeah
Shattered
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:23:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:23:00 PM EST
Carolina: where I come from, back in the day, you were either a Stones fan or a Beatles fan. I was/am a Beatles fan.
Though I appreciate the Stones more now that I'm older.
Carlos: Among Gussie's other faults, she's a hypocrite.
Though I appreciate the Stones more now that I'm older.
Carlos: Among Gussie's other faults, she's a hypocrite.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:36:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:36:00 PM EST
Carlos, If they did, that was before I was watching every day. I thought the first time they did it was when they went off to Vegas together. That impression was reinforced when Dio told her about Natalie being his daughter, and doing the nasty with lots of other women before her, but they didn't have sex before marriage because he knew right away that she wasn't that kind of woman and he wanted to marry her.
I think her attitude is the standard pre-feminism one of women being either madonnas or whores with nothing in between. Cayetonto seems to have the same attitude. So does my mother. *sigh*
It actually could be the effect of living with my mother's attitude my whole life that has colored my perception of Gussie and why she is so antagonist to so many people tainted with the stench of unlicensed love (in her view).
Vivi, I didn't forget that. I just don't see the support in the show for that view. I didn't see her attitude towards Don Dan as 'love of her life'; I saw it more as 'hey, we're both old and single and have been sharing a household for a long time and get along just fine, so why don't we get married?' Again, that was before I was watching every day and before I found this blog, so I could very well be wrong. She has expressed disdain for the chileana, but I don't see the jealousy angle. I see it as more of not liking Agatha because she didn't like Dan, not the other way around. Point me to an episode and scene and change my mind. :)
I think her attitude is the standard pre-feminism one of women being either madonnas or whores with nothing in between. Cayetonto seems to have the same attitude. So does my mother. *sigh*
It actually could be the effect of living with my mother's attitude my whole life that has colored my perception of Gussie and why she is so antagonist to so many people tainted with the stench of unlicensed love (in her view).
Vivi, I didn't forget that. I just don't see the support in the show for that view. I didn't see her attitude towards Don Dan as 'love of her life'; I saw it more as 'hey, we're both old and single and have been sharing a household for a long time and get along just fine, so why don't we get married?' Again, that was before I was watching every day and before I found this blog, so I could very well be wrong. She has expressed disdain for the chileana, but I don't see the jealousy angle. I see it as more of not liking Agatha because she didn't like Dan, not the other way around. Point me to an episode and scene and change my mind. :)
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:40:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:40:00 PM EST
Nanette, lol. I remember those days, but I've always been a fan of both.
The Brits use 'shattered' a lot when we might say devasted.
The Brits use 'shattered' a lot when we might say devasted.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:42:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:42:00 PM EST
Carolina: "The Brits use 'shattered' a lot when we might say devasted."--to me, it means even more than that. An almost indescribable combination of devastated and heartbroken. When I think of using the word shattered, I think of a heartbreak so devastating that it leaves you breathless with almost unendurable pain. That's what I saw when Cam broke down in the kitchen.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:51:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:51:00 PM EST
Nanette, that was such a sad scene. Poor Camila. There are no words, really.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:58:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:58:00 PM EST
That is what happened to Camila in the kitchen. She's been through several dozen kinds of hell and now her marriage is being pulled out from under her through no fault of her own... or Daniel's.
Gussie's contempt for Daniel is about the inheritance (which, again, isn't of his doing) and possibly her contempt for Agatha for her adultery with Don Daniel. She did want Don Daniel for a long time... until she found out about Rocio. That has changed her attitude toward Pablo.
OT: If anyone hasn't seen the Puppy Bowl yet, there is a Great Pyranees pup in the second half named Juniper.
Gussie's contempt for Daniel is about the inheritance (which, again, isn't of his doing) and possibly her contempt for Agatha for her adultery with Don Daniel. She did want Don Daniel for a long time... until she found out about Rocio. That has changed her attitude toward Pablo.
OT: If anyone hasn't seen the Puppy Bowl yet, there is a Great Pyranees pup in the second half named Juniper.
Carolina- In the early episodes before Don Dan dies she makes a play for him, he turns her down, and she brings up "la Chilena esa" whom he loved and cheated on her cousin with. After he dies and Daniel is left as his heir, she went off on many tirades on Agatha, and then began to call Dan "el Bastardo" with a hatred that was obviously tinged with jealousy towards Agatha. After the Rocio affair comes out, after she and Cam read the letters, she once again brings up how Don Dan had an affair with Agatha (la Chilena esa), which was many years ago, long before he was a widower living with his widowed sister-in-law. There is jealousy coming out of her every pore every time she mentions Agatha.
Vivi, I saw all those episodes. I guess I just saw them differently than you. She doesn't like Dan. And she doesn't like 'loose women'. She is hurt by Don Dan's rejection and mad as heck at him over the will. But I am not seeing specific jealousy of Agatha as a primary motivation for her.
Your mileage may vary. :)
Your mileage may vary. :)
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 9:28:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 9:28:00 PM EST
Vivi: I agree with you about Gussie's jealousy of Agatha. I really do think it's the main driving force for her with regards to Dan. I believe Don Daniel was the love of her life and his rejection of her still rankles.
UA: We had a local entry in the Puppy Bowl last year, which was the first time I'd heard of it. Planned on watching it online. Will definitely be on the look out for the little Maja.
UA: We had a local entry in the Puppy Bowl last year, which was the first time I'd heard of it. Planned on watching it online. Will definitely be on the look out for the little Maja.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 9:39:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 9:39:00 PM EST
She's in the second half after the Kitty Half-Time Show which is my favorite part. There is a Birman kitten in that part that caught my eye.
Kitty Half-Time Show!! It's worth watching it just for that. I must have just seen highlights last year, because I don't remember thatpart.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 11:24:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 11:24:00 PM EST
First the OT:
Carolina: Thanks for the mention of news in slow spanish. I have listened from time to time. The actual newscasts seem to be free, the pay version seems to be for grammatical excercises and such. I have a hard time with the t for c/z sound substitution as all of my other Spanish exposure is latin american.
Thanks Carolina (and LXV) also for the reassurance about having trouble sorting the sounds into words. I've been told that before, but it is still frustrating. Thanks specifically for the reassurance that "cheating" with the subtitles is actually a good thing and won't retard my aural progress.
Thanks Traveling Lady. I have looked at regular newscasts online, and, at this point anyway, I don't catch much, but I hope to graduate from needing "slow spanish" someday.
Cathyx, I will try to remember the romance novel idea next time i hit the library.
And Nanette and Audrey, thanks for the Fios and Hulu information.
Chris in FL
Carolina: Thanks for the mention of news in slow spanish. I have listened from time to time. The actual newscasts seem to be free, the pay version seems to be for grammatical excercises and such. I have a hard time with the t for c/z sound substitution as all of my other Spanish exposure is latin american.
Thanks Carolina (and LXV) also for the reassurance about having trouble sorting the sounds into words. I've been told that before, but it is still frustrating. Thanks specifically for the reassurance that "cheating" with the subtitles is actually a good thing and won't retard my aural progress.
Thanks Traveling Lady. I have looked at regular newscasts online, and, at this point anyway, I don't catch much, but I hope to graduate from needing "slow spanish" someday.
Cathyx, I will try to remember the romance novel idea next time i hit the library.
And Nanette and Audrey, thanks for the Fios and Hulu information.
Chris in FL
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 11:26:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 11:26:00 PM EST
A word about Abe.
I don't really understand all that went on in the early days in Chile, and clearly lying to Dan about Miriam's death was out of bounds, but as for putting Dan in jail in the first place, Abe may be getting a somewhat worse rap than the bad enough rap he clearly does deserve.
In general, if someone suspected or charged with murder, bail is pretty hard to come by in the US, and I would be surprised if Chile, or anywhere else, is much different.
For someone with a large inheritance waiting in another jurisdiction... really not surprising at all that Dan was lingering in jail.
Now if I missed something where Abe had somehow convinced the rest of Chilean law enforcement and the jail system to keep Dan without any charges, and without there ever going to be a trial, that would be both amazing and a clear sign of major misconduct by Abe and the Chilean authorities. Something more akin to Chile's 1970s reputation than this century.
But if the idea that Abe had Dan in jail "forever" is just based on the scene where Abe is telling Dan in his cell that Dan was never going to get out, well, that's the kind of line prosecutors/cops use on defendants awaiting trial all the time.
Nasty, often patently untrue, sometimes used to wrangle confessions precisely because the other evidence is so thin, but hardly uncommon.
Abe is still a piece of work, and (assuming Miriam's delicate condition is legit which seems likely given the coma) insane to bring Miriam to Mexico without having sorted out what was really going on. Miriam has cleared Dan of the attempted murder, but the very fact that Dio wouldn't explain everything up front was warning enough that Abe needed to sort things out before involving M. directly.
Chris in FL
I don't really understand all that went on in the early days in Chile, and clearly lying to Dan about Miriam's death was out of bounds, but as for putting Dan in jail in the first place, Abe may be getting a somewhat worse rap than the bad enough rap he clearly does deserve.
In general, if someone suspected or charged with murder, bail is pretty hard to come by in the US, and I would be surprised if Chile, or anywhere else, is much different.
For someone with a large inheritance waiting in another jurisdiction... really not surprising at all that Dan was lingering in jail.
Now if I missed something where Abe had somehow convinced the rest of Chilean law enforcement and the jail system to keep Dan without any charges, and without there ever going to be a trial, that would be both amazing and a clear sign of major misconduct by Abe and the Chilean authorities. Something more akin to Chile's 1970s reputation than this century.
But if the idea that Abe had Dan in jail "forever" is just based on the scene where Abe is telling Dan in his cell that Dan was never going to get out, well, that's the kind of line prosecutors/cops use on defendants awaiting trial all the time.
Nasty, often patently untrue, sometimes used to wrangle confessions precisely because the other evidence is so thin, but hardly uncommon.
Abe is still a piece of work, and (assuming Miriam's delicate condition is legit which seems likely given the coma) insane to bring Miriam to Mexico without having sorted out what was really going on. Miriam has cleared Dan of the attempted murder, but the very fact that Dio wouldn't explain everything up front was warning enough that Abe needed to sort things out before involving M. directly.
Chris in FL
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 11:43:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 11:43:00 PM EST
I haven't checked in for comments for a few hours. Gussie comment explosion!
Carolina, I feel you summed up reasons for Gussie's dislike of Dan fantastically well: My comments are really a rehash.
The Gussie Chronicles According to Me: Part I
Agustina appears to have married at plus or minus 20 years of age. Young but an adult. We really don't know anything about her family except she seems to have no other living relatives now besides Camila. She appears educated (though I agree not quick-witted like Camila). It seems likely she was at least upper middle class though not extremely wealthy like the Monterdes. It is likely she gave birth to Camila within a year or two of marrying. We have heard no inklings that this was not a happy marriage. Unfortunately, Gussie's husband died while Camila was still a small child. This must have been very sad for Gussie, but life goes on.
So, Gussie meets FX. It's a fair assumption that FX somehow was able to ingratiate himself to a young wealthy and perhaps lonely widow. We don't know the details of their courtship. What we do know is that Ximena was the result of this marriage and that FX abandoned Gussie, his own child and Camila. And, he was able to take a good portion of Gussie's money with him when he left.
Now, again this is sad. Gussie is still a young woman, widowed and then later dumped and robbed by an unscrupulous lowlife. But again, life goes on. Gussie picked herself up and for about the next 20 years, raised her daughters in a seemingly attentive, conscientious and loving way. We hear no hints of a long procession of men in and out of her life, alcohol, drugs or neglect. She appears to have had enough money still available from either her marriage or her family that she did not need to work outside the home. In that respect, I would say she was luckier than most. She supported Camila as her daughter attended veterinary school. I have only felt that she feels proud of Camila though she may not always understand her. Blessed is the parent that always understands their child!
About four years ago, her daughter Camila married. Gussie seems to have approved of the marriage. In a terrible tragedy, her daughter's husband dies immediately after the wedding in a car accident. Camila is also injured as well as spiraling into a deep depression. Camila's uncle, who is extremely fond of Camila, offers his home to the family in hopes of aiding Camila's recovery. Gussie tries to keep her family together and wants Ximena to accompany them but Ximena refuses claiming ranch life is too boring (though we later find out in an emotional scene that she has other issues as well).
Carolina, I feel you summed up reasons for Gussie's dislike of Dan fantastically well: My comments are really a rehash.
The Gussie Chronicles According to Me: Part I
Agustina appears to have married at plus or minus 20 years of age. Young but an adult. We really don't know anything about her family except she seems to have no other living relatives now besides Camila. She appears educated (though I agree not quick-witted like Camila). It seems likely she was at least upper middle class though not extremely wealthy like the Monterdes. It is likely she gave birth to Camila within a year or two of marrying. We have heard no inklings that this was not a happy marriage. Unfortunately, Gussie's husband died while Camila was still a small child. This must have been very sad for Gussie, but life goes on.
So, Gussie meets FX. It's a fair assumption that FX somehow was able to ingratiate himself to a young wealthy and perhaps lonely widow. We don't know the details of their courtship. What we do know is that Ximena was the result of this marriage and that FX abandoned Gussie, his own child and Camila. And, he was able to take a good portion of Gussie's money with him when he left.
Now, again this is sad. Gussie is still a young woman, widowed and then later dumped and robbed by an unscrupulous lowlife. But again, life goes on. Gussie picked herself up and for about the next 20 years, raised her daughters in a seemingly attentive, conscientious and loving way. We hear no hints of a long procession of men in and out of her life, alcohol, drugs or neglect. She appears to have had enough money still available from either her marriage or her family that she did not need to work outside the home. In that respect, I would say she was luckier than most. She supported Camila as her daughter attended veterinary school. I have only felt that she feels proud of Camila though she may not always understand her. Blessed is the parent that always understands their child!
About four years ago, her daughter Camila married. Gussie seems to have approved of the marriage. In a terrible tragedy, her daughter's husband dies immediately after the wedding in a car accident. Camila is also injured as well as spiraling into a deep depression. Camila's uncle, who is extremely fond of Camila, offers his home to the family in hopes of aiding Camila's recovery. Gussie tries to keep her family together and wants Ximena to accompany them but Ximena refuses claiming ranch life is too boring (though we later find out in an emotional scene that she has other issues as well).
Permalink posted by : Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 11:55:00 PM EST
: Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 11:55:00 PM EST
Gussie and Camila move to the ranch as a result of Camila's condition. Don Daniel is a widower (his wife, in true intertwined TN fashion, was Gussie's cousin). Gussie, whether by default or by design falls into the role of acting duena. She appears to run the household--a role which we find out is important to her in a later scene when Camila gives Piedad time off without telling Gussie. Though we usually see only Piedad and Dorotea, we know this is a very large home with many servants so this is a significant responsibility. She "bosses" the servants around because she is the boss. However, she appears to run things in such a way that household life runs smoothly and the staff appears to like and respect her. Honestly, this is no small feat.
We also learn that Gussie is infatuated/in love with Don Dan. He has no interest in her however. Gussie continues to hope and hope that Don Dan will change his mind. Many have ridiculed Gussie's desires. I would say they are very fortunate indeed to have never experienced unrequited love.
Don Dan dies. In an inexplicable turn of events from Camila's and Gussie's point of view, Don Dan has left the ranch to an unknown relative, an apparently illegitimate son that no one knows from a foreign country. Camila is confused, but OK with it as it is Don Dan's right to do what he wants with his property. Gussie however is quite angry for her daughter. Don Dan would have led them to believe that Camila might inherit as she had been working on the ranch and he looked upon her like a daughter. Gussie is really unhappy about this slap in the face to her daughter and in a bit of name-calling, frequently refers to the heir as Bastardo. Not nice, but actually pretty understandable given the way she feels Don Dan has treated her daughter.
Around this time, an extremely charismatic man has entered her life. He appears to live comfortably, presents as an educated gentleman and Camila's new husband, Don Dan's long time ranch administrator, vouches for him as well. This new man, Dionisio, begins heavily courting Gussie and she falls for him. Gosh, imagine that, she falls for a guy after a few decades or so of no relationships.
But she could have had Osvaldo you say! True, Osvaldo is a wonderful man and a good catch but there just wasn't the spark there to interest Gussie. First it was Don Dan (though I personally don't think he seems like that great a guy in the how he treats women--not like our Dan! ) and now Dionisio. Truly, Amanda doesn't feel the spark either, but Osvaldo has made himself more useful to Amanda. Poor Osvaldo.
We also learn that Gussie is infatuated/in love with Don Dan. He has no interest in her however. Gussie continues to hope and hope that Don Dan will change his mind. Many have ridiculed Gussie's desires. I would say they are very fortunate indeed to have never experienced unrequited love.
Don Dan dies. In an inexplicable turn of events from Camila's and Gussie's point of view, Don Dan has left the ranch to an unknown relative, an apparently illegitimate son that no one knows from a foreign country. Camila is confused, but OK with it as it is Don Dan's right to do what he wants with his property. Gussie however is quite angry for her daughter. Don Dan would have led them to believe that Camila might inherit as she had been working on the ranch and he looked upon her like a daughter. Gussie is really unhappy about this slap in the face to her daughter and in a bit of name-calling, frequently refers to the heir as Bastardo. Not nice, but actually pretty understandable given the way she feels Don Dan has treated her daughter.
Around this time, an extremely charismatic man has entered her life. He appears to live comfortably, presents as an educated gentleman and Camila's new husband, Don Dan's long time ranch administrator, vouches for him as well. This new man, Dionisio, begins heavily courting Gussie and she falls for him. Gosh, imagine that, she falls for a guy after a few decades or so of no relationships.
But she could have had Osvaldo you say! True, Osvaldo is a wonderful man and a good catch but there just wasn't the spark there to interest Gussie. First it was Don Dan (though I personally don't think he seems like that great a guy in the how he treats women--not like our Dan! ) and now Dionisio. Truly, Amanda doesn't feel the spark either, but Osvaldo has made himself more useful to Amanda. Poor Osvaldo.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 12:03:00 AM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 12:03:00 AM EST
Part 3:
So, Gussie marries Dio. We know it's a disaster but she doesn't . Camila tries to warn her but the best she comes up with is that Dio tried to buy MQ a while back and Don Dan wouldn't sell. OK, so what? Camila and Gussie argue and Gussie comes out with the statement that if she had to choose between Dio and Camila, she would choose Dio. Sad words. But adult children should not be the decision makers when their parents choose partners. The parent should listen to what the son/daughter says but their decision should not be made because of a threat of an adult child withdrawing their relationship. This is emotional blackmail. I know that Camila would never really do that but the principle still applies.
Shortly later, Ximena reveals to Camila she is having an affair with her husband Alonso and it comes out that Camila is having an affair with the chofer, D"Andres. Gussie is horrified. What mother wouldn't be? This is an appalling, gut-wrenching, deplorable family rift. Would you want to see your daughters going through this? Some have felt that Gussie was more upset with Camila than Ximena. That simply isn't true. Gussie actually told Dio that Ximena was dead to her because of this situation. I actually think this is the worst thing Gussie has ever said. But, she never actually acted on this statement toward Ximena and never said it to her face. So I forgive it as a statement of frustration and horror at the situation. Gussie tried to reproach Ximena but the Gussie-Ximena dynamics were such that Ximena effectively blew her off.
Gussie, being a lot closer to Camila, was able to talk more about the D'Andres situation. She actually wanted to sit down with Camila immediately after and really talk, but unfortunately Camila had an appointment with Osvaldo and then the time again was never right from there. Gussie then did begin refer to D'Andres as "The Chofer". I see 3 reasons for this: 1)He had betrayed her trust (just the 1st time of at least 3 instances I feel); 2) he had opened his daughter up to a lot of chisme. Camila didn't care but Gussie did. What mother wants to see their daughter the subject of jokes and gossip? and 3) as a servant D"Andres wasn't good enough for Camila.
Fast forward to finding out D'Andres is Dan. Dan may now be socially more acceptable, but does Gussie like him now? No, because still one of the main reasons she dislikes him is his deceit and lies. Calling him "The Chofer" was just that - a way of name-calling. In addition she feels that Dan is the main driver of Camila's dislike of Dio. Gussie feels that Dan has used and abused Camila's trust.
Of course, Camila being used and abused is laughable in the face of what Dio is currently doing to Gussie in her marriage. I agree he verbally abuses her on a regular basis and she is working hard to close her eyes to the fact that this marriage was a mistake. In her defense, she has only been married a few months and to give up on a marriage so soon just reeks of failure and despair. Even the Padre told her to work on it some more. I think she is internally sucking it up and trying to find the way to make this marriage work. Marriage is not easy and so I think it's admirable she wants to try so hard. We know she needs to give it up but I'm not so sure I would be willing to give it up just a few months in.
And now we are up to the present, finally! Just a few comments. When Camila returned from the honeymoon she told her mom they had had a really wonderful time. Gussie sincerely told Camila she was happy for her. I personally think that had she continued to see Camila and Dan be happy on a daily basis, she would have warmed up to him and at some point even apologized to him.
However, the ankle of doom arrived, and Dan has, in her mind, hurt her daughter again. It's just a sorry state of affairs at MQ!
So, Gussie marries Dio. We know it's a disaster but she doesn't . Camila tries to warn her but the best she comes up with is that Dio tried to buy MQ a while back and Don Dan wouldn't sell. OK, so what? Camila and Gussie argue and Gussie comes out with the statement that if she had to choose between Dio and Camila, she would choose Dio. Sad words. But adult children should not be the decision makers when their parents choose partners. The parent should listen to what the son/daughter says but their decision should not be made because of a threat of an adult child withdrawing their relationship. This is emotional blackmail. I know that Camila would never really do that but the principle still applies.
Shortly later, Ximena reveals to Camila she is having an affair with her husband Alonso and it comes out that Camila is having an affair with the chofer, D"Andres. Gussie is horrified. What mother wouldn't be? This is an appalling, gut-wrenching, deplorable family rift. Would you want to see your daughters going through this? Some have felt that Gussie was more upset with Camila than Ximena. That simply isn't true. Gussie actually told Dio that Ximena was dead to her because of this situation. I actually think this is the worst thing Gussie has ever said. But, she never actually acted on this statement toward Ximena and never said it to her face. So I forgive it as a statement of frustration and horror at the situation. Gussie tried to reproach Ximena but the Gussie-Ximena dynamics were such that Ximena effectively blew her off.
Gussie, being a lot closer to Camila, was able to talk more about the D'Andres situation. She actually wanted to sit down with Camila immediately after and really talk, but unfortunately Camila had an appointment with Osvaldo and then the time again was never right from there. Gussie then did begin refer to D'Andres as "The Chofer". I see 3 reasons for this: 1)He had betrayed her trust (just the 1st time of at least 3 instances I feel); 2) he had opened his daughter up to a lot of chisme. Camila didn't care but Gussie did. What mother wants to see their daughter the subject of jokes and gossip? and 3) as a servant D"Andres wasn't good enough for Camila.
Fast forward to finding out D'Andres is Dan. Dan may now be socially more acceptable, but does Gussie like him now? No, because still one of the main reasons she dislikes him is his deceit and lies. Calling him "The Chofer" was just that - a way of name-calling. In addition she feels that Dan is the main driver of Camila's dislike of Dio. Gussie feels that Dan has used and abused Camila's trust.
Of course, Camila being used and abused is laughable in the face of what Dio is currently doing to Gussie in her marriage. I agree he verbally abuses her on a regular basis and she is working hard to close her eyes to the fact that this marriage was a mistake. In her defense, she has only been married a few months and to give up on a marriage so soon just reeks of failure and despair. Even the Padre told her to work on it some more. I think she is internally sucking it up and trying to find the way to make this marriage work. Marriage is not easy and so I think it's admirable she wants to try so hard. We know she needs to give it up but I'm not so sure I would be willing to give it up just a few months in.
And now we are up to the present, finally! Just a few comments. When Camila returned from the honeymoon she told her mom they had had a really wonderful time. Gussie sincerely told Camila she was happy for her. I personally think that had she continued to see Camila and Dan be happy on a daily basis, she would have warmed up to him and at some point even apologized to him.
However, the ankle of doom arrived, and Dan has, in her mind, hurt her daughter again. It's just a sorry state of affairs at MQ!
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 12:09:00 AM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 12:09:00 AM EST
Addendum: I have never felt that Gussie is jealous of,threatened by, or smothering of Camila.
Gussie wasn't at all cold to Piedad this episode about Luzma--she just told Piedad that the credit for Luzma's stay belongd to Camila. I detected no attitude. She was however ruder than was fair to BabyDoll Nat earlier this week. I understand her rudeness to Amanda; though we know it's not fair, Gussie doesn't.
Gussie wasn't at all cold to Piedad this episode about Luzma--she just told Piedad that the credit for Luzma's stay belongd to Camila. I detected no attitude. She was however ruder than was fair to BabyDoll Nat earlier this week. I understand her rudeness to Amanda; though we know it's not fair, Gussie doesn't.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 12:17:00 AM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 12:17:00 AM EST
I still have to say that Gussie is presumptuous for even thinking she has a vote in whether Camila and Daniel give a portion of the ranch to Pablo. She really stepped over the line in the finale of Friday's episode by telling Daniel to leave Mexico and never see Camila again.
Camila is an adult and a responsible one. She is starting to act as though Camila were still a child.
Camila is an adult and a responsible one. She is starting to act as though Camila were still a child.
Barbara, ITA. Bravo.
UA, I think that from what I have seen of Mexican families (in real life, not TNs), they operate much differently than ours do in our culture. They are much more collectivist than we are and they make group decisions, not individual ones. People tend to make major decisions about their lives only after talking it over, in detail, and considering how it will impact the whole family, not just the individual. Family comes first.
They are also much more respectful of their elders. They ask them for advice and they listen to it respectfully.
Put those two factors into play, and Augustina was acting appropriately in speaking up about a major family decision about Pablo and the ranch. In fact, some traditionally-minded Mexicans may have seen Camila as the one who was out of line in making a decision like that without consulting her mother.
I agree that Augustina was out of line in what she said to Daniel, and it was disturbing to see her piling on him when the guy was already "in it up to his neck and sinking fast", as Jardinera said, but I digress. I think she was very angry at him for hurting Camila and just lashed out at him.
UA, I think that from what I have seen of Mexican families (in real life, not TNs), they operate much differently than ours do in our culture. They are much more collectivist than we are and they make group decisions, not individual ones. People tend to make major decisions about their lives only after talking it over, in detail, and considering how it will impact the whole family, not just the individual. Family comes first.
They are also much more respectful of their elders. They ask them for advice and they listen to it respectfully.
Put those two factors into play, and Augustina was acting appropriately in speaking up about a major family decision about Pablo and the ranch. In fact, some traditionally-minded Mexicans may have seen Camila as the one who was out of line in making a decision like that without consulting her mother.
I agree that Augustina was out of line in what she said to Daniel, and it was disturbing to see her piling on him when the guy was already "in it up to his neck and sinking fast", as Jardinera said, but I digress. I think she was very angry at him for hurting Camila and just lashed out at him.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:31:00 AM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:31:00 AM EST
Carolina, yes, yes to what you said.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:56:00 AM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:56:00 AM EST
Barbara, your dissertation on Augustina is exactly what the actress would conclude in order to portray her. During my university days we wrote those things out in class before beginning rehearsals for plays; it was helpful.
Carolina, I realize that the individualism we are accustomed to in the US isn't universal. However, I can't be on board with infantilizing adults in the name of the concept of respect for one's elders. Camila's decision to bring Pablo into the family was the right and fair decision. Augustina is only in charge of running the household while Camila and Daniel are the owners.
Augustina stepped way over the line long ago with her assumption and expectation that El Diablo would take over the running of the ranch. Not because we know him to be a criminal with his hidden agenda but because this was an insult to Camila, who was appointed executrix by Don Daniel. Don Daniel knew that Camila had the intelligence to learn what she would need to know about this and Augustina either insulted that intelligence by assuming she couldn't learn this or made an unwarranted assumption that she didn't want to.
That's why I feel that one's elders do not deserve unconditional respect. I also speak from some experience with this sort of thing.
Carolina, I realize that the individualism we are accustomed to in the US isn't universal. However, I can't be on board with infantilizing adults in the name of the concept of respect for one's elders. Camila's decision to bring Pablo into the family was the right and fair decision. Augustina is only in charge of running the household while Camila and Daniel are the owners.
Augustina stepped way over the line long ago with her assumption and expectation that El Diablo would take over the running of the ranch. Not because we know him to be a criminal with his hidden agenda but because this was an insult to Camila, who was appointed executrix by Don Daniel. Don Daniel knew that Camila had the intelligence to learn what she would need to know about this and Augustina either insulted that intelligence by assuming she couldn't learn this or made an unwarranted assumption that she didn't want to.
That's why I feel that one's elders do not deserve unconditional respect. I also speak from some experience with this sort of thing.
UA, Gussie does not have a vote in the Pablo decision but she does have the right to her opinion. I note that she has been a lot less vocal in that opinion than earlier in the show. I think she knows Camila is unlikely to be swayed and is trying to keep the peace with her. Camila's decision is fair just as it would be if 8 or 10 of Don Dan's progeny appeared. ( I don't know what I mean by that, just food for thought).
I agree that Gussie thinking Dio should step in and assume leadership on running the ranch was wrong I don't think she thought Camila was unable to learn how to do it. I just think she thought Dio running the place was a great idea. She was giddy with expectations of one happy ranch family after she married. Dio, of course, nurtured these thoughts along.
I agree that Gussie thinking Dio should step in and assume leadership on running the ranch was wrong I don't think she thought Camila was unable to learn how to do it. I just think she thought Dio running the place was a great idea. She was giddy with expectations of one happy ranch family after she married. Dio, of course, nurtured these thoughts along.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 8:10:00 AM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 8:10:00 AM EST
It doesn't matter what Augustina thought about El Diablo running the ranch; she didn't have the intelligence or sensitivity to realize how grossly inappropriate it would have been. The ranch was not his property and this would have been a huge slap in the face to Camila even without what we know.
Although nothing has been said about it for a while, Augustina's other anvil waits to drop on the issue of the retirement investment scam. Speculation, not spoiler: El Diablo has probably planned the scheme with sufficient forethought to make sure that his name appears on nothing. The law will come after her and nobody else and while he will pretend to help her he will only dig her in deeper. He may even plan her arrest to be rid of her and further isolate Camila. This can only work if Daniel abandons her even temporarily.
Although nothing has been said about it for a while, Augustina's other anvil waits to drop on the issue of the retirement investment scam. Speculation, not spoiler: El Diablo has probably planned the scheme with sufficient forethought to make sure that his name appears on nothing. The law will come after her and nobody else and while he will pretend to help her he will only dig her in deeper. He may even plan her arrest to be rid of her and further isolate Camila. This can only work if Daniel abandons her even temporarily.
Great synopsis Barbara, tks mucho.
Pobre Augustina, deep down she knows she made a mistake, she just can't admit it to herself or anyone else, especially after the last skunk. She realizes Dio treats her like crap.
She felt it would be one big happy family & Dionicio could just take some of the responsibility off the shoulders of Camila. She doesn't know what we know. Camila s/b enjoying things ladies of means do.
I will definitely be watching for TNs produced by Carlos Moreno Laguillo, he & Carla Estrada are the best.
Pobre Augustina, deep down she knows she made a mistake, she just can't admit it to herself or anyone else, especially after the last skunk. She realizes Dio treats her like crap.
She felt it would be one big happy family & Dionicio could just take some of the responsibility off the shoulders of Camila. She doesn't know what we know. Camila s/b enjoying things ladies of means do.
I will definitely be watching for TNs produced by Carlos Moreno Laguillo, he & Carla Estrada are the best.
Barbara, thanks for your in-depth analysis of Gussie's personality. This is very helpful, as I missed the first half of the episodes. I find it remarkable how much depth they have given all the characters. These are meaty roles and nobody (with a couple of notable exceptions) is a total good guy or bad guy. It's our conflicting sympathies that keep this so interesting.
—Agnes in NJ
—Agnes in NJ
Barbara et al--Great review, chronicle and discussion on Agustina.
My few pennies of thoughts:
We all agree that Agustina's values come from a slightly earlier age than Camila's generation.
So--for her, it WAS appropriate to have Dionisio administer the ranch--he's a MAN. Camila had just kicked Al out of the job and off the ranch; she needed a new administrator. If Dio had not rubbed Camila the wrong way, she might have considered it. Instead, she accepted Mariano's assistance for the time being (then hired Pablo). That upset Gussie and Dio as she considered Dio now to be the "head of the family," however wrong that was. Dio took it well in public, but inside he must have been seething.
From the actual backstory we have from conversations, there was a lot of interaction between Don Daniel's family and his brother Humberto's family. Agustina knew and was secretly in love with Don Daniel long before they moved to the ranch after Luis' death. She knew about Agatha, but not the affair. After Amparo's death, and her own husband's death, we think she tried to play her cards right to get Big Don to look her way. He never did. He was busy with other affairs, only one which has come to light (and we don't need any more, haha), Rocio and the resulting Pablo. Gussy was aware that Agatha remained the love of his life and that soured her.
FX was a jerk from day one. We speculate that after he was driven out of Agatha's and Daniel's lives, he returned to Mexico, maybe even Metepec or Aculco and probably knew about La Malquerida and the widow who was a relative of the owner. We speculate that he set his eyes on Agusta "por interes" as they say. This much we know--he stayed long enough to marry her, father Ximena, then had an affair with one of Gussie's friends, stole her money and ran off. We will ASSUME that Big Don Dan didn't want his relative in the poor house and offered to support her and the two girls. If they weren't already living at the ranch, this is probably when they did. Ximena, remember, stated that she didn't like ranch life as a little girl--so obvio she had memories of living on the ranch--and didn't want to move back after Camila lost Luis. (P.S. They were not married yet, the accident took place on the way home from a joint batchelor party).
That's all for now.
My few pennies of thoughts:
We all agree that Agustina's values come from a slightly earlier age than Camila's generation.
So--for her, it WAS appropriate to have Dionisio administer the ranch--he's a MAN. Camila had just kicked Al out of the job and off the ranch; she needed a new administrator. If Dio had not rubbed Camila the wrong way, she might have considered it. Instead, she accepted Mariano's assistance for the time being (then hired Pablo). That upset Gussie and Dio as she considered Dio now to be the "head of the family," however wrong that was. Dio took it well in public, but inside he must have been seething.
From the actual backstory we have from conversations, there was a lot of interaction between Don Daniel's family and his brother Humberto's family. Agustina knew and was secretly in love with Don Daniel long before they moved to the ranch after Luis' death. She knew about Agatha, but not the affair. After Amparo's death, and her own husband's death, we think she tried to play her cards right to get Big Don to look her way. He never did. He was busy with other affairs, only one which has come to light (and we don't need any more, haha), Rocio and the resulting Pablo. Gussy was aware that Agatha remained the love of his life and that soured her.
FX was a jerk from day one. We speculate that after he was driven out of Agatha's and Daniel's lives, he returned to Mexico, maybe even Metepec or Aculco and probably knew about La Malquerida and the widow who was a relative of the owner. We speculate that he set his eyes on Agusta "por interes" as they say. This much we know--he stayed long enough to marry her, father Ximena, then had an affair with one of Gussie's friends, stole her money and ran off. We will ASSUME that Big Don Dan didn't want his relative in the poor house and offered to support her and the two girls. If they weren't already living at the ranch, this is probably when they did. Ximena, remember, stated that she didn't like ranch life as a little girl--so obvio she had memories of living on the ranch--and didn't want to move back after Camila lost Luis. (P.S. They were not married yet, the accident took place on the way home from a joint batchelor party).
That's all for now.
Does anyone know if Por Ella Soy Eva is in Ultimas Semanas. I guesstimated that it will end the middle/end of March.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:23:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:23:00 PM EST
UA, I didn’t mean imply that you didn’t know that our culture is highly individualistic. I think we all know that. For me, however, knowing how Mexican families tend to work makes all the difference in understanding Augustina’s behavior. If she were in an American family, I would see your point, but not in the context of a Mexican family.
Camila made a decision that Augustina disagreed with. She stated her opinion. Since she was affected by this decision, it is reasonable that she would state her objections to it if she wanted. Camila didn't change her mind. End of story. When you say "infantilizing adults in the name of the concept of respect for one's elders", honestly, I don’t see how any of that applies to this situation.
The point isn't who is right or wrong about any of these decisions; the point is that ideas and opinions are discussed and various parties get have their say because it affects the whole family, not just the one (or two) people who hold the title to the property.
As for Dionicio wanting to manage the ranch, I think that Augustina was a bit crazy to even suggest that. The reasons that you have given may have played a role, but she also has been blind to Dio and his manipulations all along. I think HE wanted to manage the ranch in order to get his hooks on it and because of his megalomania in general. He saw an opportunity because Alonso had just left and was pushing his way in. Augustina was only cluelessly helping him towards his goal.
I also think it was sexist on her part, but that's the package deal that you get with a woman like Augustina. She derives her ID from men, she thinks women who have sex outside of marriage are beneath contempt, and she thinks men should be in charge of everything. It's a familiar package; I see it in our culture (among both younger AND older women), but to me it isn't worth my time getting frustrated with women who act like that.
It could be seen it as an insult to Camila, but she didn’t react that way. She put a stop to it and moved on. I don’t think it was a huge deal for her.
Camila made a decision that Augustina disagreed with. She stated her opinion. Since she was affected by this decision, it is reasonable that she would state her objections to it if she wanted. Camila didn't change her mind. End of story. When you say "infantilizing adults in the name of the concept of respect for one's elders", honestly, I don’t see how any of that applies to this situation.
The point isn't who is right or wrong about any of these decisions; the point is that ideas and opinions are discussed and various parties get have their say because it affects the whole family, not just the one (or two) people who hold the title to the property.
As for Dionicio wanting to manage the ranch, I think that Augustina was a bit crazy to even suggest that. The reasons that you have given may have played a role, but she also has been blind to Dio and his manipulations all along. I think HE wanted to manage the ranch in order to get his hooks on it and because of his megalomania in general. He saw an opportunity because Alonso had just left and was pushing his way in. Augustina was only cluelessly helping him towards his goal.
I also think it was sexist on her part, but that's the package deal that you get with a woman like Augustina. She derives her ID from men, she thinks women who have sex outside of marriage are beneath contempt, and she thinks men should be in charge of everything. It's a familiar package; I see it in our culture (among both younger AND older women), but to me it isn't worth my time getting frustrated with women who act like that.
It could be seen it as an insult to Camila, but she didn’t react that way. She put a stop to it and moved on. I don’t think it was a huge deal for her.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:44:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:44:00 PM EST
Carolina--At the time Dio and Gussie did the horizontal tango, they were "novios" or at least exclusive and he had made his best seductive moves on her to make her think it was true love, blah, blah, blah. Maybe she believed she was only a few days or weeks away from getting an engagement ring and then the wedding ring.
The marriage proposal in Las Vegas did take her by surprise, but, as old fashioned as she is, she jumped at the idea of a tacky wedding in a Las Vegas chapel. She was conflicted because she didn't want either of her daughters to know she had gone on a trip with a man and had had "premarital" relations earlier after all the grief she gave them about their affairs. I think she also didn't want Dio to get away. So she accepted the proposal and went ahead with it.
The marriage proposal in Las Vegas did take her by surprise, but, as old fashioned as she is, she jumped at the idea of a tacky wedding in a Las Vegas chapel. She was conflicted because she didn't want either of her daughters to know she had gone on a trip with a man and had had "premarital" relations earlier after all the grief she gave them about their affairs. I think she also didn't want Dio to get away. So she accepted the proposal and went ahead with it.
Yes Nanette, Por Ella has the "Ultimas Semanas" tag.
Great Gussie discussion.
Barbara! I appreciate both your empathy and the presentation of your argument.
Carolina, like your comments about the role of family and individuals in Mexican culture and decision-making.
Clara
Great Gussie discussion.
Barbara! I appreciate both your empathy and the presentation of your argument.
Carolina, like your comments about the role of family and individuals in Mexican culture and decision-making.
Clara
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:55:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:55:00 PM EST
Agustina is definitely a complicated character. I don't think we'd be having this spirited dicussion about her motivations if she was one-dimensional. Kudos to the writers and to Olivia Bucio who plays her.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:57:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 1:57:00 PM EST
netgirl--
If you are right about Dan not wanting to cheat on Camila for the love he has for her (and I agree their love seems deeper, stronger than what we saw with Miriam at the beginning), he's going to have to do a lot of dancing around the issue with Miriam. She looks as though she ready for a tumble. Maybe he can use Alonsssssssooooomissed problem?
If you are right about Dan not wanting to cheat on Camila for the love he has for her (and I agree their love seems deeper, stronger than what we saw with Miriam at the beginning), he's going to have to do a lot of dancing around the issue with Miriam. She looks as though she ready for a tumble. Maybe he can use Alonsssssssooooomissed problem?
About Dio's unforgivable treatment of Gussy. Being "old school" (and I keep coming back to that), an intact marriage is more important than happiness. I think she does realize his attitude toward her has changed, but she keeps trying to please him. The other comments re it being too early to call it quits, keeps her by his side.
My personal experience is that I was the first of all the cousins on both sides of my family to...wait for it...get divorced. The parent generation survived and other cousins followed suit (a few, not all). This was the US! Divorce still carried a heavy penalty social-wise. For many women it wasn't an option for financial reasons. My grandmother was in a verrry unhappy marriage, but she kept on having children and stayed with him (she contributed greatly to the unhappiness in the marriage I am quick to say).
My personal experience is that I was the first of all the cousins on both sides of my family to...wait for it...get divorced. The parent generation survived and other cousins followed suit (a few, not all). This was the US! Divorce still carried a heavy penalty social-wise. For many women it wasn't an option for financial reasons. My grandmother was in a verrry unhappy marriage, but she kept on having children and stayed with him (she contributed greatly to the unhappiness in the marriage I am quick to say).
Thanks Anon 1:55. FC is coming soon!!!!
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 2:23:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 2:23:00 PM EST
Anita, thanks for the clarification. I had scene (and more importantly, understood) the Vegas wedding episode but apparently not the ones before it when those two first got together. I don't think I'll go looking for them, either, thankyouverymuch. (Where did I put that bottle of brain bleach?) That most certainly makes Augustina a hypocrite in addition to everything else.
I have watched most of the episodes, either on tv with the spanish subtitles on to help me out or on youtube, without any captions, so I can't understand all the dialog. My Spanish was so rusty that the youtubes that I watched a few months ago I really missed a lot of the details, but now I can do a lot better. I watched all of the very early ones, but I think I missed some in the 15-30 range.
I either didn't see or didn't understand the dialog that gave the backstory about Augustina, Don Dan, and Agatha. I would say, given your description, that jealousy is likely swirling in the mix of Gussie's feelings, and I would add that to my list of Reasons Augustina Doesn't Like Dan: 'Expressed anger, resentment, contempt, and jealousy towards his mother."
Poor Dan. If his mother in law really didn't like either of his parents, he is kinda doomed for ever winning her good graces. That's the least of his problems at the moment, however.
I have watched most of the episodes, either on tv with the spanish subtitles on to help me out or on youtube, without any captions, so I can't understand all the dialog. My Spanish was so rusty that the youtubes that I watched a few months ago I really missed a lot of the details, but now I can do a lot better. I watched all of the very early ones, but I think I missed some in the 15-30 range.
I either didn't see or didn't understand the dialog that gave the backstory about Augustina, Don Dan, and Agatha. I would say, given your description, that jealousy is likely swirling in the mix of Gussie's feelings, and I would add that to my list of Reasons Augustina Doesn't Like Dan: 'Expressed anger, resentment, contempt, and jealousy towards his mother."
Poor Dan. If his mother in law really didn't like either of his parents, he is kinda doomed for ever winning her good graces. That's the least of his problems at the moment, however.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 2:27:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 2:27:00 PM EST
Anita, Gussy is definitely old school. She still makes me think of Edith Bunker and at times of my own mother, who also stayed in an unhappy marriage a lot longer than she should have. Even when it ended, it was my dad who left.
We have indeed come a long way.
Baby. ;)
We have indeed come a long way.
Baby. ;)
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 2:36:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 2:36:00 PM EST
Chris in Fl--
About Abe and the Chilean justice system. He probably had no influence over the process, but knew how long it took. He did suborn the attorney that was assigned to Daniel, since he didn't have any available funds. At any rate, he didn't come back.
After he told Dan that Miriam was DEAD and that he'd rot in jail, there wasn't much of a time lapse before Dan joined the other prisoners in planning their break out, so I can see Abe telling him that and he didn't really care whether it was true or not. The judicial process was slow (as it is here for folks who can't make bail)--regardless of the Constitution's right to a speedy trial. (Maybe the trial has to be speedy, but the process could take a long time?)
About Abe and the Chilean justice system. He probably had no influence over the process, but knew how long it took. He did suborn the attorney that was assigned to Daniel, since he didn't have any available funds. At any rate, he didn't come back.
After he told Dan that Miriam was DEAD and that he'd rot in jail, there wasn't much of a time lapse before Dan joined the other prisoners in planning their break out, so I can see Abe telling him that and he didn't really care whether it was true or not. The judicial process was slow (as it is here for folks who can't make bail)--regardless of the Constitution's right to a speedy trial. (Maybe the trial has to be speedy, but the process could take a long time?)
At this stage and with all the current complications I don't think we'll be seeing any more surprise relatives for Camila. If any of the sketch comedy shows in Mexico was satirizing this program they would have done it, but that would be bad writing at this stage of the novela.
I can only imagine how horrible the realities of paternalism at the time the original stories were written. Thanks to being unemployed I started re-watching Abrazame Muy Fuerte and I'm catching things I missed the first time. Federico's arrogance at believing he had the right to take Cristina's property from her is utterly intolerable.
Carolina, Augustina was very put out at hearing about Agatha; I'm not clear on whether they had ever met.
I can only imagine how horrible the realities of paternalism at the time the original stories were written. Thanks to being unemployed I started re-watching Abrazame Muy Fuerte and I'm catching things I missed the first time. Federico's arrogance at believing he had the right to take Cristina's property from her is utterly intolerable.
Carolina, Augustina was very put out at hearing about Agatha; I'm not clear on whether they had ever met.
Still another Gussie comment:
When Dio was telling her that she was not like all the (many) other women he 'tumbled' with, he spun it in such a way that it made her feel special because while, true, they had done the deed before marriage, there was no way he would have moved on from her, because he only "did it" with her knowing he was going to marry her. While this is still hypocritical, it justified (in her view) their premarital relations. Kind of like a version of a shotgun wedding, but slightly different and not "shameful" in her eyes.
When Dio was telling her that she was not like all the (many) other women he 'tumbled' with, he spun it in such a way that it made her feel special because while, true, they had done the deed before marriage, there was no way he would have moved on from her, because he only "did it" with her knowing he was going to marry her. While this is still hypocritical, it justified (in her view) their premarital relations. Kind of like a version of a shotgun wedding, but slightly different and not "shameful" in her eyes.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 2:50:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 2:50:00 PM EST
Carolina--Missed episodes--the original Operation Shine the Light (not Nanette's part 2) might help if you haven't checked it out lately. On it are Vivi's backstory (which is similar to yours), assumptions and recent revelations (going backwards, not forwards). Your "Reasons" will be going up next.
Anita, though I can't say for sure, I am strongly under the impression that Camila did not live at the ranch until recently. The reason I say this is there are no long-time employees there who act as if they knew her as a girl, she knew little of Cayetonto's family even though the families were closer years ago ( in fact she had to be introduced to Mariano) and there are no real "girl-hood" things, rooms or memories that she talks about to support this. Also, Don Dan invited her to live at the ranch which seems a bit formal if she had lived there as her childhood home.
My impression is that she probably visited there a lot when young and on vacation. She loved it. Ximena not so much.
My impression is that she probably visited there a lot when young and on vacation. She loved it. Ximena not so much.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 3:50:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 3:50:00 PM EST
Barbara--Now that you mention it, you may be 98% correct. We did think it was odd that she had to be introduced to Mariano, but we finally wrote that one off as the Albarran's living in town after Pablo was born.
I'll go with visits to the ranch. There probably was a turnover in ranch employees along the way and even Leocerdo and Piedad didn't come to LMQ until around the time Luzma was born, and that was only 18 years ago.
They really need some of us historians there at Televisa to keep their timelines straight. It just messes with our heads when it doesn't fit the characters.
I'll go with visits to the ranch. There probably was a turnover in ranch employees along the way and even Leocerdo and Piedad didn't come to LMQ until around the time Luzma was born, and that was only 18 years ago.
They really need some of us historians there at Televisa to keep their timelines straight. It just messes with our heads when it doesn't fit the characters.
I agree, Barbara. Probably on school vacations and major holidays. I don't have the impression that she lived there as a young girl and Don Daniel didn't say much -- or anything -- about Francisco Javier.
I think tonight is cap 143 for Por ella and that there are 166 caps.
Looking forward to my telenovio FC.
Looking forward to my telenovio FC.
I seem to remember when Ximena arrived at the MalQ, after her flat tire and meeting Alonso on the highway, she acted like she had never been to the ranch before. She was looking around and saying, wow, nice place.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 4:08:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 4:08:00 PM EST
Last night on Downton Abbey, the Dowager Duchess told Robert, "Our kind of people do not have unhappy marriages" or words to that effect. In other words, "suck it up" and "fake it 'til you make it" So many parallels in these two epics not the least of which is the young "lady" married to the chofer.
—Agnes in NJ
—Agnes in NJ
Which sounds like it doesn't matter that Daniel was in fact an educated man with a profession that requires higher education and normally makes a decent salary. Augustina will always see the chauffeur who mucked out stalls first.
Who else thinks that Camila is pregnant by now?
Who else thinks that Camila is pregnant by now?
UA: if Cam is pregnant, this mess just got way messier.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 5:12:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 5:12:00 PM EST
UA asked "Who else thinks that Camila is pregnant by now?"
I hope she is! Something has to balance the appeal of baby Agatha.
I hope she is! Something has to balance the appeal of baby Agatha.
Actually, I'd rather she not be, but the law of averages dictates that she be pregnant by now.
When will we finally find out about Nat? And if she is we know Iago will try to beg off responsibility. Will Cayetano care enough to get on his case?
When will we finally find out about Nat? And if she is we know Iago will try to beg off responsibility. Will Cayetano care enough to get on his case?
Interesting question. My husband doesn't watch, but from time to time I give him synopses. After I told him about the arrival of the Chileans, I asked him if he thought Camila was pg.
His response? Of course she is. LOL!
His response? Of course she is. LOL!
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 5:42:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 5:42:00 PM EST
If Cam and Nat are pregnant--along with Luz, is that a lot of pregnancies for a typical TN?
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 5:57:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 5:57:00 PM EST
I'm sure Nat is pregnant & the WORST would be to get tied to Yago, Our sweet Rodolfo will marry her & they will live happily para siempre.
Interesting takes on Augustine and Abraham. Based on the avances I saw online, Abe is still due for a beatin'. Augie just needs to take a time out. They're similar people in that nothing is ever their fault, even if it is.
They both have potential for change but will need to do some serious penance first. Maybe they should be forced to marry each other to keep out of everyone else's hair for a bit.
So the standard novela-solution to this whole mess would be to kill off Miriam. That way Cam and Dan stay together with the baby. Splitting the two of them up or splitting up Dan and the baby aren't acceptable. Could Miriam stay in Mexico (with Mariano?) or do the writers have something something else in mind? Maybe a solution that doesn't involve pairing everyone up? Or is that asking too much of even this fine group of writers?
As long as Dan gets to punch Abe in the nose, I can be happy.
Kelly
They both have potential for change but will need to do some serious penance first. Maybe they should be forced to marry each other to keep out of everyone else's hair for a bit.
So the standard novela-solution to this whole mess would be to kill off Miriam. That way Cam and Dan stay together with the baby. Splitting the two of them up or splitting up Dan and the baby aren't acceptable. Could Miriam stay in Mexico (with Mariano?) or do the writers have something something else in mind? Maybe a solution that doesn't involve pairing everyone up? Or is that asking too much of even this fine group of writers?
As long as Dan gets to punch Abe in the nose, I can be happy.
Kelly
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 6:23:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 6:23:00 PM EST
ps. Thanks for the news in slow spanish website. Looks pretty good. I've tried watching news in fast spanish and only get what's happening because of the pictures.
pps. Vivi- Are you still watching QET or did you give up on it? It isn't online anymore that I can find since someone blabbed about posting it. ssshhhhhh.
Kelly
pps. Vivi- Are you still watching QET or did you give up on it? It isn't online anymore that I can find since someone blabbed about posting it. ssshhhhhh.
Kelly
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 6:27:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 6:27:00 PM EST
Carolina- Ximena had been to the ranch before. She said she didn't remember how big/grand the place was. Then Camila pointed out that she was the one who started refusing to come there long ago.
Kelly- Yep. Still watching QET. It's on Dailymotion. Looks like they pulled it off of YouTube. Not sure why since they aren't showing it on UniMas anymore. Jerks!
Kelly- Yep. Still watching QET. It's on Dailymotion. Looks like they pulled it off of YouTube. Not sure why since they aren't showing it on UniMas anymore. Jerks!
Urban- Apparently for Telefuturo/UniMas this isn't so unusual. In any case, it's still showing in all the other countries and has a strong fan base. I really don't know what UniMas's problem is. They were lousy at promoting it; lousy at finding an appropriate time for it; and then stupidly pulled it completely with no information for viewers about the fate of the show.
They could have put it on in daytime instead of having two-hour blocks of something else.
Can anyone identify that gorgeous multi-stepped waterfall in Abrazame Muy Fuerte? Is that the one in Palenque?
Can anyone identify that gorgeous multi-stepped waterfall in Abrazame Muy Fuerte? Is that the one in Palenque?
There are two waterfalls near Palenque (but not actually in the ruins site). They are probably the best known ones in Mexico. Agua Azul is the one Cam-n-Dan went to and it has multi-stepped, travertine, blueish colored pools downstream from where Cam-n-Dan were. The other is Mislo-Ha, but it is a long straight drop. It was probably Agua Azul.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 8:26:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 8:26:00 PM EST
Vivi, thanks for the clarification. Those pesky little verbs and tenses are always tripping me up. :)
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 8:37:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 8:37:00 PM EST
It's probably Agua Azul. It's in the opening credits and at least two episodes out of five. See this.
It sure looks like Agua Azul to me. What a beautiful place.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 8:45:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 8:45:00 PM EST
Wow! Beautiful setting (and very sensuous opening credits). Between that and the Cam-Dan honeymoon, makes me want to go to Chiapas.
Victoria Ruffo said in an interview that she had never previously done a sensuous love scene, but Osvaldo Rios was so good with her that she didn't mind. I guess that led to them being cast as a couple in TdA.
This waterfall was always being mentioned on Univision's message board during the original run of this series. I definitely want to see it live someday.
This waterfall was always being mentioned on Univision's message board during the original run of this series. I definitely want to see it live someday.
Yeah. There wasn't a whole lot that I liked about TdA, but I have to admit that the love scenes between VR and OR were very good, very sensuous- better than the young-uns. That's usually not the case with the older couple. It was a real shame that they broke that couple up.
UA, normally, I too would prefer that Camila not be pregnant so soon. Ideally, she and Dan should first have more time together as a couple. My "I hope she is" reply grew out of my (cold-blooded?) wish to counterbalance the undeniable appeal of baby Agatha.
Nearly thirty years ago, I wandered through Chiapas and on to Antigua and Lago de Atitlán in Guatemala. It's a great area, all of it. I was hoping they would show Palenque on the honeymoon, but I suppose it's hard to film in the ruins sites. Hubby has never been to Chiapas, so we've been talking about going back but haven't made it there yet.
Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 9:11:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 9:11:00 PM EST
Oy; the comments below that video identified it. It's a supremely gorgeous waterfall, but I can only imagine what it sounds like.
I've been fortunate to be able to travel extensively in Mexico, and I really enjoy the travelog aspects of the modern TNs. I was thinking that when Dan became a Mexican citizen, he really needed to spend a getaway weekend in DF with Camila and see a bit of his new country. Maybe head up to Guanajuato, Queretaro, or any of dozens of great destinations in that part of the country. No such luck. And I would love to have seen where Dante went to tour the country, but no such luck there, either.
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Permalink posted by : Monday, February 4, 2013 at 9:31:00 PM EST
: Monday, February 4, 2013 at 9:31:00 PM EST
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