Saturday, October 22, 2011
La Fuerza del Destino #54 Fri 10/21/11 Ivan Learns That Being Politic Means Policing Your Mouth; Carlota and Antolin Put Their Money Where Their Mouth Is; and Caro Declares War
As we pick up from the last visit to Alamos, Carlota is begging Lucia not to follow Lucrecia’s lead by racing to tell Ivan the only way out of this hell for everybody is to give in to Maripaz and convince him to marry her instead of Lucia. (Now I call that “selfish”, self-centered, egotistical and/or just plain M.E.A.N. and so-o-o-o totally Lucre-cia. Why then every time this woman opens her mouth am I even more shocked and scandalized at what comes out of it?) Lucia tells Grammy to talk to the hand and races away leaving Carly and Viewerville wondering will she or wont she.
Across the way at Casota de los McGuire, Licenciado Zavaleta is in a night-time meet with Anthony and Ivan. He’s advising Iv to put his priorities in order. Above all he’s got to come clean about that street fight and why he left the country. Tony suggests that he also have Camilo check on the rancho to see if any of the workers from ten years back are still employed and can remember the incident. Ivan is interrupted by a surprise call from Alex who wants to come over the next day to play with Bruno. Ivan is of course delighted and says he’ll have Benito drive over and pick him up. Things seem to be going well.
On Zabaleta’s way out he emphasizes telling every detail about the street fight, using self-defense and fear as the reason he left the country. Ivan’s worried about putting Lucrazia in a compromising position for which the lovely Lucia would never forgive him. Zabaleta tells him to suck it up and decide. Does he want his son? Does he want to be free from a certain prison sentence? Or does he want to protect those Curiel Amazons above all else? Bottom line, if the gal really loves him, she’ll understand and let him do what’s necessary.
A bit later, Ivan fills Cam in on the earlier discussion. Cam says there’s no reason to take the blame for something he didn’t do. (Naw, Cam will!) Cam offers to tell “the truth” to the judge that he was the one who really killed that farmhand (ten years ago in the street fight that landed Van in the hospital for over a week) while trying to pull him off him. Van refuses, saying that he’s always doubted it was Cam who killed the man because he’s never seen Cam carry a knife. Cam sheepishly says Anto had just finished giving it to him as a gift. Van picks up on the idea that maybe Cam’s renegade big bro may have more likely been the culprit, but Camilo denies it emphatically.
So, Ivan asks Cam if any of the workers from back then are still at the ranch, but Cam confirms they’ve all left and nobody there witnessed or remembers a thing. Ok, then what’s the alternative, asks Cam. Nothing, replies Van, but to explain Merry Piece’s loose morals and lush-ous lifestyle. Otherwise, he could marry her and avoid family humiliation and jail sentences. “—You wouldn’t!!” “—Of course not!” (All of Viewerville simultaneously lets out a sigh of relief. Talk about a fate worse than death! Ivan’s got to be smarter than the average bear, here. He can’t rely on luck and good looks or Tony’s brainpower and sage advice forever! He’s a gálan in a Mexican telenovela, after all!) Lucia calls next and says she’ll come over to the house to be there with Alex and psycho-therapize after she’s done at the bank with Abue Carly.
Later on, at the neighborhood cantina, Cam begs Anto to tell the truth about killing Ivan’s attacker while trying to save his life. Big Bro Anto refuses cuz Ivan’s never done anything special for him, especially since their buddy left as a wetback and returned with every pore oozing American greenbacks. He’s not going to rot in some jail just so Cam’s BFF can gain custody of his son! Antolin, though, says cryptically that he thinks he has a handle on a better way.
Later, in the wee hours of the morning, Anto calls up Merry Piece to threaten her with telling the authorities about him carrying her hush money for that little hit-and-run homicide of hers if she goes through with the custody fight. (Sweet dreams, slut!) Click. Pop. Swooosh-h-h! Anto slugs back a gulp of Tecate and chills.
Benito arrives at Gerardo’s to take Alex back to Casota McGuire to play with Bruno but Carolina refuses to let Alex go with him. (Man can this little shrimpy broad be snippy. Sort of reminds me of some of the little yip-dogs in the neighborhood. All fuzzy and cute but get near them and they curl their upper lips, growl and threaten and snap at you. Next thing you know they’re yipping and yapping at you and grabbing your leg. Well, like hubby says, just shake ‘em off your leg and hope they fly through the goal posts. Je-je. Jes’ kiddin’, doggie lovers.) Where was Ivan’s manners? He should have called first! You don’t just send your child over to some stranger’s like that! Alex interrupts to inform her he went just the day or night before, and Benito has the audacity to remind her they’ve just spent 10 days on vacation together, so what’s with the “perfect strangers” crap? Caro then hides behind a headache and screams at Alex to stop whining!
Carlota takes Lucia to the bank and cancels Lucrecia’s authority to sign checks on her accounts. She adds Lucia onto her account instead. (Viewerville can’t wait to see how Lucrazia manages NOT to take this lying down.)
At the same time, Ivan gives his version of the facts to Judge Porfirio, who tells him that Maripaz accuses him of abandoning her while she was pregnant and never attempting in the ten years that followed to learn the fate of the baby or of her. Van explains that at first MP wanted to abort the baby and then said she would never marry a servant’s son, being part of Alamos’s upper-crusted gentry. The judge comments that that is a new twist in the story and writes it all down. Since it was a private conversation Van unfortunately has no witnesses to this –natch.
So why did Ivan leave Mexico and “abandon” MP? Ivan tells him his sad story about being ultimately disillusioned and depressed and then finding his mother dying due to a botched abortion. He was so distraught and enraged he was looking for a fight--which he got when some criminals attacked him and began to beat him senseless. Luckily out of nowhere his friends, his godmother’s sons, came to his rescue. They frightened them off but Van spent a week in the hospital recovering from his wounds. He wasn’t even able to attend his mother’s burial. The judge is again frustrated because Ivan can’t identify any of his attackers—and of course he opts out of mentioning where they worked, etc. After being rejected for being a poor man and learning MP and the others had left the country for a boarding school, and then having no other ties once his mother died, he decided to try his luck across the border. Yes, he struck it rich and finally returned, but after sending many unanswered letters back home and phoning unsuccessfully several times due to the area having changed the phone numbers.
Ivan did eventually succumb to his nagging curiosity about what might have happened to his child and to his ex-girlfriend. Finally his step-father talked him into returning to clear away/dispel the ghosts of his past. Van has the judge eating out of his hands. However, once the judge says that Merry Piece also has had a sad and painful time of it, he loses it and calls her ambitious, greedy, a lush and an easy lay who is only after his money and hopes to force him into marrying her. (Works for me.) He swears to the judge he’ll pay her whatever she wants but he’ll never give up his son to her! Ruh-roh. Way to screw the pooch big-time, looking like a raving mad-man compared to Merry Piece’s simpering sobs and submissive posturing. Both Zabaleta and Ivan know he’s probably wrecked his chance to win this thing now. His lawyer tells him as much once they’re outside the judge’s chambers.
Zabaleta returns to the judge and asks for a face-to-face chat, but Judge Porfirio says he’s going to require them to meet at court! Happy, happy. Joy, joy. --NOT! Poor Zabaleta looks as if they're about to set off an atomic bomb at court.
Sometime later that day, Ivan tells Cam over a couple of cold brewskis how he tried telling the judge he went to the US illegally to try to make something of himself, but the judge felt he was selfish and didn’t feel he’d tried hard enough to hang onto MP or take care of his child. So what to do? Cam says the judge being it’s family court, should understand these kinds of outbursts since couples are prone to harbor resentments. Perhaps, agrees Van, but it seemed the judge had been won over by Merry Piece playing the victim already for him. What kind of life will the kid have with her? Sure she doesn’t give a darn about him but she’s made the judge think so, he laments. Cam and he agree they’ll have to find a way to show that she’s been lying. But how?
At the same time, Anto in his own way is trying to talk sense into Carolina over this business with Alex. He asks her what harm there could be in Alex visiting Old Man McGuire and the dog, anyway? No! She tells him she doesn’t want him endearing himself with “those people.” Anto tells her that Merry Piece is nuts. “—She’s always drunk, always clubbing and sleeps with anybody! Heck, she even asked him to sleep with her!” But he didn’t, he’s quick to add. He can’t stand women like her. He’d rather have a decent prostitute than a rich b!tch any day! Caro gets upset that he’d consider fooling around with prostitutes, so Anto assures her that since the trip to her cousin’s he’s not touched another woman except for her. Only one woman is stuck in his head and heart and that’s Caro. Smoochies ensue.
Caro asks if Anto’s thinking of marrying her. He says he loves her but he’s got to find some kind of decent job first before he can think of marriage, and he doesn’t think that will be an easy task. He asks why she’d prefer Alex's custody go to a slut like Merry Piece rather than somebody stable like Ivan. Because she’s offered to move in with them so that they could continue to have him live with them there, she says excitedly. Anto says she can’t be serious! The woman would be coming in at all hours of the night, most of the time drunk! It’s crazy! Caro is adamant that she doesn’t care! The important thing is that Alex will continue living with Gerry and her! He insists that if she lets Merry Piece move in with them she’ll make their lives a living hell! Caro doesn’t want to hear it.
Lucia arrives at Casota de los McGuire and gets the lowdown on Caro’s refusing to let Alex come to visit. She decides to speak with Caro personally.
Carlota finds out that the house was sold for the agreed amount of 5 ½ million pesos and tells Lucre-zia. Merry Piece has been standing around and hears it’s sold. She immediately asks for money for her lawyer. Carly says nothin’ doin’ and drops a giant anvil on the two of them from on high: the only ones who can write checks on her account now--and thus go doling out her money--are herself and Lucia! Lucre-zia and MP are WTH?-drop-jaw-impactada! If Lulu could pucker those eyebrows any more she’d have a unibrow.
Lucia stops in at Gerry’s to ask Caro if it was pure orneriness or what that made her refuse to let Alex go play at Ivan’s. Caro tries to divert and claims she’s not allowed to come to her house and insult her like that! And who is she to ask her explanations, anyway? She raised Alex from an infant. She knows what’s suitable for him and what’s not! Ri-i-ight, says Lucia, but she’s related and Carolina isn’t a blood relation. Oh, so now Lucia’s claiming rights that are greater than hers??? Not necessarily, says Lucia, but Caro’s acting out of selfishness and got Alex tied to her skirts and her blindness. She should realize that soon she’ll get married and start a new family with her husband. She has got to think of her future and leave Alex to his own! Caro sneers and suggests that when you’re marrying a millionaire life is so easy!
Lucia says she’s doesn’t get it. Well, sneers Caro with mock self-righteousness, Ivan could turn him into a lazy wastrel or into a drug addict (say wha-a-a-a-t??????). Lucia is like “Get real!” Ivan’s nothing like that! He’d never allow that sort of thing anyway. (Carolina’s apparently been listening to too much American t.v.) On the other hand, continues Lucia, MP is a drunken slut who’s as nutty as a jar of Jiffy Crunch. Caro insists that Merry Piece has promised to leave Alex with them if she could move in.
Lucia says Caro’s dreamin’ if she really thinks Maripaz would do anything of the sort! Besides, If MP moves in there she’ll make their life and that household a living hell-hole. Caro’s just making a big mistake! No, says Caro, it’s Lucia who’s making the mistake here. She doesn’t know the real Caro. Lucia says, with quite a bit of angst, that she’s beginning to and Caro’s not making any points with her, either! Oh, says Caro, you’re putting me down because I’m blind, aren’t you? Lucia makes a major eye-roll (one that Viewerville dearly wishes Caro could see). Caro grits her teeth and tells her than she’ll see again and when she does, the two of them are going to finally look at each other eye-to-eye! Lucia has a “whatever” look in her eyes and heads back out the door.
Meanwhile, Zabaleta is on the phone with Ivan telling him that the day after tomorrow he’s got to be at the judges chambers for the meet with MP. Van tells Tony that he doubts it’ll turn out well for him because of the way he blew up at the judge. That’s to be expected in these sorts of things is Tony’s attitude. The conversation is cut short because JJ Meandragon wants to speak to Tony. Van takes a different way out to avoid having to talk to the guy.
Back at Circo Carlota, Lucrazia asks Carly how she could do such a thing? Why it’s because she no longer can trust her, says Carly. One day they agree on something and the next Lulu does something different. She asked her to give money to Cam for the pesticide but Lulu hasn’t. She asked her not to help out Maripaz in this case against Ivan but she has. Lucrazia tries to lie her way out of it but Carly says doesn’t matter that she “hasn’t done anything”, she promised to and that’s what counts. Carly is tired of her adolescent behavior and her impulsive outbursts. “—Discussion over.” Carly leaves the room. Lucre-zia goes from simmer to slow boil. When the self-absorbed MP asks again for the cash to pay the lawyer, Lucrazia tells MP to go to hell. (Again, cheers go up all over Viewerville! Yessssss!!!!!)
Tony has the meet with Juan Jaime who wants to throw all his packaging and marketing of the other Association’s farmers’ harvest to him. He’s ready to call a meeting to give them the appropriate loans to insure their harvests are huge ones (I think). Tony tells him that he can’t suddenly dole out credit to the rest of the association farmers right now do to familial problems with Ivan that have cornered his attention. JJ sneaks a guess that it’s got to do with his ex- DIL. Yep, says Tony. Well, watch out for that one, warns JJ, cuz she’s a real snake in the grass!
JJ pays a visit to Lulu’s and asks her why she’s got to help Maripaz with the custody business. Lucrazia explains that MP has threatened her over exposing the fact that years ago she sent over her men to beat up Ivan and that during the fracas a man died unless she pays up. Her head man threatened to accuse Ivan of murder so Ivan high-tailed it across the border. Till now she’s never accused him of it and she’s never said a word about it. Lucrazia’s certain Ivan’s never brought it up either out of respect for Lucia because she’d be headed to jail by now. Why did she get involved in something like that, he asks. She explains that she had a daughter pregnant with a servant’s baby! She couldn’t allow them to stay together!
JJ says Ivan is his son, so why not? If he’d recognized him legally, Lucrazia says, that would have been a different story. She asks him for a quickie cash loan in order to pay MP’s lawyer’s fee now that her mother’s taken her name off the joint account. JJ refuses once he hears it’s to pay for MP’s custody case. Finally the guy does something right, even if his reasons are financially self-motivated vis-à-vis McGuire, Inc. Juan Jaime says he’s not exactly a fan of Maripaz, and he thinks it is better for Alex who, after all, is his grandson, to live with Ivan. Lucia begs him to reconsider because now MP will spill the beans and she’ll be accused of attempted murder! (Couldn’t happen to a nicer broad.)
Ivan takes Lucia to a small hotel bungalow for a little afternoon delight. They start discussing Alex and Merry Piece. Lucia is in favor of his telling the whole truth even knowing that this would put both her parents in jail. No, Lucia doesn’t care any longer. Alex comes first (after Ivan, of course). She can’t stand the thought of Alex’s life being turned into a living hell or that her sister might get her own way in all of this!! She says that she and Carly will both testify even if need be. Van says if he loses he knows they’ll have other kids, and he’s thinking there’s got to be another way.
Maripaz decides to take money matters into her own hands and starts going through drawers stealing pearls and other expensive family jewelry to hock for the lawyer’s fee.
In the back yard again, JJ now tries to convince Lucrazia to put her foot down with MP or this blackmail thing is going to become a never-ending story. He’s sure MP’s is too worried about her family name and prestige to ever carry out her threats. She wouldn’t put all that in jeopardy.
The attorney calls to let Merry Piece know about the meeting with Ivan and the judge. Since Van’s claiming she wanted to get an abortion, she’s got to stick to the victim story and make it work. She is afraid that the judge might call her abue to testify, but Lic. Rubiales advises that if she can convince him what a victim she was then she can avoid that. He doesn’t think the judge will call on her granny anyway.
Ivan and Lucia make love (and yeah, during another rainstorm).
Lucrazia complains to Carly about taking her off the joint account and humiliating her this way. She alleges that MP blackmailed her. Carly offers to claim it was her doing. No, it’s worse than that for Lulu cuz the scandal it causes will be humongous [mayúsculo]! “--Again?” Carly gets her back up and says let ‘em. Maripaz isn’t getting one pink peso from her, and that’s that!!
Lulu talks to MP who lies and says she got the money from Antolin. She refuses to accept a financial settlement and leave Alex alone.
Gerry hears about the problem over the visit to play at his own father’s. He is angry because the poor child is all depressed that he’s stuck there and can’t play with a simple dog—all because Caro wants to keep him for her selfish self!! He at least puts his lily-livered foot down afterwards and says the kid will continue going to his swimming lessons and he doesn’t give a damn even if his daughter wins her case, it won’t stop Ivan from coming around his son--and that’s the way it should be! Caro says she heard, loud and clear! But she still hasn’t given up the ghost for the judge to declare for Maripaz! She leaves and Gerry is fit to be tied.
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This is from telenovela world
26 de mayo del 2011, capítulo 54 - Desmiente la declaración. Iván desmiente la declaración de Maripaz. Le dice al juez la verdade, pero al final se exalta, perjudicándose a sí mismo, mientras que Carlota le quita el dinero a Lucrecia. Zavaleta le dice a Iván que debe decidir qué quiere, si tener a su hijo, liberarse de una condena o proteger a la familia Curiel. Camilo ofrece decir que fue él quien mató al trabajador, Iván sospecha que fue Antolín quien realmente lo hizo. Camilo le pide a Antolín decir la verdad sobre el trabajador muerto, pero en cambio, Antolín llama a Maripaz y le dice que si ella saca a relucir eso, él habla sobre el chantaje que le hicieron. Benito llega por Alex, pero Carolina no le da permiso de salir. Carlota pide en el banco que se cancele la firma de Lucrecia y se añada la de Lucía en sus cuentas. Iván se entrevista con el Juez Porfirio, quien le dice que Maripaz lo acusa de abandonarla estando embarazada, Iván le dice que ella en realidad quería abortar y que le dijo que jamás se casaría con el hijo de una sirvienta. Termina de contarle su historia al juez, pero al final se exalta y despotrica contra Maripaz, lo cual es perjudicial para él. Zavaleta decide carear a Iván con Maripaz. Carlota se entera de que ya se vendió la casa y se lo dice a Lucrecia. Maripaz le pide dinero para el abogado, Carlota anuncia que las únicas que pueden disponer de dinero son ella y Lucía. Lucrecia enfurece. Lucía enfrenta a Carolina y le pregunta si fue por maldad que no dejó salir a Alex. Carolina alega que Iván puede convertir en vago o drogadicto a Alex y le informa que Maripaz prometió dejarle a Alex a su cuidado. Lucía la tacha de ilusa. Iván se entera de que habrá un careo entre él y Maripaz, le dice a Anthony que siente que lleva las de perder. Anthony le dice a Juan Jaime que no puede dar los créditos a sus agremiados de inmediato, debido a un problema familiar. Lucía está a favor de que Iván diga toda la verdad, sabe que esto perjudicaría a Gerardo y Lucrecia, pero no desea que la vida de Alex se convierta en un infierno. Lucrecia le cuenta a Juan Jaime que Maripaz la tiene amenazada y le pide dinero prestado para pagar el abogado. Juan Jaime se niega, pues piensa que es mejor para Alex, quien a final de cuentas es su nieto, que se quede con Iván. Maripaz ve que Carlota está jugando solitario y se mete a su recámara para robarle varias joyas. Teme que el juez pueda llamar a declarar a su abuela, pero Rubiales le aconseja que sea muy convincente para evitarlo. Iván lleva a Lucía a un hotelito, donde hacen el amor. Lucrecia le reclama dolida a Carlota que le quitara las firmas, alega que Maripaz la chantajeó. Gerardo le reclama a Carolina por no dejar salir a Alex, le dice que no permitirá que ella aleje a Alex de su verdadero padre. ¿Cómo hará para evitarlo?
Variopinta
26 de mayo del 2011, capítulo 54 - Desmiente la declaración. Iván desmiente la declaración de Maripaz. Le dice al juez la verdade, pero al final se exalta, perjudicándose a sí mismo, mientras que Carlota le quita el dinero a Lucrecia. Zavaleta le dice a Iván que debe decidir qué quiere, si tener a su hijo, liberarse de una condena o proteger a la familia Curiel. Camilo ofrece decir que fue él quien mató al trabajador, Iván sospecha que fue Antolín quien realmente lo hizo. Camilo le pide a Antolín decir la verdad sobre el trabajador muerto, pero en cambio, Antolín llama a Maripaz y le dice que si ella saca a relucir eso, él habla sobre el chantaje que le hicieron. Benito llega por Alex, pero Carolina no le da permiso de salir. Carlota pide en el banco que se cancele la firma de Lucrecia y se añada la de Lucía en sus cuentas. Iván se entrevista con el Juez Porfirio, quien le dice que Maripaz lo acusa de abandonarla estando embarazada, Iván le dice que ella en realidad quería abortar y que le dijo que jamás se casaría con el hijo de una sirvienta. Termina de contarle su historia al juez, pero al final se exalta y despotrica contra Maripaz, lo cual es perjudicial para él. Zavaleta decide carear a Iván con Maripaz. Carlota se entera de que ya se vendió la casa y se lo dice a Lucrecia. Maripaz le pide dinero para el abogado, Carlota anuncia que las únicas que pueden disponer de dinero son ella y Lucía. Lucrecia enfurece. Lucía enfrenta a Carolina y le pregunta si fue por maldad que no dejó salir a Alex. Carolina alega que Iván puede convertir en vago o drogadicto a Alex y le informa que Maripaz prometió dejarle a Alex a su cuidado. Lucía la tacha de ilusa. Iván se entera de que habrá un careo entre él y Maripaz, le dice a Anthony que siente que lleva las de perder. Anthony le dice a Juan Jaime que no puede dar los créditos a sus agremiados de inmediato, debido a un problema familiar. Lucía está a favor de que Iván diga toda la verdad, sabe que esto perjudicaría a Gerardo y Lucrecia, pero no desea que la vida de Alex se convierta en un infierno. Lucrecia le cuenta a Juan Jaime que Maripaz la tiene amenazada y le pide dinero prestado para pagar el abogado. Juan Jaime se niega, pues piensa que es mejor para Alex, quien a final de cuentas es su nieto, que se quede con Iván. Maripaz ve que Carlota está jugando solitario y se mete a su recámara para robarle varias joyas. Teme que el juez pueda llamar a declarar a su abuela, pero Rubiales le aconseja que sea muy convincente para evitarlo. Iván lleva a Lucía a un hotelito, donde hacen el amor. Lucrecia le reclama dolida a Carlota que le quitara las firmas, alega que Maripaz la chantajeó. Gerardo le reclama a Carolina por no dejar salir a Alex, le dice que no permitirá que ella aleje a Alex de su verdadero padre. ¿Cómo hará para evitarlo?
Variopinta
Permalink posted by 
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 9:08:00 AM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 9:08:00 AM EDT
Take care of yourself Jardinera.
Variopinta
Variopinta
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 9:09:00 AM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 9:09:00 AM EDT
Get well soon, Jardinera; and thanks to Variopinta for posting the summary. I pasted it into google translate and found it to be a good exercise to unscramble its translation. It also kept me away from raking leaves for a while.
So, in case it is useful to others, and also to solicit corrections, here is my meta-translation. Anything in italics means I am especially uncertain...
Ivan contradicts the statement of Maripaz. He tells the judge the truth, but in the end he gets excited and injures himself. Meanwhile,Carlota takes the money to Lucrecia.
Zavaleta tells Ivan to decide what he wants; to have his child and avoid a conviction, or to protect the Curiel family.
Camilo offers to say that he killed the worker, Ivan suspects was Antolin who actually did.
Antolin asks Camilo to tell the truth about the dead worker, but instead, Antolin calls Maripaz and tells her that if she mentions it, he will tell about the blackmail.
Benedict arrives for Alex, but Carolina does not give permission for him to leave.
Charlotte asks the bank to disallow Lucretia's account access and to authorize Lucia.
Ivan interviews with Judge Porfirio, who tells him that accuses him of abandoning Maripaz while pregnant, Ivan tells her that she really wanted an abortion and said he would never marry the son of a servant.
He finished telling his story to the judge, but in the end he got excited and began to rant against Maripaz, which was bad for his case.
Zavaleta decides to confront Ivan with (about?) Maripaz.
Carlota learns the house has been sold and tells Lucrecia.
Maripaz asks for money for the attorney/ Charlotte announces that the only ones to get the money are she and Lucia. Lucrecia is angry.
Lucia confronts Carolina and asks if it was for evil that she did not let Alex go out.
Carolina argues that Ivan could become lazy or a drug addict and tells her that Maripaz promised to leave Alex in her care.
Lucia branded as delusional.
Ivan learns that there will be a confrontation between him and Maripaz and tells Anthony that he feels he is losing.
Anthony tells Juan Jaime that he can not give credit to its members immediately, due to a family problem.
Lucia is in favor of Ivan telling the whole truth, but she knows that it would hurt Gerardo and Lucrecia, but does not want Alex's life to become hell.
Lucrecia tells Juan Jaime that Maripaz has threatened her and wants to borrow money to pay the lawyer.
Juan Jaime refuses because he thinks it is best for Alex, who in the end is his grandson, to stay with Ivan.
Maripaz sees that Charlotte is playing solitaire and goes to her room to steal more jewels.
He (?) fears that the judge may call his grandmother to testify, but Rubiales advised to be very convincing about it.
Ivan takes Lucia to a little hotel, where they make love. (awww)
Lucrecia is hurt that Carlota took her off the accounts and alleges that Maripaz blackmailed her.
Gerardo complains to Carolina about not letting Alex go out. She tells him she will not let Alex away from his true father.
How will you avoid it?
So, in case it is useful to others, and also to solicit corrections, here is my meta-translation. Anything in italics means I am especially uncertain...
Ivan contradicts the statement of Maripaz. He tells the judge the truth, but in the end he gets excited and injures himself. Meanwhile,Carlota takes the money to Lucrecia.
Zavaleta tells Ivan to decide what he wants; to have his child and avoid a conviction, or to protect the Curiel family.
Camilo offers to say that he killed the worker, Ivan suspects was Antolin who actually did.
Antolin asks Camilo to tell the truth about the dead worker, but instead, Antolin calls Maripaz and tells her that if she mentions it, he will tell about the blackmail.
Benedict arrives for Alex, but Carolina does not give permission for him to leave.
Charlotte asks the bank to disallow Lucretia's account access and to authorize Lucia.
Ivan interviews with Judge Porfirio, who tells him that accuses him of abandoning Maripaz while pregnant, Ivan tells her that she really wanted an abortion and said he would never marry the son of a servant.
He finished telling his story to the judge, but in the end he got excited and began to rant against Maripaz, which was bad for his case.
Zavaleta decides to confront Ivan with (about?) Maripaz.
Carlota learns the house has been sold and tells Lucrecia.
Maripaz asks for money for the attorney/ Charlotte announces that the only ones to get the money are she and Lucia. Lucrecia is angry.
Lucia confronts Carolina and asks if it was for evil that she did not let Alex go out.
Carolina argues that Ivan could become lazy or a drug addict and tells her that Maripaz promised to leave Alex in her care.
Lucia branded as delusional.
Ivan learns that there will be a confrontation between him and Maripaz and tells Anthony that he feels he is losing.
Anthony tells Juan Jaime that he can not give credit to its members immediately, due to a family problem.
Lucia is in favor of Ivan telling the whole truth, but she knows that it would hurt Gerardo and Lucrecia, but does not want Alex's life to become hell.
Lucrecia tells Juan Jaime that Maripaz has threatened her and wants to borrow money to pay the lawyer.
Juan Jaime refuses because he thinks it is best for Alex, who in the end is his grandson, to stay with Ivan.
Maripaz sees that Charlotte is playing solitaire and goes to her room to steal more jewels.
He (?) fears that the judge may call his grandmother to testify, but Rubiales advised to be very convincing about it.
Ivan takes Lucia to a little hotel, where they make love. (awww)
Lucrecia is hurt that Carlota took her off the accounts and alleges that Maripaz blackmailed her.
Gerardo complains to Carolina about not letting Alex go out. She tells him she will not let Alex away from his true father.
How will you avoid it?
I forgot to mention that I have not seen the episode yet. More opportunities for getting it wrong...
Whew! Makes me glad I missed this episode. [Still hiding in the MP scaredy-cat club]
But I sure hope you feel better soon, Jardinera. And I still would love to read your recap :)
Audrey
But I sure hope you feel better soon, Jardinera. And I still would love to read your recap :)
Audrey
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 2:00:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 2:00:00 PM EDT
I hope you feel better soon Jardinera!
Audrey I completely understand being afraid. I FF through MP and Carolina scenes as they both sicken me.
Audrey I completely understand being afraid. I FF through MP and Carolina scenes as they both sicken me.
So sorry you are sick. Hope you feel better sooner. Thanks to anonymous for the recap en espanol, it will make my brain work a bit harder than normal. And thanks to GatoViejo for the translation in case the old brain gives up.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 3:48:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 3:48:00 PM EDT
I did start watching this episode, but when MP was crying to the judge like the poor victim she isn't, with tears flowing down her face, I just couldn't take it any more and turned off the TV.
By then I had already seen Carolina demand that Gerry go along with MP's extortion/blackmail so that Alex would live with her. Basta!
Do folks think this TN is really going to go the direction of Ivan marrying MP? Or are they just playing with our minds?
Audrey
By then I had already seen Carolina demand that Gerry go along with MP's extortion/blackmail so that Alex would live with her. Basta!
Do folks think this TN is really going to go the direction of Ivan marrying MP? Or are they just playing with our minds?
Audrey
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 3:51:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 3:51:00 PM EDT
Oh, wait! I guess all that stuff happened in the previous episode! I guess I didn't watch any last night - LOL!
Audrey
Audrey
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 3:56:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 3:56:00 PM EDT
Audrey,
There is plenty of telenovela precedent for a protagonist(a) living in a forced marriage for some unbelievable reason. If it is a protagonista, there will of course be no physical relations, but men are weak so Ivan would probably have no such restriction.
I came late to this novela, so I am wondering if Lucia has a martyr complex; she seems quick to hand off Ivan to MP without a fight.
There is plenty of telenovela precedent for a protagonist(a) living in a forced marriage for some unbelievable reason. If it is a protagonista, there will of course be no physical relations, but men are weak so Ivan would probably have no such restriction.
I came late to this novela, so I am wondering if Lucia has a martyr complex; she seems quick to hand off Ivan to MP without a fight.
Yes, Lucia totally has a martyr complex, that's part of the setup for all sorts of things that could go horribly wrong.
But she is ferocious in defense of Alex's best interests, so that tempers her complex at times.
Lucia and MP are like the mothers in front of Solomon, arguing over the child. Except in this case, the true mother would accept the child being cut in half - as has been mentioned by commenters before.
Audrey
But she is ferocious in defense of Alex's best interests, so that tempers her complex at times.
Lucia and MP are like the mothers in front of Solomon, arguing over the child. Except in this case, the true mother would accept the child being cut in half - as has been mentioned by commenters before.
Audrey
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 4:23:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 4:23:00 PM EDT
For translations, I find the google dictionary very helpful, you just double click the word & it gives the meaning. I've had it so long I don't really remember how I loaded it, but just search google dictionary. It saves having to go to your online or hard copy dictionary.
Variopinta
Variopinta
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 4:27:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 4:27:00 PM EDT
Audrey - the forced marriage thing does look like it could happen. If we are put through this, my hunch is that Ivan may not sleep with MP but will be made to think he has to some point (as GatoViejo noted). I just hope they don't go there with the story.
I know there has to be conflict but it becomes less fun when the good guys roll over and play dead.
I know there has to be conflict but it becomes less fun when the good guys roll over and play dead.
What a great resource, GatoViejo! I never knew it existed. Thank you! Here's my best (non-mechanical) effort at a translation.
Desmiente la declaración.
He refutes her statement.
Iván desmiente la declaración de Maripaz. Le dice al juez la verdad, pero al final se exalta, perjudicándose a sí mismo, mientras que Carlota le quita el dinero a Lucrecia.
Ivan refutes Maripaz’s statement. He tells the judge the truth but at the end he lets his anger get the better of him and ends up doing damage to his own case; meanwhile Carlota takes away Lucrecia’s money.
Zavaleta le dice a Iván que debe decidir qué quiere, si tener a su hijo, liberarse de una condena o proteger a la familia Curiel.
Attorney Zavaleta tells Iván that he has to decide what he wants: to have custody of his son; to avoid going to jail; or to protect the Curiel family.
Camilo ofrece decir que fue él quien mató al trabajador, Iván sospecha que fue Antolín quien realmente lo hizo.
Camilo offers to say that he killed the worker (ten years ago); Iván suspects that it was really Antolín.
Camilo le pide a Antolín decir la verdad sobre el trabajador muerto, pero en cambio, Antolín llama a Maripaz y le dice que si ella saca a relucir eso, él habla sobre el chantaje que le hicieron.
Camilo asks Antolín to tell the truth about the dead worker but instead Antolín calls Maripaz and tells her that if she mentions that incident, he’ll tell them about her blackmail.
Benito llega por Alex, pero Carolina no le da permiso de salir.
Benito comes to pick up Alex but Carolina won’t give him permission to go out.
Carlota pide en el banco que se cancele la firma de Lucrecia y se añada la de Lucía en sus cuentas.
Carlota asks the bank to remove Lucrecia as a signatory on her accounts and add Lucía’s name instead.
Iván se entrevista con el Juez Porfirio, quien le dice que Maripaz lo acusa de abandonarla estando embarazada, Iván le dice que ella en realidad quería abortar y que le dijo que jamás se casaría con el hijo de una sirvienta.
Iván meets with Judge Porfirio; the judge tells him that Maripaz is accusing him of abandoning her during her pregnancy. Ivan tells the judge that in fact she wanted to abort the pregnancy and she told him she would never marry a servant’s son.
Termina de contarle su historia al juez, pero al final se exalta y despotrica contra Maripaz, lo cual es perjudicial para él.
He finishes telling his story to the judge but at the end he lets his anger get the better of him and he lets loose a string of invectives against Maripaz which ends up damaging his own credibility.
Zavaleta decide carear a Iván con Maripaz.
Attorney Zavaleta decides to summon Iván and Maripaz for a face-to-face session (careo).
{Actually, I thought it was Judge Porfirio who made the decision.}
Carlota se entera de que ya se vendió la casa y se lo dice a Lucrecia.
Carlota learns that the house has been sold and she tells Lucrecia.
Maripaz le pide dinero para el abogado, Carlota anuncia que las únicas que pueden disponer de dinero son ella y Lucía. Lucrecia enfurece.
Maripaz asks her (Lucrecia) for money for the lawyer. Carlota announces that the only two people have access to her money: she herself and Lucía. Lucrecia is furious.
Desmiente la declaración.
He refutes her statement.
Iván desmiente la declaración de Maripaz. Le dice al juez la verdad, pero al final se exalta, perjudicándose a sí mismo, mientras que Carlota le quita el dinero a Lucrecia.
Ivan refutes Maripaz’s statement. He tells the judge the truth but at the end he lets his anger get the better of him and ends up doing damage to his own case; meanwhile Carlota takes away Lucrecia’s money.
Zavaleta le dice a Iván que debe decidir qué quiere, si tener a su hijo, liberarse de una condena o proteger a la familia Curiel.
Attorney Zavaleta tells Iván that he has to decide what he wants: to have custody of his son; to avoid going to jail; or to protect the Curiel family.
Camilo ofrece decir que fue él quien mató al trabajador, Iván sospecha que fue Antolín quien realmente lo hizo.
Camilo offers to say that he killed the worker (ten years ago); Iván suspects that it was really Antolín.
Camilo le pide a Antolín decir la verdad sobre el trabajador muerto, pero en cambio, Antolín llama a Maripaz y le dice que si ella saca a relucir eso, él habla sobre el chantaje que le hicieron.
Camilo asks Antolín to tell the truth about the dead worker but instead Antolín calls Maripaz and tells her that if she mentions that incident, he’ll tell them about her blackmail.
Benito llega por Alex, pero Carolina no le da permiso de salir.
Benito comes to pick up Alex but Carolina won’t give him permission to go out.
Carlota pide en el banco que se cancele la firma de Lucrecia y se añada la de Lucía en sus cuentas.
Carlota asks the bank to remove Lucrecia as a signatory on her accounts and add Lucía’s name instead.
Iván se entrevista con el Juez Porfirio, quien le dice que Maripaz lo acusa de abandonarla estando embarazada, Iván le dice que ella en realidad quería abortar y que le dijo que jamás se casaría con el hijo de una sirvienta.
Iván meets with Judge Porfirio; the judge tells him that Maripaz is accusing him of abandoning her during her pregnancy. Ivan tells the judge that in fact she wanted to abort the pregnancy and she told him she would never marry a servant’s son.
Termina de contarle su historia al juez, pero al final se exalta y despotrica contra Maripaz, lo cual es perjudicial para él.
He finishes telling his story to the judge but at the end he lets his anger get the better of him and he lets loose a string of invectives against Maripaz which ends up damaging his own credibility.
Zavaleta decide carear a Iván con Maripaz.
Attorney Zavaleta decides to summon Iván and Maripaz for a face-to-face session (careo).
{Actually, I thought it was Judge Porfirio who made the decision.}
Carlota se entera de que ya se vendió la casa y se lo dice a Lucrecia.
Carlota learns that the house has been sold and she tells Lucrecia.
Maripaz le pide dinero para el abogado, Carlota anuncia que las únicas que pueden disponer de dinero son ella y Lucía. Lucrecia enfurece.
Maripaz asks her (Lucrecia) for money for the lawyer. Carlota announces that the only two people have access to her money: she herself and Lucía. Lucrecia is furious.
gag, if Iván marries MP, that just does not happen in real life except for dinero, & Iván doesn't need money. Marrying someone you hate, ¡POR FAVOR!
Please, not another drunk, drugged sex scene!!!!!
Varopinta
Please, not another drunk, drugged sex scene!!!!!
Varopinta
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 4:37:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 4:37:00 PM EDT
Part 2
Lucía enfrenta a Carolina y le pregunta si fue por maldad que no dejó salir a Alex. Carolina alega que Iván puede convertir en vago o drogadicto a Alex y le informa que Maripaz prometió dejarle a Alex a su cuidado. Lucía la tacha de ilusa.
Lucía confronts Carolina and asks her why she didn’t let Alex go out – was she trying to be mean? Carolina claims that Ivan might turn Alex into a good-for-nothing or a drug addict; and she tells her that Maripaz promised to leave Alex in her care. Lucía tells her she is being naive and gullible.
Iván se entera de que habrá un careo entre él y Maripaz, le dice a Anthony que siente que lleva las de perder.
Iván learns there will be a ‘careo’ between him and Maripaz; he tells Anthony that he thinks he is likely to lose.
Anthony le dice a Juan Jaime que no puede dar los créditos a sus agremiados de inmediato, debido a un problema familiar.
Anthony tells Juan Jaime that he can’t extend the loans to his growers immediately because of a family problem.
Lucía está a favor de que Iván diga toda la verdad, sabe que esto perjudicaría a Gerardo y Lucrecia, pero no desea que la vida de Alex se convierta en un infierno.
Lucía is in favor of Iván telling the whole truth; she knows that this would hurt Gerardo and Lucrecia but she doesn’t want Alex’s life to become a living hell.
Lucrecia le cuenta a Juan Jaime que Maripaz la tiene amenazada y le pide dinero prestado para pagar el abogado. Juan Jaime se niega, pues piensa que es mejor para Alex, quien a final de cuentas es su nieto, que se quede con Iván.
Lucrecia tells Juan Jaime that Maripaz is threatening her and she asks him to lend her money to pay the lawyer. Juan Jaime refuses since he thinks it is better for Alex – who, after all, is his grandson – to live with Iván.
Maripaz ve que Carlota está jugando solitario y se mete a su recámara para robarle varias joyas.
Maripaz sees that Carlota is playing solitaire and she sneaks into her bedroom to steal several pieces of jewelry.
Teme que el juez pueda llamar a declarar a su abuela, pero Rubiales le aconseja que sea muy convincente para evitarlo.
She (Maripaz) is afraid the judge may call her grandmother to make a statement but her lawyer, Rubiales, advises her to be very convincing to keep that from happening.
Iván lleva a Lucía a un hotelito, donde hacen el amor.
Iván takes Lucía to a little hotel where they make love.
Lucrecia le reclama dolida a Carlota que le quitara las firmas, alega que Maripaz la chantajeó.
Lucrecia is hurt that Carlota removed her as a signatory on the accounts; she claims that Maripaz blackmailed her.
Gerardo le reclama a Carolina por no dejar salir a Alex, le dice que no permitirá que ella aleje a Alex de su verdadero padre. ¿Cómo hará para evitarlo?
Gerardo rebukes Carolina for not letting Alex go out; he tells her that he won’t allow her to keep Alex away from his real father. How will he stop her?
Lucía enfrenta a Carolina y le pregunta si fue por maldad que no dejó salir a Alex. Carolina alega que Iván puede convertir en vago o drogadicto a Alex y le informa que Maripaz prometió dejarle a Alex a su cuidado. Lucía la tacha de ilusa.
Lucía confronts Carolina and asks her why she didn’t let Alex go out – was she trying to be mean? Carolina claims that Ivan might turn Alex into a good-for-nothing or a drug addict; and she tells her that Maripaz promised to leave Alex in her care. Lucía tells her she is being naive and gullible.
Iván se entera de que habrá un careo entre él y Maripaz, le dice a Anthony que siente que lleva las de perder.
Iván learns there will be a ‘careo’ between him and Maripaz; he tells Anthony that he thinks he is likely to lose.
Anthony le dice a Juan Jaime que no puede dar los créditos a sus agremiados de inmediato, debido a un problema familiar.
Anthony tells Juan Jaime that he can’t extend the loans to his growers immediately because of a family problem.
Lucía está a favor de que Iván diga toda la verdad, sabe que esto perjudicaría a Gerardo y Lucrecia, pero no desea que la vida de Alex se convierta en un infierno.
Lucía is in favor of Iván telling the whole truth; she knows that this would hurt Gerardo and Lucrecia but she doesn’t want Alex’s life to become a living hell.
Lucrecia le cuenta a Juan Jaime que Maripaz la tiene amenazada y le pide dinero prestado para pagar el abogado. Juan Jaime se niega, pues piensa que es mejor para Alex, quien a final de cuentas es su nieto, que se quede con Iván.
Lucrecia tells Juan Jaime that Maripaz is threatening her and she asks him to lend her money to pay the lawyer. Juan Jaime refuses since he thinks it is better for Alex – who, after all, is his grandson – to live with Iván.
Maripaz ve que Carlota está jugando solitario y se mete a su recámara para robarle varias joyas.
Maripaz sees that Carlota is playing solitaire and she sneaks into her bedroom to steal several pieces of jewelry.
Teme que el juez pueda llamar a declarar a su abuela, pero Rubiales le aconseja que sea muy convincente para evitarlo.
She (Maripaz) is afraid the judge may call her grandmother to make a statement but her lawyer, Rubiales, advises her to be very convincing to keep that from happening.
Iván lleva a Lucía a un hotelito, donde hacen el amor.
Iván takes Lucía to a little hotel where they make love.
Lucrecia le reclama dolida a Carlota que le quitara las firmas, alega que Maripaz la chantajeó.
Lucrecia is hurt that Carlota removed her as a signatory on the accounts; she claims that Maripaz blackmailed her.
Gerardo le reclama a Carolina por no dejar salir a Alex, le dice que no permitirá que ella aleje a Alex de su verdadero padre. ¿Cómo hará para evitarlo?
Gerardo rebukes Carolina for not letting Alex go out; he tells her that he won’t allow her to keep Alex away from his real father. How will he stop her?
careo
Confrontation, meeting face to face
http://www.wordmagicsoft.com/dictionary/es-en/careo.php
Variopinta
Confrontation, meeting face to face
http://www.wordmagicsoft.com/dictionary/es-en/careo.php
Variopinta
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 4:45:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 4:45:00 PM EDT
Feel better Jardinera!
Variopinta, can you post the link to telenovela world (the spanish language link)? I have been looking for Spanish synopses for TNs but have never been able to find them.
Wow, thank you to everyone for your translations, also!
Variopinta, can you post the link to telenovela world (the spanish language link)? I have been looking for Spanish synopses for TNs but have never been able to find them.
Wow, thank you to everyone for your translations, also!
Feel better, Jardinera. Hope you will be up and feeling well shortly.
How depressing a forced marriage would be but I'm enjoying the chess moves going on to get to whatever happens next. My speculation (not based on spoilers) is that MP will trap Ivan and then fall for someone else with money(Augustin?)
Love it that even that rascal JJ and that appealing bad boy Antolin agree that MP would be the worse of all possible mothers.
How depressing a forced marriage would be but I'm enjoying the chess moves going on to get to whatever happens next. My speculation (not based on spoilers) is that MP will trap Ivan and then fall for someone else with money(Augustin?)
Love it that even that rascal JJ and that appealing bad boy Antolin agree that MP would be the worse of all possible mothers.
Up until now, this TN has surprised at times, leading up to a supposed classic TN cliché but then surprise us at the last minute. And often things that could have been dragged out over weeks have gotten resolved quickly. On the other hand, I saw the Carmen tells Saul about MP/Alex -> Saul tells MP -> MP takes advantage sequence coming a mile away.
So I honestly don't know what to think about what is coming next.
CAVEAT LECTOR (reader beware): Speculation follows (not spoilers), but you might want to skip the rest of this post if you really don't want to think ahead. [Any responders might also want to post a warning]
Following the obvious TN cliches would predict something like this:
* Ivan submits to a marriage "por interés" with MP so that he can be with Alex, but of course no matter how hard MP tries to seduce him she only gets "desprecio" instead. Meanwhile, Lucia suffers miserably as MP takes every opportunity to pretend she is making progress with Ivan.
* The minute Ivan gets married, Lucia discovers she is pregnant (of course, since they've been going at it like newlyweds). Of course also, because we all know the female protagonista always becomes pregnant if she has been having premarital sex with the man she loves.
* Camilo is patiently waiting in the wings to "help Lucia out" in any way he can, which of course in this case would be to step in as father/husband for the child she is expecting.
* Everyone is miserable for weeks until the final unraveling when the powers-that-be discover MPs true nature - but only after poor Alex's life has been hell for way too long. Or - suddenly MP goes "poof" removing everyone's hell on earth. FIN
So, I just can't figure out if it is going to go in this direction yet. If it does, I don't plan to suffer through it.
We are more than halfway through, I think, so I wonder that if this was going to be the ultimate situation, why did they take so much time to build to this "obvious" point?
Who knows? I hope the writers surprise us, 'cause otherwise - who needs it?
Audrey
So I honestly don't know what to think about what is coming next.
CAVEAT LECTOR (reader beware): Speculation follows (not spoilers), but you might want to skip the rest of this post if you really don't want to think ahead. [Any responders might also want to post a warning]
Following the obvious TN cliches would predict something like this:
* Ivan submits to a marriage "por interés" with MP so that he can be with Alex, but of course no matter how hard MP tries to seduce him she only gets "desprecio" instead. Meanwhile, Lucia suffers miserably as MP takes every opportunity to pretend she is making progress with Ivan.
* The minute Ivan gets married, Lucia discovers she is pregnant (of course, since they've been going at it like newlyweds). Of course also, because we all know the female protagonista always becomes pregnant if she has been having premarital sex with the man she loves.
* Camilo is patiently waiting in the wings to "help Lucia out" in any way he can, which of course in this case would be to step in as father/husband for the child she is expecting.
* Everyone is miserable for weeks until the final unraveling when the powers-that-be discover MPs true nature - but only after poor Alex's life has been hell for way too long. Or - suddenly MP goes "poof" removing everyone's hell on earth. FIN
So, I just can't figure out if it is going to go in this direction yet. If it does, I don't plan to suffer through it.
We are more than halfway through, I think, so I wonder that if this was going to be the ultimate situation, why did they take so much time to build to this "obvious" point?
Who knows? I hope the writers surprise us, 'cause otherwise - who needs it?
Audrey
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 5:59:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 5:59:00 PM EDT
BTW - I am watching Pasión on YouTube at the moment, and it was such a hoot to see Asciano (Antolín) be totally floored when he first sees Inés (Carolina). Smoking hot - yet again!
[But don't tell me what happens between them yet because I am only on Ep 17 - long way to go]
Audrey
[But don't tell me what happens between them yet because I am only on Ep 17 - long way to go]
Audrey
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 6:03:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 6:03:00 PM EDT
Telenovela world
http://foro.telenovela-world.com/n4/list.php?f=835
Variopinta
http://foro.telenovela-world.com/n4/list.php?f=835
Variopinta
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 6:25:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 6:25:00 PM EDT
The Monster in the Living Room
Part I
Placating and enabling the most dysfunctional family member is nothing new, nor is it especially unusual. Ask anyone with a substance abuser within the immediate family and they will have stories like this. In the name of family peace and/or public reaction or somebody's sense of guilt, people will permit the dysfunctional one to get away with everything.
All my female friends and I are from dysfunctional families. None of us were the family problem and none of us were favored by our families.
Brunhilde, the friend with the least issues, has a younger sister (Waltraude) who fell into depression and dropped out of college in her last semester. She didn't hold a paycheck job until after their mother died and she was almost forty years old. All the time prior to that Brunhilde tried getting her off her butt to get her to work to no avail. The mother was no help and Brunhilde became the family breadwinner as the mother got closer to retirement age and disapproved of every guy she dated. When the mother died Brunhilde laid down the law to Waltraude about not continuing to allow her to sponge off her. Waltraude had to go on welfare for a while, but is now self-supporting. She rents a room in a house in almost a student-housing arrangement, but is not dependent on Brunhilde. About a year after their mother's death, she told her that their mother had admitted to her that she never wanted either of them to be on their own. Brunhilde is married and has a son, something the mother had never wanted to happen.
Blanche, the friend with the most issues, had an alcoholic narcissist for a mother and she eventually married Sam, a man whose father was an alcoholic narcissist. In both families the non-alcoholic spouse was the enabler, always preventing the rest of the family from confronting the bad seed and attempting to keep them from saying or doing anything in the alcoholic's presence that would upset him/her. Blanche's mother would sit up all night, yelling at and insulting her family, even setting furniture on fire. Once when Blanche was a girl her mother came home drunk with a strange man who was trying to boink her in his car. A few years later she chased Blanche up the stairs with a kitchen knife. She was committed for that. During Blanche's youth there was no Betty Ford clinic and mental health facilities weren't equipped to deal effectively with alcoholics, so her mother would stay until she dried out (about three weeks), get released, and a month later the cycle would start over again. After a while her father gave up and became a traveling salesman, so he was home for only one week out of every month. Blanche's mother didn't get any better, she flirted with Blanche's high school boyfriends and made scenes at Blanche's school events. She couldn't wait to go away to college. Sam's family wasn't any better. Both ended up with severe self-esteem issues and Blanche's two older brothers are serious misogynists. The older one is now dying of Parkinson's Disease while continuing to abuse his wife and the younger one has cut himself off from Blanche.
Part I
Placating and enabling the most dysfunctional family member is nothing new, nor is it especially unusual. Ask anyone with a substance abuser within the immediate family and they will have stories like this. In the name of family peace and/or public reaction or somebody's sense of guilt, people will permit the dysfunctional one to get away with everything.
All my female friends and I are from dysfunctional families. None of us were the family problem and none of us were favored by our families.
Brunhilde, the friend with the least issues, has a younger sister (Waltraude) who fell into depression and dropped out of college in her last semester. She didn't hold a paycheck job until after their mother died and she was almost forty years old. All the time prior to that Brunhilde tried getting her off her butt to get her to work to no avail. The mother was no help and Brunhilde became the family breadwinner as the mother got closer to retirement age and disapproved of every guy she dated. When the mother died Brunhilde laid down the law to Waltraude about not continuing to allow her to sponge off her. Waltraude had to go on welfare for a while, but is now self-supporting. She rents a room in a house in almost a student-housing arrangement, but is not dependent on Brunhilde. About a year after their mother's death, she told her that their mother had admitted to her that she never wanted either of them to be on their own. Brunhilde is married and has a son, something the mother had never wanted to happen.
Blanche, the friend with the most issues, had an alcoholic narcissist for a mother and she eventually married Sam, a man whose father was an alcoholic narcissist. In both families the non-alcoholic spouse was the enabler, always preventing the rest of the family from confronting the bad seed and attempting to keep them from saying or doing anything in the alcoholic's presence that would upset him/her. Blanche's mother would sit up all night, yelling at and insulting her family, even setting furniture on fire. Once when Blanche was a girl her mother came home drunk with a strange man who was trying to boink her in his car. A few years later she chased Blanche up the stairs with a kitchen knife. She was committed for that. During Blanche's youth there was no Betty Ford clinic and mental health facilities weren't equipped to deal effectively with alcoholics, so her mother would stay until she dried out (about three weeks), get released, and a month later the cycle would start over again. After a while her father gave up and became a traveling salesman, so he was home for only one week out of every month. Blanche's mother didn't get any better, she flirted with Blanche's high school boyfriends and made scenes at Blanche's school events. She couldn't wait to go away to college. Sam's family wasn't any better. Both ended up with severe self-esteem issues and Blanche's two older brothers are serious misogynists. The older one is now dying of Parkinson's Disease while continuing to abuse his wife and the younger one has cut himself off from Blanche.
The Monster in the Living Room
Part II
My own story involves a younger brother who started using drugs at a very young age. He forged checks from our mother's checkbook, he stole money from her purse, and sold his best stuff to feed his habit. When it finally came to lawyers, courtrooms, and methadone, my mother begged, borrowed, and almost stole to pay for lawyers, doctors, and whatever to straighten him out. This went on for years. When I was 16 years old she threatened to pull me out of school to make me go to work. I don't know where she got the money but when my brother almost completed his methadone treatment she got him a full mouth of dental implants instead of dentures. Braces for my teeth would have cost half as much but she insisted I didn't need them (I was aiming for a theatrical career). His academic failure was not a big concern to her and my straight As meant nothing. Other relatives would get on her case about my brother, telling her to let the state put him in a juvenile facility, but she wouldn't. Did I mention that she was a narcissist? She was profoundly ashamed that my brother was the way he was because “such things don't happen in respectable families” and she envied me my potential because I was vastly better-educated than she was. She took a trip to Europe to visit her mother and sisters on the eve of my high school graduation and therefore wasn't present for the ceremony. Nobody in the Old Country was dying, getting married, or having a baby. Both my mother and brother are now dead and after years of being functional I'm seeing a shrink because a series of events in a short time period set me back.
A lot of denial goes on in dysfunctional families and Lucrezia is in denial. She doesn't allow herself to realize that Maripaz is a bottomless pit. She doesn't dare realize that Lucia has choices she didn't have or that Maripaz made bad choices right out of school. She also won't face that she is willing to make her good daughter miserable because she envies other people's happiness.
Part II
My own story involves a younger brother who started using drugs at a very young age. He forged checks from our mother's checkbook, he stole money from her purse, and sold his best stuff to feed his habit. When it finally came to lawyers, courtrooms, and methadone, my mother begged, borrowed, and almost stole to pay for lawyers, doctors, and whatever to straighten him out. This went on for years. When I was 16 years old she threatened to pull me out of school to make me go to work. I don't know where she got the money but when my brother almost completed his methadone treatment she got him a full mouth of dental implants instead of dentures. Braces for my teeth would have cost half as much but she insisted I didn't need them (I was aiming for a theatrical career). His academic failure was not a big concern to her and my straight As meant nothing. Other relatives would get on her case about my brother, telling her to let the state put him in a juvenile facility, but she wouldn't. Did I mention that she was a narcissist? She was profoundly ashamed that my brother was the way he was because “such things don't happen in respectable families” and she envied me my potential because I was vastly better-educated than she was. She took a trip to Europe to visit her mother and sisters on the eve of my high school graduation and therefore wasn't present for the ceremony. Nobody in the Old Country was dying, getting married, or having a baby. Both my mother and brother are now dead and after years of being functional I'm seeing a shrink because a series of events in a short time period set me back.
A lot of denial goes on in dysfunctional families and Lucrezia is in denial. She doesn't allow herself to realize that Maripaz is a bottomless pit. She doesn't dare realize that Lucia has choices she didn't have or that Maripaz made bad choices right out of school. She also won't face that she is willing to make her good daughter miserable because she envies other people's happiness.
Urban- Thank you so much for sharing your and your friends' stories. Whenever we think tns are just way over the top, we get real world examples that some of this stuff happens everyday. The Curiels are indeed a dysfunctional family that will just destroy itseld if someone doesn't decide to jump out of the ugly circle they are in. Gerry did jump out for a while, and took Alex with him. But now he has put himself and Alex right back into the middle of that dysfunction, and he should have known better. Screw what Carolina wants.
Speaking of Caro. She and Antolin proved the theory in this episode that some poeople are better together than as individuals. Alone together, they are loving, kind and charming, and I want to root for them as a couple. But back in the real world, with others, they both put their selfish desires above people who care about them.
I was particularly miffed when Anto complained about Ivan never doing anything for HIM. And Caro basically threatening Lucia. I really could have slapped them both multiple times upside their thick heads.
Thanks for the Spanish and translated versions of the summaries Variopinta, Gato Viejo and others.
Feel better Jardinera!
Speaking of Caro. She and Antolin proved the theory in this episode that some poeople are better together than as individuals. Alone together, they are loving, kind and charming, and I want to root for them as a couple. But back in the real world, with others, they both put their selfish desires above people who care about them.
I was particularly miffed when Anto complained about Ivan never doing anything for HIM. And Caro basically threatening Lucia. I really could have slapped them both multiple times upside their thick heads.
Thanks for the Spanish and translated versions of the summaries Variopinta, Gato Viejo and others.
Feel better Jardinera!
Well Lucia may cater to MP, but no way would Ivan go along. I hope. Besides, Antolin realizes the horribleness of MP and wouldn't he be able to make Carolina eventually see the truth? He's the only one she listens to. Or maybe they need to move MP into Carolina's house and let her find out what she's, and more importantly Alex, getting in to. She'll be begging for help from Ivan. Or Antolin may have to step up and admit the murder to protect Alex for Carolina's sake.
(UA- Sorry about your history. Sounds like you all have been living a real-life novela. Where's a real life Antolin when you need one?)
(UA- Sorry about your history. Sounds like you all have been living a real-life novela. Where's a real life Antolin when you need one?)
Permalink posted by : Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 9:47:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, October 22, 2011 at 9:47:00 PM EDT
You're welcome. I used to be assistant manager of a forum on this subject and the stories there were the stuff of nightmares.
What many people who don't live this stuff fail to realize is that this kind of family toxicity is a gift that keeps on giving. That's a lesson we get in novelas including the Family Secrets Act, which dictates that all the ugliest stuff stays at home. Where it becomes an infection that kills because no outside healer is admitted to do anything.
Let Carolina deal with Maripaz. She had some gall talking as she did to Lucia. Which she wouldn't dare do in front of Gerry.
What many people who don't live this stuff fail to realize is that this kind of family toxicity is a gift that keeps on giving. That's a lesson we get in novelas including the Family Secrets Act, which dictates that all the ugliest stuff stays at home. Where it becomes an infection that kills because no outside healer is admitted to do anything.
Let Carolina deal with Maripaz. She had some gall talking as she did to Lucia. Which she wouldn't dare do in front of Gerry.
Urban, thank you for sharing. Like they say, you can't make this stuff up! I'm sorry for what you had to go through.
Your point about narcissism disguised as motherly love and devotion is well taken.
Your point about narcissism disguised as motherly love and devotion is well taken.
Narcissists are incapable of being good parents. With mothers and daughters, the daughter is a fashion accessory to the mother if she is a pretty child. This ends at the age of about 5 when the daughter stops being a doll and starts showing evidence of a personality manifesting itself in a desire to individuate. From that day forward she is of no value to the mother. The mother gets competitive with the daughter for the attention of the men in their lives and later with people in general. Blanche's and my mother were like this.
Narcissistic fathers get competitive with their sons, but I think this may take a little longer, starting with the son's puberty. Sam's father used to flirt with his high school girlfriends. There was some US miniseries back in the 80s (I wish I could remember the title) where a wealthy narcissistic father seduced his daughter-in-law and carried on an affair with her behind his son's back, finally flaunting it.
Lucrezia is narcissistic about what she thinks her position is (or perhaps what it once was) in local society. She will go to any lengths to protect it. Nobody can convince her she is living in the past. She isn't delusional about the gossip; the song "Harper Valley PTA" was written about places like Alamos. However, unless she stops caring about it she won't be able to do a thing about Maripaz.
Maripaz is an even bigger narcissist than her mother. Being shipped off to a foreign boarding school may have felt like rejection to her and it probably was partly that: Lucrezia was abdicating emotional responsibility for her. She was also avoiding teaching her any sense of responsibility for herself at what is arguably the most critical lifestage for doing so. No rules were established. Drop this already flirtatious girl into a culture with more personal freedom and she becomes a promiscuous slut in a misguided attempt at popularity and a feeling that society's rules don't apply to her. She gets home to a theoretically clean slate, but applies the same snobbery as her mother in her dealings with Ivan, who would have worked his arse off taking care of her and the baby. However, the marriage would eventually have become like her parents' because she would never be satisfied. She's a bottomless pit in that she will always want more than anyone could ever give her.
Juan Jaime is a textbook example of the narcissistic father. He favored Saul because Saul was his mirror image up to a certain point and scapegoated David because he dared to differ from expectation. Everyone around him must by definition be less than he is, which is why he constantly insults them. On some level he knows that people will frequently live down to expectation and he will continue to tyrannize his family until they all either walk out on him or collectively call him on his BS. Which could make him walk.
Saul is turning out to be exactly like his father, which is why the two of them are at odds now.
Narcissists never think there is anything wrong with themselves and therefore never go to shrinks. This is why the only thing to do with them is limit your contact with them, even if that means cutting them out of your life.
Narcissistic fathers get competitive with their sons, but I think this may take a little longer, starting with the son's puberty. Sam's father used to flirt with his high school girlfriends. There was some US miniseries back in the 80s (I wish I could remember the title) where a wealthy narcissistic father seduced his daughter-in-law and carried on an affair with her behind his son's back, finally flaunting it.
Lucrezia is narcissistic about what she thinks her position is (or perhaps what it once was) in local society. She will go to any lengths to protect it. Nobody can convince her she is living in the past. She isn't delusional about the gossip; the song "Harper Valley PTA" was written about places like Alamos. However, unless she stops caring about it she won't be able to do a thing about Maripaz.
Maripaz is an even bigger narcissist than her mother. Being shipped off to a foreign boarding school may have felt like rejection to her and it probably was partly that: Lucrezia was abdicating emotional responsibility for her. She was also avoiding teaching her any sense of responsibility for herself at what is arguably the most critical lifestage for doing so. No rules were established. Drop this already flirtatious girl into a culture with more personal freedom and she becomes a promiscuous slut in a misguided attempt at popularity and a feeling that society's rules don't apply to her. She gets home to a theoretically clean slate, but applies the same snobbery as her mother in her dealings with Ivan, who would have worked his arse off taking care of her and the baby. However, the marriage would eventually have become like her parents' because she would never be satisfied. She's a bottomless pit in that she will always want more than anyone could ever give her.
Juan Jaime is a textbook example of the narcissistic father. He favored Saul because Saul was his mirror image up to a certain point and scapegoated David because he dared to differ from expectation. Everyone around him must by definition be less than he is, which is why he constantly insults them. On some level he knows that people will frequently live down to expectation and he will continue to tyrannize his family until they all either walk out on him or collectively call him on his BS. Which could make him walk.
Saul is turning out to be exactly like his father, which is why the two of them are at odds now.
Narcissists never think there is anything wrong with themselves and therefore never go to shrinks. This is why the only thing to do with them is limit your contact with them, even if that means cutting them out of your life.
Jardinera, so sorry to hear that you are ill. I am sending good vibrations for your speedy recovery. Now that the Alborada reruns have ended, I'm not really watching any novelas. I surf in to Fuerza once in awhile, but I have no idea what's going on except that Maripaz is making mischief. I did see Antolin at Carolina's bedside one time. He is looking so fine. I guess I'll have to start reading the recaps and try to get back in to this show.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, October 23, 2011 at 4:54:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, October 23, 2011 at 4:54:00 PM EDT
UA - thanks for sharing your story and those of your friends. It is very eye-opening.
GatoViego and Novelamaven (get to see you here)- thanks for your recaps. And Variopinta thanks for the Spanish recap.
Question - what did Caro threaten/say to Lucia? Thanks in advance.
GatoViego and Novelamaven (get to see you here)- thanks for your recaps. And Variopinta thanks for the Spanish recap.
Question - what did Caro threaten/say to Lucia? Thanks in advance.
Hi Karen,
This is what I wrote above (it's just a translation of the Telemundo summary):
Lucía enfrenta a Carolina y le pregunta si fue por maldad que no dejó salir a Alex. Carolina alega que Iván puede convertir en vago o drogadicto a Alex y le informa que Maripaz prometió dejarle a Alex a su cuidado. Lucía la tacha de ilusa.
Lucía confronts Carolina and asks her why she didn’t let Alex go out – was she trying to be mean? Carolina claims that Ivan might turn Alex into a good-for-nothing or a drug addict; and she tells her that Maripaz promised to leave Alex in her care. Lucía tells her she is being naive and gullible.
In other words, Carolina claims she's afraid Iván will be a bad influence on Alex. Maripaz, on the other hand, has promised that she'll let Alex stay with Carolina (and Gerardo).
And Lucía thinks Carolina is either being malicious or she is just beyond gullible.
This is what I wrote above (it's just a translation of the Telemundo summary):
Lucía enfrenta a Carolina y le pregunta si fue por maldad que no dejó salir a Alex. Carolina alega que Iván puede convertir en vago o drogadicto a Alex y le informa que Maripaz prometió dejarle a Alex a su cuidado. Lucía la tacha de ilusa.
Lucía confronts Carolina and asks her why she didn’t let Alex go out – was she trying to be mean? Carolina claims that Ivan might turn Alex into a good-for-nothing or a drug addict; and she tells her that Maripaz promised to leave Alex in her care. Lucía tells her she is being naive and gullible.
In other words, Carolina claims she's afraid Iván will be a bad influence on Alex. Maripaz, on the other hand, has promised that she'll let Alex stay with Carolina (and Gerardo).
And Lucía thinks Carolina is either being malicious or she is just beyond gullible.
I can't remember the exact wording, but Caro obviously thought that Lucia was trying to boss her around and said something like, "when I can see again, it's on bitch". Again, not exact words, but the basic sentiment.
Carolina is being selfish. She has no understanding of Ivan's feelings about having been denied his child all these years. She may be bitter about having been sidelined by her blindness since she was 12; I'll bet she's never had a date her entire life and Antolin is her first hint of romance. I would also doubt that she's had enough of Maripaz' company to know how evil she really is.
Her rant about Ivan being a bad influence is a smokescreen for her own fear of abandonment.
Her rant about Ivan being a bad influence is a smokescreen for her own fear of abandonment.
I think Carolina is mostly really insecure. She's apparently lost her parents and her sister and doesn't have much family left; there's a cousin that we know of but nobody really close. Since she's blind, she's very dependent on others, currently Gerry, to take care of her. Her one function in life has been to help with Alex. If she loses him, what does she have to do, and what reason does Gerry have to keep her around? Of course he's promised to continue to support her, but she'd probably feel like more of a freeloader if she didn't have the "job" of taking care of Alex.
Now she has the possibility of getting sight back, but what if the operation didn't work? Also, seeing again is going to be a big adjustment, and it would be more comforting to have Alex near and not have more changes at the same time.
Caro is being a horrible brat but she's nowhere near as antagonistic as Maripaz. I don't know why someone hasn't suggested to her that she should join Alex at Ivan's house; Ivan has to work so Alex will still need someone to supervise him.
Now she has the possibility of getting sight back, but what if the operation didn't work? Also, seeing again is going to be a big adjustment, and it would be more comforting to have Alex near and not have more changes at the same time.
Caro is being a horrible brat but she's nowhere near as antagonistic as Maripaz. I don't know why someone hasn't suggested to her that she should join Alex at Ivan's house; Ivan has to work so Alex will still need someone to supervise him.
Thanks all! It's finally up.
Thanks to GatoViejo, Variopinta and Novelamaven/ViviDC for helping out with the highlights.
Saw the narcissism discussion which was fascinating but have to do more than glance at it so that'll be later on.
Thanks to GatoViejo, Variopinta and Novelamaven/ViviDC for helping out with the highlights.
Saw the narcissism discussion which was fascinating but have to do more than glance at it so that'll be later on.
Thanks Jardinera. It was a great read. Lots more yummy detail than the Spanish synopsis. I hope posting it means you are feeling much better!
Hmmmm - not sure I can stomach tonight's episode either. You watchers have much stronger stomachs than I. I'd just like to see MP sweating at the hands of Antolín.
Do you think many of the TN writers have taken that first year psychology course? I get that impression at times. I seem to remember loads of students carrying around the Abnormal Psychology text - probably part of the pre-med curriculum, plus also all those psychology students. I was an engineering student so not even biology for me - only math and the hard sciences.
Audrey
P.S. And whomever posted that MP just needs to hook up with local rich guy Agustín - I'm still LOL over that one!
Hmmmm - not sure I can stomach tonight's episode either. You watchers have much stronger stomachs than I. I'd just like to see MP sweating at the hands of Antolín.
Do you think many of the TN writers have taken that first year psychology course? I get that impression at times. I seem to remember loads of students carrying around the Abnormal Psychology text - probably part of the pre-med curriculum, plus also all those psychology students. I was an engineering student so not even biology for me - only math and the hard sciences.
Audrey
P.S. And whomever posted that MP just needs to hook up with local rich guy Agustín - I'm still LOL over that one!
Permalink posted by : Monday, October 24, 2011 at 8:34:00 AM EDT
: Monday, October 24, 2011 at 8:34:00 AM EDT
NovelaMaven and Vivi thanks for telling me know about Caro.
Jardinera, thanks for your recap. I hope you're fully recovered.
Jardinera, thanks for your recap. I hope you're fully recovered.
Jardinera, I hope you're feeling better.
Re Psych 101: In my first semester at uni I was warned "Never date a psych major; they're the sickest people on campus. They all take psych to find out what's wrong with themselves."
We need to wonder about Lucia, I guess. I say she needs a rematch with Maripaz.
Re Psych 101: In my first semester at uni I was warned "Never date a psych major; they're the sickest people on campus. They all take psych to find out what's wrong with themselves."
We need to wonder about Lucia, I guess. I say she needs a rematch with Maripaz.
Maripaz should move in with Carolina right now. Then Caro will see just why everyone is freaking out about this. Alex will suffer for a little while, but hopefully Caro would come to her senses, maybe when she gets her vision back and can see this Antolin guy she's been making out with. Hubba hubba.
But when Maripaz went to spill the beans to Alex about her being his mama, he said "who's she?" If he didn't know who she was then Caro hasn't seen much of her and doesn't get it. Wouldn't this be an issue in the courts? I mean, MP thought he was just her half-brother, but still never went to see him in 10 years? This should be a red flag, or pink at least.
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But when Maripaz went to spill the beans to Alex about her being his mama, he said "who's she?" If he didn't know who she was then Caro hasn't seen much of her and doesn't get it. Wouldn't this be an issue in the courts? I mean, MP thought he was just her half-brother, but still never went to see him in 10 years? This should be a red flag, or pink at least.
Permalink posted by : Monday, October 24, 2011 at 1:19:00 PM EDT
: Monday, October 24, 2011 at 1:19:00 PM EDT
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