Friday, March 05, 2010
Mujeres Asesinas 2, Thursday, March 4: The case of the mistrustful mujer and the neighbor no one listened to.
Tonight, Edith Gonzalez is "Clara, Fantasiosa" (Clara, imaginative)
A maintenance guy drags around a mop and bucket and picks up mail from the floor of an apartment building before taking his mop and bucket and climbing the stairs to the elevator. He opens the elevator door and gasps at whatever he sees.
Let's check out some hot chicks in red dresses, cause that's the last pleasant thing we'll see this episode, I'm sure. Que emane….
A woman uses a straightened out wire clothes hanger to get mail out of a mailbox. The maintenance guy chides her for it. She uses the excuse of not having a key, but he says she could have asked him to open the box for her. Ana Layevska, last seen in Querida Enemiga, and not looking too healthy, walks in to the building and the first woman…ok, I'm going to have to run to IMDB again, cause this show takes too long to give names for anybody…Woman #1, played by Edith Gonzalez is Clara and Woman #2, played by Ana Layevska is Marcela…anyway, Clara starts accosting Marcela with "what are you looking at?" and accuses her of being "Beatriz" and writing letters to Clara's husband. Marcela denies it, but Clara insists that she is Beatriz and is having an affair with Clara's husband. She keeps screaming "you" as the elevator rises. Well, Clara, unless IMDB is lying to me, that's not Beatriz. Whether she's having an affair with your husband remains to be seen.
Back in her apartment, Clara opens the letters. She picks up the phone and calls "Eduardo" to leave him a message that she's waiting for him. The man in question walks in, played by Rene Casados, who is currently in Corazon Salvaje as Noel. His hair is much greyer here, but only half as fluffy. This is a man who's not afraid of a little volume. Maybe he used to be in a hair band and is just trying to keep the dream alive. Anyway, she starts right in with "How did it go? What did you do? Where were you? I just left you a message!" He counters that it wasn't 1 message, it was 12. Also, he talked to the doorman. "How far are you going to go? Do you want us to get kicked out of this building?" She objects that they didn't get kicked out of the last one, they left. He reminds her that they left to avoid being kicked out due to the scandal. She starts to promise something, but he cuts her off. He wonders when things got screwed up between them and why it's so hard for her to accept that he loves her. He doesn't want any more promises. Clara starts playing with her nails.
Marcela brings a tray of tea or coffee into a room where Perla (played by Silvia Mariscal, who I last saw as Jaime Camil's mom on Tontas) sits knitting. She nervously wonders if she remembered to shut the door and Perla says she did and to chill out already. Perla calls Carla a "poor woman" but Marcela says she was worried Clara was going to do something to her. "But why?" "Because she thinks I'm her husband's lover." "Well are you?" "No!" "Then don't worry about it. She'll find the one who is and fight with her." Setting aside for a moment the question of whether Marcela really is sleeping with Eduardo, I'm not sure that it really matters to Carla--if she thinks Marcela's the one, that's enough for her.
Eduardo is fixing his tie in the mirror and gets instantly tense when Clara walks up behind him. She asks him if he's going to see Beatriz. "Did you not hear anything I just told you? Who the hell is Beatriz, anyway?" Clara insists that if he's not going to see her, then all he has to do is say so, and besides they both know who Beatriz is. When Eduardo's eyeballs look like they're about to spontaneously pop out of his head, she starts with the "I'm sorry"-s. She begs him to stay home, but he says he's just going to "the agency." He asks, and she hasn't taken her meds yet because it wasn't time. He says he'll be back later to take her to the doctor. He kisses her on the forehead and says he loves her.
Marcela is waiting for the elevator. When Eduardo gets out, she gets in. They exchange hello's, but it's still unclear whether they even know each other or whether she's thinking "Oh, it's the crazy woman's husband" and he's thinking "Don't look, don't look or Clara will think this is the one!"
At a car dealership, a saleswoman talks to a woman about a car, but fails to close the deal. As the woman walks off, Eduardo walks in. He asks the saleswoman how it went and comments that these days people would rather fix up an old tricycle than buy a new car. The woman nods sadly and tells him that Clara called. Three times. He goes into his office and the saleswoman follows him and asks what he's going to do. We finally get the woman's name, Patricia (played by Lili Brillanti, who's been in a bunch of things I've seen, but for whatever reason, I don't recognize her). Eduardo says that they haven't been in the new apartment long, but the neighbors already are making a fuss. He's still taking her to a psychiatrist and, in fact, they just changed to a new one who came highly recommended. He doesn't think it's done her any good. Hmmm, I'm going to armchair diagnose her with Borderline Personality Disorder http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/disorders/borderlinepd.htm but I'll have to see how this all winds up.
Clara sits in a kind of fancy-looking living room, wearing sloppy sweats and holding one of Eduardo's shirts in her lap. She's playing with her hair, so her mom, Mrs. Soler, asks if she wants to go to the salon. "A haircut will strengthen your hair." Clara says she doesn't have time. She insists Eduardo's cheating on her, but Mrs. S brushes it off. Clara has her mom smell the shirt, but she doesn't smell anything. "You don't understand because you don't have to keep an eye on dad." Mrs. S reminds her that he's dead. "Exactly. The only men who don't cheat on us are the dead ones."
In the post-murder timeline, Forense Gerardo watches a tech zip up the body bag. Still no word on who's in it.
Eduardo and Patricia sit and have coffee. Eduardo says he takes Clara to the doc once a month or maybe once every fifteen days, it just depends. Sometimes he takes her or sometimes she goes alone or with her mother. He notices the time and says she has an appointment today and he wants to take her. Patricia supposes Clara must be at home and says she's having a bad time. Eduardo agrees and says he's having a bad time too…a really bad time. Patricia asks if Clara has ever thought that they…"Yes, she has. But don't worry, now I'm with Beatriz, a neighbor." He doesn't roll his eyes, exactly, it's more like he's just too tired to even bother.
At the doc's office, Clara isn't even listening, although she says she is, when Eduardo says she keeps being jealous and causing scenes. Eduardo mentions her pills and Clara insists they're to keep her doped up so that he can go out with other women. The doctor challenges her, "How do you know they're to keep you doped up?" But she doesn't really answer his question, she just tells him he doesn't understand. The doctor says he does understand, he's a doctor. He says she's been receiving treatment for a year. "But I'm fine. You're both exaggerating." Eduardo asks her to tell the doctor about the bells. She sighs and we get a flashback.
Clara is tying bells and chimes above the bedroom door. She explains that since she's on the pills and they make her sleep, she hung the bells above the bedroom door so that if he went out they would wake her up. Yeah, brilliant, but he can also duck to avoid them.
"It was only for a while." The doc asks if Eduardo didn't take them down and he answers something along the lines of "What should I have done?" or "What could I do?" but I'm not clear on whether he did take them down or whether he felt like he had to leave them up. The doctor sighs at his answer and Clara says that the two of them, the doctor and Eduardo, are plotting behind her back. She tells Ed that he's trying to get her out of the way so that he can be with Beatriz. She tells the doctor that Eduardo wants her locked up there so he can cheat with Beatriz. The doctor says no one's talking about having her admitted and what she needs to do is keep following the treatment and she'll get better little by little. Eduardo is nodding.
As they leave the office, Eduardo asks her where she got the idea that he was trying to have her locked up. She says because they didn't ask her for ID or anything, so how do they know she's really his wife, really Clara. He asks if she's really taking her medication. "Why do you ask?" That would be a no, methinks. He says she seems to be getting worse and worse and he's worried about her. They're sitting on a park bench and she tells him to go back to work so he won't worry. He'd rather take her home first. He asks her if she wouldn't like an ice cream from a cart nearby. She's surprised that he would buy her an ice cream and laughs. He reminds her that they once agreed he would get her the sun, moon, and stars. She keeps laughing, "like when we were dating." He's laughing too and says, "yeah, I used to recite you poetry," and he goes over to the ice cream cart. He gets two cones and hands her one. He reminds her that their promises were mutual. "You're throwing it in my face." He insists he's not, he just wants her to be well…and for them to have the sun, moon, and stars. They're both laughing. That's the power of ice cream. But eventually it melts, and the crazy starts again.
Forense Gerardo reports to Det. Capellan that there's not a lot to say. It was the same weapon for all the wounds and there were 64 stabs--add one to the stabbing column for this season. He figures someone very angry or very scared would have made that many wounds.
Marcela finishes getting ready. Perla comments that she hasn't seen her this happy in a long time. Marcela says she's going out with some girlfriends. Perla says it's been a long time since she's gone out and maybe she'll meet someone. "And what would you think if I did? Meet someone." Perla says she thinks Marcela needs to have a life again. "It's been two years since my son died. You can't keep taking care of me forever. There's nothing sadder than a young widow." Marcela says maybe later, but now she's gotta go. Perla tells her to have a good time.
When Marcela gets out of the elevator, Clara is waiting on the stairs for her, still eating her ice cream cone. Damn, I want one now. Upholding my earlier theory, the ice cream itself is gone and it looks like the crazy is back. Clara just wants a word with "Beatriz" to resolve this in the best way possible. Marcela insists that she's not "Beatriz" and that Clara is mistaking her for someone else. Clara shows her the ice cream cone and says her husband bought it for her and she sensed that he loves her. LOVES HER. "That's nice, "says Marcela, "I'm glad your husband loves you. That's the way it should be, isn't it?" She walks off and Clara keeps munching on her cone.
Back in her apartment, Clara picks up a picture of a blond woman…herself as a blond? I can't tell. She picks up the phone and calls the auto dealership. Patricia picks up the phone. She very loudly announces that it's Clara and Eduardo makes the international sign for "I'm not here" so Patricia says he's with a client. Clara hangs up. For one thing, Patricia doesn't sound very convincing. For another, I don't care if this coworker is my soul brother, if he's got a crazy wife who constantly thinks he's cheating, I am not going to lie for him--that way only leads to the crazy wife either thinking you're the mistress or accusing you of covering for him. Either way, it ups the probability of you ending up in a pool of blood.
Patricia finishes up with a client jut as Clara shows up asking for Eduardo. Clara heads right for his office as he throws out his hands and begs her not to make a scene at work. She says she just called and they told her he was with a client, so obviously that means he bought her ice cream and then went to go shag Beatriz. Yes, of course, because when a man buys you ice cream it always means he's getting it somewhere else, how did I miss the signs! Clara keeps asking him where he was as the phone starts ringing. Ed hesitates, so Clara says if he won't answer it, she will. As she and Ed both slap hands on the receiver, the phone stops ringing. Patricia comes over and tells Eduardo it's a Mr. somebody calling about the sedan. He tells Patricia he'll call the guy back. When Patricia leaves, Eduardo asks Clara what she needs and what she wants. "We can't go on like this." Clara thinks he's finally gotten up the guts to leave her. Eduardo says he's always had the guts, but he keeps trying because he loves her. Clara rushes him and grabs him. She starts crying and saying she needs help.
At the police station, Det. Capellan asks Eduardo if he noticed any changes in his wife. Ed says sometimes she got better, but…. He claims he did supervise her treatment, but he couldn't be with her constantly because he had to work.
Clara plays with one of her pills, eventually dropping it in a glass of water and watching it fizz. She pours it into a plant.
Capellan asks Eduardo if the doctor ever used the word "delirio" (delusion). Capellan says specifically, jealous delusions--jealousy with distortion of reality. Ed kind of smiles and she goes on to say, "You look at your wife lovingly--she thinks you have a lover. You bring her flowers--she thinks you have a lover." Eduardo says he understands, but isn't it too late for this?
Marcela, looking sickly again, gets off the elevator. Clara follows her. Out at the street, Clara gets up in her face and says "You're my husband's lover." Marcela insists that she's not, nor is her name Beatriz, and if Clara doesn't cut it out, she's going to the cops. Clara says she's mocking her and she'd better watch out.
Marcela is getting some pastries at a nearby café when Clara comes up behind her and says "Hi, Beatriz." Clara says they can end this very easily if Marcela just shows her some ID to prove she's not Beatriz. Marcela gets upset and begs Clara to leave her alone. She runs out of the café and Clara says, "See how I found you out! See how you are my husband's lover!" She goes up to the counter and says she'll take the bread that Marcela ran off without.
Clara reports to the doctor that she's feeling better. Much better. She thinks it's all over. She asks the doctor, just hypothetically, if he would show ID if one of his patients asked. He's confused and points to his credentials on the wall, saying "I'm a psychiatrist." But, just saying, what if a patient wanted to see that he really is who he says he is. The doctor says he supposes that if it were necessary, he would let a patient see his ID. Clara smiles. I think the good doctor just screwed Marcela over without meaning to.
Marcela and Perla are sitting in the apartment when someone knocks on the door. Marcela looks scared. She creeps up to the door and checks the peephole before unlocking the door. It's the doorman, who came to bring her the mail like she asked. Marcela gets the mail and then shuts the door in the guy's face. She comments to Perla that it's incredible what she's having to do because of that crazy woman.
Clara brings the pastries to her mom. She tells mom that mom can only stay for a little while because Clara is very busy. "With what?" Clara offers her mom coffee, but mom says Clara's not supposed to be drinking coffee with her medication. "Of course I can." Mom complains that it's impossible to get Clara out of the house and she never dresses up, even with all the nice clothes she has. Clara grabs mom's handbag and tells her to please leave. She insists she's busy and walks her mom out.
Perla thinks Marcela should have just shown Clara some ID. Marcela says she shouldn't have to. Perla insists that she would have done it and ended this. "First she's crazy, now she's making you crazy." Marcela thinks she needs to keep something from happening. "How, by killing that woman?" Marcela thinks it's not a bad idea. Perla is shocked.
"Were those her words?" Capellan asks Perla. Perla says yes, "It wouldn't be a bad idea to kill her." She wonders how it got to that point.
Clara serves Eduardo the bread she got from the bakery earlier for dinner. He's a little freaked out that she's just serving him bread. She grabs a piece and puts it on her plate and tells him, "Oh, I know, you're tired of eating this, but you eat it every day with Beatriz, so now you'll eat it with me." She takes a fork and knife and cuts herself a piece of bread, telling him to eat. He asks if she took her pills and she says of course she did.
There's a rattling at the door of Perla and Marcela's apartment. Perla gets up and calls out, "Marcela, is that you?" and the rattling stops.
Marcela gripes to the doorman, who tries to say that maybe Perla imagined it, but Perla objects to that. The doorman insists that he was on duty all day and no strangers came into the building. Marcela says it must have been someone from the building.
Clara's mom goes to Eduardo's work to complain about Clara. She's upset about Clara throwing her out and because she doesn't seem to be getting better. Eduardo insists that he's doing everything he can, because he loves her. And because she's his wife. He tells her that it doesn't matter what he does, every day she gets worse. He says the person he most loves is slipping away.
Forense Gerardo and Det. Capellan are looking at something in the lab when Aranda comes in. She tells Capellan that there was a previous report, but it wasn't investigated. Capellan looks at the file.
Marcela tells a cop what's going on with Clara. The cop says it's normal for Clara to have shown up at the same bus stop and café, "After all, you're neighbors, why wouldn't you shop in the same places?" Marcela insists that the woman is dangerous. The cop finally agrees to take the report, but he doesn't think they'll do much, since he doesn't see a threat. Marcela keeps insisting and asks how much farther it has to go before they do something. He asks her to sign something and she says, "you aren't going to do anything, are you?" She signs the paper and starts to leave, then turns around and says, "You won't do anything because there's been no threat? Fine, here's one, 'I'm going to kill that woman. I, Marcela Rodriguez, am going to kil that woman.' Put that down on your paper." She leaves.
Capellan tells Aranda to rain down hell on the dipshits who ignored the report. She says they'd better be ready to explain in front of the judge why they did nothing. "Because now I've got a dead body." Aranda leaves.
Marcela gets on the elevator and Eduardo asks her to wait and gets on with her. She looks really scared.
In her apartment, she considers possible weapons and ends up putting kitchen shears in her purse.
Eduardo sits in his apartment, drinking a beer and smoking a cigarette. Marcela opens the door partway and knocks. She comes in and she and Eduardo say hi, but he sticks his head out the door to check the hallway. She says she didn’t want to be rude earlier, in the elevator, and says she's his neighbor, from 6C. He asks if she's looking for his wife and says she's out. Marcela wanted to talk to both of them, but that's fine, she'll talk to him. She starts to come further into the apartment, but Eduardo freaks out, pointing at the door and saying "Clara!"
Clara is down at that café with her mom. She insists she's got to leave now and her mom asks why she's being this way about her husband. Clara says he's going to go off with Beatriz. "Why would he want me? My hair's falling out, I'm gross, and I can't give him a kid." Mom insists that Eduardo loves Clara, but she's just as convinced that he's sleeping with someone else and she can't understand why mom doesn't get it. She leaves.
Standing in the foyer of the apartment, Eduardo apologizes for what Clara has done, but asks her to be patient. Marcela says she's been patient, but she's afraid Clara will do something to her or to her mother-in-law. Eduardo says she's crazy, but she won't do anything. Marcela is as astounded at him as she was at the cop, "Are you not listening to me?" Eduardo insists that she's not dangerous, but she is crazy and jealous and about to come home, so he's really going to have to ask Marcela to leave.
Clara realizes the elevator is upstairs, so she takes the stairs.
Marcela insists that Eduardo talk to Clara and he says he will. He all but shoves her out the door and calls "thanks" after her. He leaves the door open and goes back inside.
Marcela gets in the elevator and takes it upstairs just as Clara comes up the stairs. Marcela goes into her apartment and Clara to hers, realizing that the door is open. She walks in slowly and sees Eduardo, sitting in the living room eating. "You brought her here, didn't you?" Eduardo heads her off by asking if she talked to her mother, "She's very worried about you. She says you yelled at her in the bakery." Clara insists that he took advantage of her being out to bring Beatriz into their house.
Marcela tells Perla about her conversation with Eduardo. "What is she going to have to do for them to believe me? Kill me?"
Clara says this is why he wanted to move to this apartment building. Eduardo loses it and starts screaming a bunch of stuff that gets muted out and then, "Who is this Beatriz? Where is she?" He pretends he's got her in his hands and then blows her away and says "there, she's gone!" Clara insists her perfume is there. Eduardo asks her to listen to him, but we're way past that now.
Marcela complains that Perla isn't the one being followed around, so of course, it's easy for her. "When your son was sick everybody had an opinion, 'chemotherapy, naturopathy,' they even want to try Reiki. And now when I've got a problem, everybody's got an opinion again, that I'm exaggerating, that I'm worrying about nothing, that she's not going to do anything. The last thing I need is for them to say the crazy woman is me. Everybody has an opinion, but nobody does anything."
Perla tells Capellan that Marcela was right. Nobody did anything, they all kept quiet, and they're all guilty. "We were all accomplices."
Marcela is sleeping.
Clara is sleeping and Eduardo strokes her hair.
Marcela wakes up at 6:30 the next morning. As does Clara. She puts on lipstick. Clara slips into her running shoes and a robe. Marcela brushes her hair. Clara goes into the kitchen and grabs a knife from a drawer. Marcela puts on perfume. She checks her purse and takes out the kitchen shears. She leaves them on her dressing table and leaves. Clara tucks the knife into the sleeve of her robe. Marcela waits for the elevator. Clara watches it go up.
"Why didn't you comply with treatment?" Det. Capellan asks Clara. "Your situation would have been easier to resolve." Clara says, "What situation? Eduardo was cheating on me." She's got blood on her cheeks. Capellan says she's referring to Clara's clinical situation. "I'm fine. Well, I'm fine now. Eduardo's going to stay with me. I asked Beatriz to help me, but she didn't want to. I don't understand why she didn't want to. I asked her to help me but she didn’t want to, so I had to punish her. With a knife, because I wanted to get my husband out of her, the perfume out of her, so I had to open her up all over. But instead there was just blood. Why was there blood? I don't like blood. Why didn't Beatriz want to help me? Why?"
Clara watches the elevator go up and she goes up the stairs after it. Marcela gets into the elevator and Clara locks them both in together and starts stabbing her. Repeatedly. The bloody butterfly flies out of the elevator. The elevator reaches the bottom and Clara opens the door, looks back at Marcela, and walks up the stairs and back into her apartment. She lays the knife on Eduardo's nightstand, climbs into bed, and kisses him on the cheek.
"Marcela Rodriguez was stabbed 64 times. Clara Soler was declared incompetent, being diagnosed with schizoid pathological jealousy. She carried out her sentence in the psychiatric wing of the women's prison."
A maintenance guy drags around a mop and bucket and picks up mail from the floor of an apartment building before taking his mop and bucket and climbing the stairs to the elevator. He opens the elevator door and gasps at whatever he sees.
Let's check out some hot chicks in red dresses, cause that's the last pleasant thing we'll see this episode, I'm sure. Que emane….
A woman uses a straightened out wire clothes hanger to get mail out of a mailbox. The maintenance guy chides her for it. She uses the excuse of not having a key, but he says she could have asked him to open the box for her. Ana Layevska, last seen in Querida Enemiga, and not looking too healthy, walks in to the building and the first woman…ok, I'm going to have to run to IMDB again, cause this show takes too long to give names for anybody…Woman #1, played by Edith Gonzalez is Clara and Woman #2, played by Ana Layevska is Marcela…anyway, Clara starts accosting Marcela with "what are you looking at?" and accuses her of being "Beatriz" and writing letters to Clara's husband. Marcela denies it, but Clara insists that she is Beatriz and is having an affair with Clara's husband. She keeps screaming "you" as the elevator rises. Well, Clara, unless IMDB is lying to me, that's not Beatriz. Whether she's having an affair with your husband remains to be seen.
Back in her apartment, Clara opens the letters. She picks up the phone and calls "Eduardo" to leave him a message that she's waiting for him. The man in question walks in, played by Rene Casados, who is currently in Corazon Salvaje as Noel. His hair is much greyer here, but only half as fluffy. This is a man who's not afraid of a little volume. Maybe he used to be in a hair band and is just trying to keep the dream alive. Anyway, she starts right in with "How did it go? What did you do? Where were you? I just left you a message!" He counters that it wasn't 1 message, it was 12. Also, he talked to the doorman. "How far are you going to go? Do you want us to get kicked out of this building?" She objects that they didn't get kicked out of the last one, they left. He reminds her that they left to avoid being kicked out due to the scandal. She starts to promise something, but he cuts her off. He wonders when things got screwed up between them and why it's so hard for her to accept that he loves her. He doesn't want any more promises. Clara starts playing with her nails.
Marcela brings a tray of tea or coffee into a room where Perla (played by Silvia Mariscal, who I last saw as Jaime Camil's mom on Tontas) sits knitting. She nervously wonders if she remembered to shut the door and Perla says she did and to chill out already. Perla calls Carla a "poor woman" but Marcela says she was worried Clara was going to do something to her. "But why?" "Because she thinks I'm her husband's lover." "Well are you?" "No!" "Then don't worry about it. She'll find the one who is and fight with her." Setting aside for a moment the question of whether Marcela really is sleeping with Eduardo, I'm not sure that it really matters to Carla--if she thinks Marcela's the one, that's enough for her.
Eduardo is fixing his tie in the mirror and gets instantly tense when Clara walks up behind him. She asks him if he's going to see Beatriz. "Did you not hear anything I just told you? Who the hell is Beatriz, anyway?" Clara insists that if he's not going to see her, then all he has to do is say so, and besides they both know who Beatriz is. When Eduardo's eyeballs look like they're about to spontaneously pop out of his head, she starts with the "I'm sorry"-s. She begs him to stay home, but he says he's just going to "the agency." He asks, and she hasn't taken her meds yet because it wasn't time. He says he'll be back later to take her to the doctor. He kisses her on the forehead and says he loves her.
Marcela is waiting for the elevator. When Eduardo gets out, she gets in. They exchange hello's, but it's still unclear whether they even know each other or whether she's thinking "Oh, it's the crazy woman's husband" and he's thinking "Don't look, don't look or Clara will think this is the one!"
At a car dealership, a saleswoman talks to a woman about a car, but fails to close the deal. As the woman walks off, Eduardo walks in. He asks the saleswoman how it went and comments that these days people would rather fix up an old tricycle than buy a new car. The woman nods sadly and tells him that Clara called. Three times. He goes into his office and the saleswoman follows him and asks what he's going to do. We finally get the woman's name, Patricia (played by Lili Brillanti, who's been in a bunch of things I've seen, but for whatever reason, I don't recognize her). Eduardo says that they haven't been in the new apartment long, but the neighbors already are making a fuss. He's still taking her to a psychiatrist and, in fact, they just changed to a new one who came highly recommended. He doesn't think it's done her any good. Hmmm, I'm going to armchair diagnose her with Borderline Personality Disorder http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/disorders/borderlinepd.htm but I'll have to see how this all winds up.
Clara sits in a kind of fancy-looking living room, wearing sloppy sweats and holding one of Eduardo's shirts in her lap. She's playing with her hair, so her mom, Mrs. Soler, asks if she wants to go to the salon. "A haircut will strengthen your hair." Clara says she doesn't have time. She insists Eduardo's cheating on her, but Mrs. S brushes it off. Clara has her mom smell the shirt, but she doesn't smell anything. "You don't understand because you don't have to keep an eye on dad." Mrs. S reminds her that he's dead. "Exactly. The only men who don't cheat on us are the dead ones."
In the post-murder timeline, Forense Gerardo watches a tech zip up the body bag. Still no word on who's in it.
Eduardo and Patricia sit and have coffee. Eduardo says he takes Clara to the doc once a month or maybe once every fifteen days, it just depends. Sometimes he takes her or sometimes she goes alone or with her mother. He notices the time and says she has an appointment today and he wants to take her. Patricia supposes Clara must be at home and says she's having a bad time. Eduardo agrees and says he's having a bad time too…a really bad time. Patricia asks if Clara has ever thought that they…"Yes, she has. But don't worry, now I'm with Beatriz, a neighbor." He doesn't roll his eyes, exactly, it's more like he's just too tired to even bother.
At the doc's office, Clara isn't even listening, although she says she is, when Eduardo says she keeps being jealous and causing scenes. Eduardo mentions her pills and Clara insists they're to keep her doped up so that he can go out with other women. The doctor challenges her, "How do you know they're to keep you doped up?" But she doesn't really answer his question, she just tells him he doesn't understand. The doctor says he does understand, he's a doctor. He says she's been receiving treatment for a year. "But I'm fine. You're both exaggerating." Eduardo asks her to tell the doctor about the bells. She sighs and we get a flashback.
Clara is tying bells and chimes above the bedroom door. She explains that since she's on the pills and they make her sleep, she hung the bells above the bedroom door so that if he went out they would wake her up. Yeah, brilliant, but he can also duck to avoid them.
"It was only for a while." The doc asks if Eduardo didn't take them down and he answers something along the lines of "What should I have done?" or "What could I do?" but I'm not clear on whether he did take them down or whether he felt like he had to leave them up. The doctor sighs at his answer and Clara says that the two of them, the doctor and Eduardo, are plotting behind her back. She tells Ed that he's trying to get her out of the way so that he can be with Beatriz. She tells the doctor that Eduardo wants her locked up there so he can cheat with Beatriz. The doctor says no one's talking about having her admitted and what she needs to do is keep following the treatment and she'll get better little by little. Eduardo is nodding.
As they leave the office, Eduardo asks her where she got the idea that he was trying to have her locked up. She says because they didn't ask her for ID or anything, so how do they know she's really his wife, really Clara. He asks if she's really taking her medication. "Why do you ask?" That would be a no, methinks. He says she seems to be getting worse and worse and he's worried about her. They're sitting on a park bench and she tells him to go back to work so he won't worry. He'd rather take her home first. He asks her if she wouldn't like an ice cream from a cart nearby. She's surprised that he would buy her an ice cream and laughs. He reminds her that they once agreed he would get her the sun, moon, and stars. She keeps laughing, "like when we were dating." He's laughing too and says, "yeah, I used to recite you poetry," and he goes over to the ice cream cart. He gets two cones and hands her one. He reminds her that their promises were mutual. "You're throwing it in my face." He insists he's not, he just wants her to be well…and for them to have the sun, moon, and stars. They're both laughing. That's the power of ice cream. But eventually it melts, and the crazy starts again.
Forense Gerardo reports to Det. Capellan that there's not a lot to say. It was the same weapon for all the wounds and there were 64 stabs--add one to the stabbing column for this season. He figures someone very angry or very scared would have made that many wounds.
Marcela finishes getting ready. Perla comments that she hasn't seen her this happy in a long time. Marcela says she's going out with some girlfriends. Perla says it's been a long time since she's gone out and maybe she'll meet someone. "And what would you think if I did? Meet someone." Perla says she thinks Marcela needs to have a life again. "It's been two years since my son died. You can't keep taking care of me forever. There's nothing sadder than a young widow." Marcela says maybe later, but now she's gotta go. Perla tells her to have a good time.
When Marcela gets out of the elevator, Clara is waiting on the stairs for her, still eating her ice cream cone. Damn, I want one now. Upholding my earlier theory, the ice cream itself is gone and it looks like the crazy is back. Clara just wants a word with "Beatriz" to resolve this in the best way possible. Marcela insists that she's not "Beatriz" and that Clara is mistaking her for someone else. Clara shows her the ice cream cone and says her husband bought it for her and she sensed that he loves her. LOVES HER. "That's nice, "says Marcela, "I'm glad your husband loves you. That's the way it should be, isn't it?" She walks off and Clara keeps munching on her cone.
Back in her apartment, Clara picks up a picture of a blond woman…herself as a blond? I can't tell. She picks up the phone and calls the auto dealership. Patricia picks up the phone. She very loudly announces that it's Clara and Eduardo makes the international sign for "I'm not here" so Patricia says he's with a client. Clara hangs up. For one thing, Patricia doesn't sound very convincing. For another, I don't care if this coworker is my soul brother, if he's got a crazy wife who constantly thinks he's cheating, I am not going to lie for him--that way only leads to the crazy wife either thinking you're the mistress or accusing you of covering for him. Either way, it ups the probability of you ending up in a pool of blood.
Patricia finishes up with a client jut as Clara shows up asking for Eduardo. Clara heads right for his office as he throws out his hands and begs her not to make a scene at work. She says she just called and they told her he was with a client, so obviously that means he bought her ice cream and then went to go shag Beatriz. Yes, of course, because when a man buys you ice cream it always means he's getting it somewhere else, how did I miss the signs! Clara keeps asking him where he was as the phone starts ringing. Ed hesitates, so Clara says if he won't answer it, she will. As she and Ed both slap hands on the receiver, the phone stops ringing. Patricia comes over and tells Eduardo it's a Mr. somebody calling about the sedan. He tells Patricia he'll call the guy back. When Patricia leaves, Eduardo asks Clara what she needs and what she wants. "We can't go on like this." Clara thinks he's finally gotten up the guts to leave her. Eduardo says he's always had the guts, but he keeps trying because he loves her. Clara rushes him and grabs him. She starts crying and saying she needs help.
At the police station, Det. Capellan asks Eduardo if he noticed any changes in his wife. Ed says sometimes she got better, but…. He claims he did supervise her treatment, but he couldn't be with her constantly because he had to work.
Clara plays with one of her pills, eventually dropping it in a glass of water and watching it fizz. She pours it into a plant.
Capellan asks Eduardo if the doctor ever used the word "delirio" (delusion). Capellan says specifically, jealous delusions--jealousy with distortion of reality. Ed kind of smiles and she goes on to say, "You look at your wife lovingly--she thinks you have a lover. You bring her flowers--she thinks you have a lover." Eduardo says he understands, but isn't it too late for this?
Marcela, looking sickly again, gets off the elevator. Clara follows her. Out at the street, Clara gets up in her face and says "You're my husband's lover." Marcela insists that she's not, nor is her name Beatriz, and if Clara doesn't cut it out, she's going to the cops. Clara says she's mocking her and she'd better watch out.
Marcela is getting some pastries at a nearby café when Clara comes up behind her and says "Hi, Beatriz." Clara says they can end this very easily if Marcela just shows her some ID to prove she's not Beatriz. Marcela gets upset and begs Clara to leave her alone. She runs out of the café and Clara says, "See how I found you out! See how you are my husband's lover!" She goes up to the counter and says she'll take the bread that Marcela ran off without.
Clara reports to the doctor that she's feeling better. Much better. She thinks it's all over. She asks the doctor, just hypothetically, if he would show ID if one of his patients asked. He's confused and points to his credentials on the wall, saying "I'm a psychiatrist." But, just saying, what if a patient wanted to see that he really is who he says he is. The doctor says he supposes that if it were necessary, he would let a patient see his ID. Clara smiles. I think the good doctor just screwed Marcela over without meaning to.
Marcela and Perla are sitting in the apartment when someone knocks on the door. Marcela looks scared. She creeps up to the door and checks the peephole before unlocking the door. It's the doorman, who came to bring her the mail like she asked. Marcela gets the mail and then shuts the door in the guy's face. She comments to Perla that it's incredible what she's having to do because of that crazy woman.
Clara brings the pastries to her mom. She tells mom that mom can only stay for a little while because Clara is very busy. "With what?" Clara offers her mom coffee, but mom says Clara's not supposed to be drinking coffee with her medication. "Of course I can." Mom complains that it's impossible to get Clara out of the house and she never dresses up, even with all the nice clothes she has. Clara grabs mom's handbag and tells her to please leave. She insists she's busy and walks her mom out.
Perla thinks Marcela should have just shown Clara some ID. Marcela says she shouldn't have to. Perla insists that she would have done it and ended this. "First she's crazy, now she's making you crazy." Marcela thinks she needs to keep something from happening. "How, by killing that woman?" Marcela thinks it's not a bad idea. Perla is shocked.
"Were those her words?" Capellan asks Perla. Perla says yes, "It wouldn't be a bad idea to kill her." She wonders how it got to that point.
Clara serves Eduardo the bread she got from the bakery earlier for dinner. He's a little freaked out that she's just serving him bread. She grabs a piece and puts it on her plate and tells him, "Oh, I know, you're tired of eating this, but you eat it every day with Beatriz, so now you'll eat it with me." She takes a fork and knife and cuts herself a piece of bread, telling him to eat. He asks if she took her pills and she says of course she did.
There's a rattling at the door of Perla and Marcela's apartment. Perla gets up and calls out, "Marcela, is that you?" and the rattling stops.
Marcela gripes to the doorman, who tries to say that maybe Perla imagined it, but Perla objects to that. The doorman insists that he was on duty all day and no strangers came into the building. Marcela says it must have been someone from the building.
Clara's mom goes to Eduardo's work to complain about Clara. She's upset about Clara throwing her out and because she doesn't seem to be getting better. Eduardo insists that he's doing everything he can, because he loves her. And because she's his wife. He tells her that it doesn't matter what he does, every day she gets worse. He says the person he most loves is slipping away.
Forense Gerardo and Det. Capellan are looking at something in the lab when Aranda comes in. She tells Capellan that there was a previous report, but it wasn't investigated. Capellan looks at the file.
Marcela tells a cop what's going on with Clara. The cop says it's normal for Clara to have shown up at the same bus stop and café, "After all, you're neighbors, why wouldn't you shop in the same places?" Marcela insists that the woman is dangerous. The cop finally agrees to take the report, but he doesn't think they'll do much, since he doesn't see a threat. Marcela keeps insisting and asks how much farther it has to go before they do something. He asks her to sign something and she says, "you aren't going to do anything, are you?" She signs the paper and starts to leave, then turns around and says, "You won't do anything because there's been no threat? Fine, here's one, 'I'm going to kill that woman. I, Marcela Rodriguez, am going to kil that woman.' Put that down on your paper." She leaves.
Capellan tells Aranda to rain down hell on the dipshits who ignored the report. She says they'd better be ready to explain in front of the judge why they did nothing. "Because now I've got a dead body." Aranda leaves.
Marcela gets on the elevator and Eduardo asks her to wait and gets on with her. She looks really scared.
In her apartment, she considers possible weapons and ends up putting kitchen shears in her purse.
Eduardo sits in his apartment, drinking a beer and smoking a cigarette. Marcela opens the door partway and knocks. She comes in and she and Eduardo say hi, but he sticks his head out the door to check the hallway. She says she didn’t want to be rude earlier, in the elevator, and says she's his neighbor, from 6C. He asks if she's looking for his wife and says she's out. Marcela wanted to talk to both of them, but that's fine, she'll talk to him. She starts to come further into the apartment, but Eduardo freaks out, pointing at the door and saying "Clara!"
Clara is down at that café with her mom. She insists she's got to leave now and her mom asks why she's being this way about her husband. Clara says he's going to go off with Beatriz. "Why would he want me? My hair's falling out, I'm gross, and I can't give him a kid." Mom insists that Eduardo loves Clara, but she's just as convinced that he's sleeping with someone else and she can't understand why mom doesn't get it. She leaves.
Standing in the foyer of the apartment, Eduardo apologizes for what Clara has done, but asks her to be patient. Marcela says she's been patient, but she's afraid Clara will do something to her or to her mother-in-law. Eduardo says she's crazy, but she won't do anything. Marcela is as astounded at him as she was at the cop, "Are you not listening to me?" Eduardo insists that she's not dangerous, but she is crazy and jealous and about to come home, so he's really going to have to ask Marcela to leave.
Clara realizes the elevator is upstairs, so she takes the stairs.
Marcela insists that Eduardo talk to Clara and he says he will. He all but shoves her out the door and calls "thanks" after her. He leaves the door open and goes back inside.
Marcela gets in the elevator and takes it upstairs just as Clara comes up the stairs. Marcela goes into her apartment and Clara to hers, realizing that the door is open. She walks in slowly and sees Eduardo, sitting in the living room eating. "You brought her here, didn't you?" Eduardo heads her off by asking if she talked to her mother, "She's very worried about you. She says you yelled at her in the bakery." Clara insists that he took advantage of her being out to bring Beatriz into their house.
Marcela tells Perla about her conversation with Eduardo. "What is she going to have to do for them to believe me? Kill me?"
Clara says this is why he wanted to move to this apartment building. Eduardo loses it and starts screaming a bunch of stuff that gets muted out and then, "Who is this Beatriz? Where is she?" He pretends he's got her in his hands and then blows her away and says "there, she's gone!" Clara insists her perfume is there. Eduardo asks her to listen to him, but we're way past that now.
Marcela complains that Perla isn't the one being followed around, so of course, it's easy for her. "When your son was sick everybody had an opinion, 'chemotherapy, naturopathy,' they even want to try Reiki. And now when I've got a problem, everybody's got an opinion again, that I'm exaggerating, that I'm worrying about nothing, that she's not going to do anything. The last thing I need is for them to say the crazy woman is me. Everybody has an opinion, but nobody does anything."
Perla tells Capellan that Marcela was right. Nobody did anything, they all kept quiet, and they're all guilty. "We were all accomplices."
Marcela is sleeping.
Clara is sleeping and Eduardo strokes her hair.
Marcela wakes up at 6:30 the next morning. As does Clara. She puts on lipstick. Clara slips into her running shoes and a robe. Marcela brushes her hair. Clara goes into the kitchen and grabs a knife from a drawer. Marcela puts on perfume. She checks her purse and takes out the kitchen shears. She leaves them on her dressing table and leaves. Clara tucks the knife into the sleeve of her robe. Marcela waits for the elevator. Clara watches it go up.
"Why didn't you comply with treatment?" Det. Capellan asks Clara. "Your situation would have been easier to resolve." Clara says, "What situation? Eduardo was cheating on me." She's got blood on her cheeks. Capellan says she's referring to Clara's clinical situation. "I'm fine. Well, I'm fine now. Eduardo's going to stay with me. I asked Beatriz to help me, but she didn't want to. I don't understand why she didn't want to. I asked her to help me but she didn’t want to, so I had to punish her. With a knife, because I wanted to get my husband out of her, the perfume out of her, so I had to open her up all over. But instead there was just blood. Why was there blood? I don't like blood. Why didn't Beatriz want to help me? Why?"
Clara watches the elevator go up and she goes up the stairs after it. Marcela gets into the elevator and Clara locks them both in together and starts stabbing her. Repeatedly. The bloody butterfly flies out of the elevator. The elevator reaches the bottom and Clara opens the door, looks back at Marcela, and walks up the stairs and back into her apartment. She lays the knife on Eduardo's nightstand, climbs into bed, and kisses him on the cheek.
"Marcela Rodriguez was stabbed 64 times. Clara Soler was declared incompetent, being diagnosed with schizoid pathological jealousy. She carried out her sentence in the psychiatric wing of the women's prison."
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So I guess they're going more with a paranoid personality disorder--that's the closest DSM diagnosis http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/disorders/paranoidpd.htm to the translation "pathological jealousy," though I would disagree that she meets the criteria for her paranoia being "in a variety of contexts"--she didn't think everyone was out to get her, she only thought her husband was cheating on her. Maybe there was the one incident with thinking the doctor and the husband were in cahoots, but again, that was only because she thought he was trying to have her locked up so he could be with "Beatriz". I wish Marcela had just shown her the damn ID already, but I doubt it would have helped in the long run. It also would have been nice for the cops to take her report seriously. I think I've seen that same guy play a cop in other shows, now that I think about it.
These recaps take me a lot longer than the ones for a novela. There's so much more packed in and no filler at all, plus every episode is a brand new set up, except for the recurring cops. It's like a serious workout for my recap musckes :)
These recaps take me a lot longer than the ones for a novela. There's so much more packed in and no filler at all, plus every episode is a brand new set up, except for the recurring cops. It's like a serious workout for my recap musckes :)
Thanks for all the hard work, Kat! I do love this show, even if it's soul-crushingly depressing at times. This was another excellent episode with great performances. You could sense what was going to happen but you still hoped it wouldn't.
Mrs. 5 ft...superb job!! Yes, each week we have to start all over again with a new setting and new players. I know it is confusing for you and it is certainly confusing for us.. Compared to me, you have a mind like a steel trap for the details! My mind is more like an aluminum mouse trap, a kinda empty one at that....thanks for your detailed recap....
I really don't know where to begin...first, Edith Gonzales gave an INCREDIBLE performance. Just the little things like the twisting of her hair; her well played emotional up, up ups and then her down, down downs, her steady, steely accusations then the emotional collapse against her husband’s shoulders. I have NO earthly idea what the real diagnosis is but certainly PARANOIA has to be a part of it. YES, we are inclined to think that if Marcela had just shown her ID, things would have been different...but, you know what, Clara would have just thought that it was a fake. It is like Floresdeazule just said, “You could sense what was going to happen but you still hoped it wouldn't.” I completely agree...
Edith Gonzales ROCKED in this! TVyNovela people are you watching???
I really don't know where to begin...first, Edith Gonzales gave an INCREDIBLE performance. Just the little things like the twisting of her hair; her well played emotional up, up ups and then her down, down downs, her steady, steely accusations then the emotional collapse against her husband’s shoulders. I have NO earthly idea what the real diagnosis is but certainly PARANOIA has to be a part of it. YES, we are inclined to think that if Marcela had just shown her ID, things would have been different...but, you know what, Clara would have just thought that it was a fake. It is like Floresdeazule just said, “You could sense what was going to happen but you still hoped it wouldn't.” I completely agree...
Edith Gonzales ROCKED in this! TVyNovela people are you watching???
Excellent recap 5ft. This was a really good episode. I too thought maybe if Marcela had shown Clara the id maybe it would have turned out differently. Then again, Clara was convinced that Marcela was Beatriz and nothing was going to change her mind. It's sad that when she went to the police they didn't take Marcela's concerns serious.
Permalink posted by 
: Friday, March 5, 2010 at 8:43:00 PM EST
: Friday, March 5, 2010 at 8:43:00 PM EST
Thanks Kat for another great recap. I just love this show but it keeps me on the edge of my chair.
I really didn't understand all that Clara said at the end of the show. What a sicko!!!
Poor Marcela. Showing her ID would be of no help.
Ann-NYC
I really didn't understand all that Clara said at the end of the show. What a sicko!!!
Poor Marcela. Showing her ID would be of no help.
Ann-NYC
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 12:50:00 AM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 12:50:00 AM EST
Wow, Kat, thanks so much for doing these. I totally understand how difficult they must be. A whole new cast of sometimes 6 or 7 new characters for whom to figure out names and motivations.
Edith was wonderful. Wow. I also enjoyed Rene Cazados. I'd only seen him overacting in Salvador Mejía productions. It was great to see a restrained performance.
I have a hard time understanding these episodes, much more than novelas. I keep backing up the DVR and watching scenes over to catch dialog. I can't put my finger on why it's so hard for me. But they are very well done.
Edith was wonderful. Wow. I also enjoyed Rene Cazados. I'd only seen him overacting in Salvador Mejía productions. It was great to see a restrained performance.
I have a hard time understanding these episodes, much more than novelas. I keep backing up the DVR and watching scenes over to catch dialog. I can't put my finger on why it's so hard for me. But they are very well done.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 6:19:00 AM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 6:19:00 AM EST
After watching some of these MA shows and seeing such higher production values, I wonder of the TN actors damage their careers by being in the novelas. The one last week about the older woman and her stylist was VERY good as well, in fact, outstanding. I love the novelas, but most of the acting is silly and way over the top and that reflects badly on the people in them. Of course, all of this is a business and the jefes are just giving people what and there are few other choices for the actors.
I think that it was an interesting twist that Marcela wasn't having an affair with Eduardo, at first I thought they were. I was fooled by the paranoia as well!
Novelera, these shows are harder to understand! It probably good for our Spanish to listen to them.
I think that it was an interesting twist that Marcela wasn't having an affair with Eduardo, at first I thought they were. I was fooled by the paranoia as well!
Novelera, these shows are harder to understand! It probably good for our Spanish to listen to them.
Once I was in a situation where a paranoid woman focused on me with accusations, but not about her husband, it was B12 shots! I was the meds nurse on a floor in Cambridge Hospital where a fellow nurse, who was really sick, was using the station stock of B12 for her own injections. Things were very different then and while I knew she was doing it, it didn’t seem harmful, it is a vitamin, not a narcotic. She got even sicker and came in to work and would sleep in one of the patient rooms for part of the shift which made it harder on me or who ever was working that night, still I didn’t turn her in. I felt very sorry for her and more importantly, I had had a run in with the head of the nursing staff myself and intensely disliked that woman. I had been reprimanded( or you could say “chewed out”) for putting on regular clothes over my uniform for the night time walk to and from the hospital...I didn’t want to be a BIG WHITE TARGET walking down the street at 11PM at night. Evidently I didn’t look “professional” while walking to and from work. Of course, it was 1970 in Cambridge, Mass and NO ONE looked anything but STRANGE in those days in that city! Anyway, the hospital caught up with the other nurse’s behavior and at first she was warned and then later she was fired. During the warning period while she was still working, she acted just like Clara and was waiting for me everywhere and saying “You turned me in!” She seemed so normal in the other aspects of her life that I didn’t realize until much later that I had been dealing with a paranoid personality. This story is too long as it is, so I have left out many, many details, but no amount of reasoning could get her focus off of me! I don’t know where she is now, but I know she is still saying, “She turned me in!” somewhere. Actually, it was very painful at the time. As I think about it again, the whole thing still bothers me.
Sorry if this has been too long....but Clara so reminded me of that nurse.
Sorry if this has been too long....but Clara so reminded me of that nurse.
I worked at a place where a couple worked together and she constantly accused me of wanting her boyfriend. It became very uncomfortable. Whenever he spoke to me, she would stare at me with daggers. I even told her I wasn't after her boyfriend but she was crazy jealous. She accused him so much of wanting to go out with me that he eventually did ask me out. I wanted no part of it and I ended up having to leave that job. Even that didn't abate her jealousy. She knew where I lived. I ended up moving away from my apartment. That was definitely a scary time in my life. From what I heard after I moved away from a mutual friend, it became violent and he ended up in jail for assaulting her. Sad.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 3:46:00 PM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 3:46:00 PM EST
Sandy and Pirate Babe, what interesting stories. I think you both are lucky things turned out the way they did. I don't want to sound like an aficionado of "made for tv, women in jeopardy" movies. But we often pick up the newspaper and read about some triangle where a person is killed. Or a disgrunted employee who kills someone. Don't get me started on this. I'm a knee-jerk liberal, and, if I ruled the world, all hand guns would be confiscated and melted down. Of course that wouldn't have stopped our Clara.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 4:14:00 PM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 4:14:00 PM EST
Thanks for the very complete recap, Kat. I can see how it's takes so long, since there are all new characters and situations each week.
When the show was going on, I was thinking that no one gave Clara a straight answer, and everybody was answering questions with questions. But as others have pointed out, even if Marcela did show her ID, Clara probably wouldn't have been convinced.
If Clara had been taking her medicine, maybe everything would be okay. But Eduardo couldn't really check, and besides, he was in a bit of denial himself. Now that Clara's locked up, she'll probably be well monitored, and take her medicine everyday. She may not even be so paranoid. That's not much comfort to Perla and Marcela, though.
Once again, we have a kitchen knife as the murder weapon. Here's the list so far:
- stabbed by a kitchen knife
- stabbed by a broken bottle
- stabbed by a knitting needle (and some scissors
- bonked on the head with a bowl
- stabbed by a kitchen knife
When the show was going on, I was thinking that no one gave Clara a straight answer, and everybody was answering questions with questions. But as others have pointed out, even if Marcela did show her ID, Clara probably wouldn't have been convinced.
If Clara had been taking her medicine, maybe everything would be okay. But Eduardo couldn't really check, and besides, he was in a bit of denial himself. Now that Clara's locked up, she'll probably be well monitored, and take her medicine everyday. She may not even be so paranoid. That's not much comfort to Perla and Marcela, though.
Once again, we have a kitchen knife as the murder weapon. Here's the list so far:
- stabbed by a kitchen knife
- stabbed by a broken bottle
- stabbed by a knitting needle (and some scissors
- bonked on the head with a bowl
- stabbed by a kitchen knife
Kat thank you so much for taking the time forgiving us MA lovers the recaps you are much appreciated.
Sandy my drinking buddy from Sortilegio it nice to see you commenting and i'm sorry to hear about your real life experience.
I also experience a incident once with a man who was interested in me i da to get a restraining order and threaten a lawsuit against his family if something ever happened to me.
The other time was with a former female employee who for some strange reason took her anger issues out on me.
Let's just say when ever i see people displaying emotional problems stay as far away from them as possible.
Like you said there is nothing pleasant about being on the receiving end of a delusional mental person paranoia.
That is why i am so strongly turn off by characters like this on the novelas like Maura from Sorti and Gardenia from MEPS.
Sandy my drinking buddy from Sortilegio it nice to see you commenting and i'm sorry to hear about your real life experience.
I also experience a incident once with a man who was interested in me i da to get a restraining order and threaten a lawsuit against his family if something ever happened to me.
The other time was with a former female employee who for some strange reason took her anger issues out on me.
Let's just say when ever i see people displaying emotional problems stay as far away from them as possible.
Like you said there is nothing pleasant about being on the receiving end of a delusional mental person paranoia.
That is why i am so strongly turn off by characters like this on the novelas like Maura from Sorti and Gardenia from MEPS.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 4:51:00 PM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 4:51:00 PM EST
Hombre ITA with you and others i don't believe even if Marcela showed her, her id it would have made any difference whatsoever.
The problem with people like Clara is they have a one track mind, so therefore Marcela could showed her id, birth certificate even had finger prints done and it would not have made any difference to Clara because in her mind she was Beatriz.
What would have saved her is first the husband needed to have someone not his mother in law make sure she was taking her meds.
Second maybe moved again even though they just moved into that apartment.
Three he should have asked the Dr. by himself if it would be better to lock her up.
Fourth Marcela mother in law should have went with her to file the police report an d spoke to the cop how frighten she was someone was trying to get in the front door to her house when she was home.
Plus how her daughter in law complain to her everyday about being harassed by this woman.
If the cop refused to do anything about after having both of their statements he should automatically lose his job. He should lose anyway because in this day and age you have to take complaints like that seriously.
The problem with people like Clara is they have a one track mind, so therefore Marcela could showed her id, birth certificate even had finger prints done and it would not have made any difference to Clara because in her mind she was Beatriz.
What would have saved her is first the husband needed to have someone not his mother in law make sure she was taking her meds.
Second maybe moved again even though they just moved into that apartment.
Three he should have asked the Dr. by himself if it would be better to lock her up.
Fourth Marcela mother in law should have went with her to file the police report an d spoke to the cop how frighten she was someone was trying to get in the front door to her house when she was home.
Plus how her daughter in law complain to her everyday about being harassed by this woman.
If the cop refused to do anything about after having both of their statements he should automatically lose his job. He should lose anyway because in this day and age you have to take complaints like that seriously.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 5:01:00 PM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 5:01:00 PM EST
That police officer who refused to take Marcela seriously has definitely been typecast. He has a naturally shifty expression on his face, and he has portrayed crooked cops at least 3 times that I can think of.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 6:25:00 PM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 6:25:00 PM EST
Anon, my drinking buddy, I gave you a shout out last week on the MA blog, but I posted late and I guess you didn't see my comment. Anyway...HELLO! I've missed you and Cielo. I agree totally with you, we react more strongly to the characters that we have known in real life....
It is my understanding that here in the US it is much harder to have someone committed than it used to be. I'm not sure about Mexico. It might have been hard for Eduardo and the doctor to force Clara into a facility. The sad thing is that it seemed that Eduardo loved Clara, but SHE was pushing him away with her relentless accusations. It is ironic that the sick patient is the one who is responsible for taking their meds. Because of this kind of Catch-22, I'm surprised that we don't have more emotional implosions than we do.
I loved Edith's face and hair in this program. She looked much like a woman who is beautiful, but due to her sick pain, was no longer devoting time to her grooming. Her face was just right...
The only criticism I have is a small one, the bubbling of her pills as she dropped them in the glass of water, too much pop pop, fizz fizz! Didn't look real to me, oh well, a small complaint.
It is my understanding that here in the US it is much harder to have someone committed than it used to be. I'm not sure about Mexico. It might have been hard for Eduardo and the doctor to force Clara into a facility. The sad thing is that it seemed that Eduardo loved Clara, but SHE was pushing him away with her relentless accusations. It is ironic that the sick patient is the one who is responsible for taking their meds. Because of this kind of Catch-22, I'm surprised that we don't have more emotional implosions than we do.
I loved Edith's face and hair in this program. She looked much like a woman who is beautiful, but due to her sick pain, was no longer devoting time to her grooming. Her face was just right...
The only criticism I have is a small one, the bubbling of her pills as she dropped them in the glass of water, too much pop pop, fizz fizz! Didn't look real to me, oh well, a small complaint.
Sorry Sandy if i missed your comment from last week i'm glad to see your name again. I was thinking alka selzer when she drop those pills into the glass like that.
Other than that i just love this show there's no over the top acting i believe i read somewhere during the first season how these stories are based on real life events.
I have no complaints about the acting,directing and producing of this show i just wish they would give more than the episodes that we are going to get though.
I think because of my real life experiences i get kind of offended when someone says well she's just a bad girl who can be redeemed that's all. It's like they are taking lightly of a very serious and sometimes dangerous mental condition that can become fatal to that person's object of obsession.
Other than that i just love this show there's no over the top acting i believe i read somewhere during the first season how these stories are based on real life events.
I have no complaints about the acting,directing and producing of this show i just wish they would give more than the episodes that we are going to get though.
I think because of my real life experiences i get kind of offended when someone says well she's just a bad girl who can be redeemed that's all. It's like they are taking lightly of a very serious and sometimes dangerous mental condition that can become fatal to that person's object of obsession.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 7:49:00 PM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 7:49:00 PM EST
Anon,
Like you, I cringe when I see the quick novela "jail house" recoveries of people who are really psychotic. Do you think that it is a lack of understanding or is just that the writers want to wrap the show quickly and think that their audience wants healing? Perhaps they know that there is little interest or ratings in a slow realistic recovery process. Of course, for many of the TN villains, there would be no recovery in real life!!
Like you, I cringe when I see the quick novela "jail house" recoveries of people who are really psychotic. Do you think that it is a lack of understanding or is just that the writers want to wrap the show quickly and think that their audience wants healing? Perhaps they know that there is little interest or ratings in a slow realistic recovery process. Of course, for many of the TN villains, there would be no recovery in real life!!
Sandy i think it is a extreme lack of understanding that's why they keep having these characters cured so easily when we know in real life that's not the case for people like that.
I get very irritated with this type of writing the sad thing we see the same type of characters in all of these novelas.
Which is another reason why i love the realism of MA it doesn't sugar coat real life.I enjoyed Marcela's response because it wasn't some fairytale saintly forgiveness crap that's constantly shoved down our throats like in the novelas.
I wish the producers of these novelas would take a chance and write more realistic characters in how they would react.
I remember i read a article about novela's in the 1990's that article was very critical of novelas. It said that novelas forstered a unrealistic fairytale existence that the poor maybe uneducated girl would marry the rich good looking prince like guy who would come to save her from her dreary life.
Now that article was in the 1990's when i see most of these novelas and how the young women react to being manipulated lied to and plotted against i have to agree with that article.
One other i remember from that article is that it gave young girls unrealistic ideas about how their lives would be or should i say could be.
Now after seeing these novelas today at least on Univision i have a hard time believing anyone no matter what their spiritual belief is can be that forgiving.
I get very irritated with this type of writing the sad thing we see the same type of characters in all of these novelas.
Which is another reason why i love the realism of MA it doesn't sugar coat real life.I enjoyed Marcela's response because it wasn't some fairytale saintly forgiveness crap that's constantly shoved down our throats like in the novelas.
I wish the producers of these novelas would take a chance and write more realistic characters in how they would react.
I remember i read a article about novela's in the 1990's that article was very critical of novelas. It said that novelas forstered a unrealistic fairytale existence that the poor maybe uneducated girl would marry the rich good looking prince like guy who would come to save her from her dreary life.
Now that article was in the 1990's when i see most of these novelas and how the young women react to being manipulated lied to and plotted against i have to agree with that article.
One other i remember from that article is that it gave young girls unrealistic ideas about how their lives would be or should i say could be.
Now after seeing these novelas today at least on Univision i have a hard time believing anyone no matter what their spiritual belief is can be that forgiving.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 10:54:00 PM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 10:54:00 PM EST
Anon, you and I might be a small party of two on the "forgivness" thing.....
I will say that the evil people do seem to be punished in the novelas, they even have horrible outcomes...Babs in MEPS. We can be thankful for that. And that must influence the younger viewers...
I, like you, am enjoying MA because of the reality of the whole thing. I enjoy seeing the actors given a chance to take part in something that isn't so over the top.
To be completely honest, I haven't enjoyed the TNs as much lately as I did a few years back. FELS (I quit), MEPS, and even some of the stuff in Sorti bothered me.....
I will say that the evil people do seem to be punished in the novelas, they even have horrible outcomes...Babs in MEPS. We can be thankful for that. And that must influence the younger viewers...
I, like you, am enjoying MA because of the reality of the whole thing. I enjoy seeing the actors given a chance to take part in something that isn't so over the top.
To be completely honest, I haven't enjoyed the TNs as much lately as I did a few years back. FELS (I quit), MEPS, and even some of the stuff in Sorti bothered me.....
Sandy LOL about your FELS i believe you along with Variopinta warned me about FELS so when it is rerun on Telefutura i'll avoid it like the plaque.
I think when i gave you my comparison of Sorti against Tu O' Nadie i felt Carla went so far over the top to be different from the previous two other versions. I found the new plots she invented along with the original writer from Tu' O Nadie were just so repugnant i really couldn't forgive her for her vision on how to make this story different from the other two.
There's a old sayinf KISS which means keep it simple stupid.
I felt Carla along with alot of producers and writers of these novelas are going so over the top with the acting and some of the plots it's just too much sometimes.
It looks like from your comments that you find the villain more interseting than the main heroine or hero. I'm finishing up ENDA tomorrow and the two main villains were so well played and acted they just blew the two main leads out of the water.
One of them quite frankly can't act if his life depended upon it,that how terrible he's been. For the most part i really have enjoyed this novela and the writing as been very good for the most part.
I think when i gave you my comparison of Sorti against Tu O' Nadie i felt Carla went so far over the top to be different from the previous two other versions. I found the new plots she invented along with the original writer from Tu' O Nadie were just so repugnant i really couldn't forgive her for her vision on how to make this story different from the other two.
There's a old sayinf KISS which means keep it simple stupid.
I felt Carla along with alot of producers and writers of these novelas are going so over the top with the acting and some of the plots it's just too much sometimes.
It looks like from your comments that you find the villain more interseting than the main heroine or hero. I'm finishing up ENDA tomorrow and the two main villains were so well played and acted they just blew the two main leads out of the water.
One of them quite frankly can't act if his life depended upon it,that how terrible he's been. For the most part i really have enjoyed this novela and the writing as been very good for the most part.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 11:59:00 PM EST
: Saturday, March 6, 2010 at 11:59:00 PM EST
Anon,
Have you ever scene Amor Real? There are really no villains in the main characters, they are just real people who make mistakes. The antihero, Adolfo is the most honorable of them all! If it comes back around, try it. It is playing on Telefutura now but it might be too late to start! I don't know, maybe you could jump in and pick it up.
Have you ever scene Amor Real? There are really no villains in the main characters, they are just real people who make mistakes. The antihero, Adolfo is the most honorable of them all! If it comes back around, try it. It is playing on Telefutura now but it might be too late to start! I don't know, maybe you could jump in and pick it up.
Sandy i'm not really a big fan of FC but i did like him in MEPS and that was the first novela of his that stayed on to watch from almost the beginning to the end. I think it was Sylvia Navarro who really got me hooked on it with her strong portrayal as Fernanda.
I was just telling someone on the ENDA page who was put off by CS and wasn't sure about the other novelas if he had Telemundo to watch their novelas.
I find that Telemundo's novelas are a little better written than most of the novelas we get on Univision. I think the only reason now i stay with Univision is because i love William Levy.
They are a couple of other actors from ENDA who did such a excellent job with their roles that i want to see them in the future.I don't know if you turned into ENDA but surprising even though it's very dark and depressing it's so well written i changed my mind and started to watch it. I fell so in love with it. I started to write the Friday recap for it when the regular recapper had to stop for personal reasons.
I was just telling someone on the ENDA page who was put off by CS and wasn't sure about the other novelas if he had Telemundo to watch their novelas.
I find that Telemundo's novelas are a little better written than most of the novelas we get on Univision. I think the only reason now i stay with Univision is because i love William Levy.
They are a couple of other actors from ENDA who did such a excellent job with their roles that i want to see them in the future.I don't know if you turned into ENDA but surprising even though it's very dark and depressing it's so well written i changed my mind and started to watch it. I fell so in love with it. I started to write the Friday recap for it when the regular recapper had to stop for personal reasons.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 12:36:00 AM EST
: Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 12:36:00 AM EST
It sounds like you are too busy to take on AR now, but I promise, I KNOW you'd like it. It might not come around again though. Rent the abridged version when time permits.
The same production people who did ENDA are doing Mi Picado and I'm going to try that.
I'm proud of you for recapping!
The same production people who did ENDA are doing Mi Picado and I'm going to try that.
I'm proud of you for recapping!
Sandy what's that old saying you can't please some people just go to the ENDA page for the recap today. I had a exchange of words with someone. I would like for you to read it and the comments and i want your honest opinion because you and i seem to have some same experiences in life.
I will wait for your opinion i don't know if it's late in your area but if you want to post your comment tomorrow or Monday when you have a chance i'll be waiting to hear or read your thoughts ok.
I don't like the abridged version of anything i'm sure the way Telefutura is being run nowadays that they will show Amor Real again.
I had this discussion with Jarocha about this channel they are no longer except for El Capo at 7:00pm no new novelas. I've seen some novelas shown by my TV guide on my TV have been shown two or three times already.
So i'm pretty sure the next time they show Amor Real i will try to watch it from the very beginning i hate coming into the middle of novelas just like i hate going into the middle of movies.
I will wait for your opinion i don't know if it's late in your area but if you want to post your comment tomorrow or Monday when you have a chance i'll be waiting to hear or read your thoughts ok.
I don't like the abridged version of anything i'm sure the way Telefutura is being run nowadays that they will show Amor Real again.
I had this discussion with Jarocha about this channel they are no longer except for El Capo at 7:00pm no new novelas. I've seen some novelas shown by my TV guide on my TV have been shown two or three times already.
So i'm pretty sure the next time they show Amor Real i will try to watch it from the very beginning i hate coming into the middle of novelas just like i hate going into the middle of movies.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 1:10:00 AM EST
: Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 1:10:00 AM EST
I'll be happy to give you my honest opinion. Let me read it tomorrow, it is getting late here. In general I think you handle things well, so don't worry about it.
Where are the ENDA recaps?
Where are the ENDA recaps?
Sandy hit the Amor recaps and then click on the March 5, recap that's my final recap for ENDA. i'll check out your opinion tomorrow goodnight.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 1:32:00 AM EST
: Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 1:32:00 AM EST
Anon, I’ve read your wonderful recap and all the comments. Wow, you have lots of fans. I’m sure you are referring to the work “semi-recap”. I’m not sure why that poster used exactly that word, because in implies that you did a semi, or less that adequate recap. I honestly think that he just accidently chose a word that has a duel meaning. He was referring to the fact that you came in late to take over, not making a comment about quality. In fact several times he praised your work. I have had discussions with this poster and he is honest and if he does disagree with your point, he’ll let you know, LOUD AND CLEAR. Also, this might be sexist, but I think the poster is a guy and they get all balled up in titles like “pro” or “semi-pro”, that might be where his expression came from. I think you handled the situation well, stated you point a couple of times and then moved on....I don’t think he meant anything by what he said, just a bad choice of words.....and we’ve all done that.
Your Spanish is INCREDIBLE, plus you have one of the Caray Caray...”computer brains” for the details.
Your Spanish is INCREDIBLE, plus you have one of the Caray Caray...”computer brains” for the details.
Sandy one of the things i learned early in life own your actions and words and be responsible for them. I grew up around sports so i know first hand how the word semi is used, since i have two older brothers.
I've learned to respect others and try to treat everyone like i would like to be treated, some times that is easier said than done.
One thing i not ashamed of doing is admitting when i'm wrong or able to say i'm sorry if i said something or did something that upset you. I pretty much have learned even though a lot of my friends tell me about my kindness and respect for others i'm quite opinionated when i have to be.
Thank you for your point of view and compliment because i don't think of my eight years i learned Spanish is on the level as others.Since i took up the recapping i found that it did improve a lot. I pretty much welcomed anyone to correct my mistakes or misinterpretation.
I've learned to respect others and try to treat everyone like i would like to be treated, some times that is easier said than done.
One thing i not ashamed of doing is admitting when i'm wrong or able to say i'm sorry if i said something or did something that upset you. I pretty much have learned even though a lot of my friends tell me about my kindness and respect for others i'm quite opinionated when i have to be.
Thank you for your point of view and compliment because i don't think of my eight years i learned Spanish is on the level as others.Since i took up the recapping i found that it did improve a lot. I pretty much welcomed anyone to correct my mistakes or misinterpretation.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 11:01:00 AM EST
: Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 11:01:00 AM EST
OK, I admit it...I'm a sexist, . Anon, I think men have a tougher time with, "I"m sorry, I was wrong." My husband always says..."I'm sorry.......that you're mad!"
All kidding aside, I'm just glad I got to read one of your recaps. You are very good. We travel too much to be a responsible recapper, but, I might try and do it a couple of times for myself, to improve my Spanish...
So glad to "see" you again, I've missed you and Cielo.
All kidding aside, I'm just glad I got to read one of your recaps. You are very good. We travel too much to be a responsible recapper, but, I might try and do it a couple of times for myself, to improve my Spanish...
So glad to "see" you again, I've missed you and Cielo.
Sandy i know all about sexism after having two older brothers and you are so right about men never being able to admit when they are wrong. I thought you were going to watch CS when it started,
I see Cielo over there and i just read the recaps and comments because i switched over to Telemundo once Sorti ended.The recaps and comments are a riot about that novela.
I see Cielo over there and i just read the recaps and comments because i switched over to Telemundo once Sorti ended.The recaps and comments are a riot about that novela.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 1:18:00 PM EST
: Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 1:18:00 PM EST
That is what I'm doing, not watching the program and just getting laughs with the comments...I don't even read the recaps, just the comments...I just dip in from time to time. I'm doing AR and with Gancho and Mi Picado, that is all I can handle.
I saw Cielo there, but since I'm not watching, I didn't say anything!
I saw Cielo there, but since I'm not watching, I didn't say anything!
Thanks for the feedback, everyone :) I did not expect to have as many "one time this person fixated on me" stories...what does that say about the world that there were so many? Thankfully I haven't been in that situation, and I'm glad those of you who were are still around to tell about it!
The requirements for involuntary inpatient treatment are that the person be a danger to themselves or others. I like that this does protect people from using it as a tool to get rid of someone they don't like or who is somehow in their way. But it also lets people like Clara slip through the cracks. She never did explicitly threaten Marcela or herself with bodily harm, so she never gave anyone a legal reason to have her admitted for inpatient treatment. And since she kept lying to her psychiatrist, saying she was fine, he couldn't do anything either, legally or ethically.
I finally had to go check out the ENDA comments to figure out what y'all were talking about. I am confused by the discussion of this taking place over here, where it's not topical, rather than taking it up where it is topical. I feel like I'm aiding and abetting a gossip session taking place behind someone's back. I'm not opposed to off-topic in general, or hearing about people's personal lives but this is just getting wierd. I gently and respectfully ask that the comments to my recaps not become a place to hold discussions about other recaps or recappers or commenters.
The requirements for involuntary inpatient treatment are that the person be a danger to themselves or others. I like that this does protect people from using it as a tool to get rid of someone they don't like or who is somehow in their way. But it also lets people like Clara slip through the cracks. She never did explicitly threaten Marcela or herself with bodily harm, so she never gave anyone a legal reason to have her admitted for inpatient treatment. And since she kept lying to her psychiatrist, saying she was fine, he couldn't do anything either, legally or ethically.
I finally had to go check out the ENDA comments to figure out what y'all were talking about. I am confused by the discussion of this taking place over here, where it's not topical, rather than taking it up where it is topical. I feel like I'm aiding and abetting a gossip session taking place behind someone's back. I'm not opposed to off-topic in general, or hearing about people's personal lives but this is just getting wierd. I gently and respectfully ask that the comments to my recaps not become a place to hold discussions about other recaps or recappers or commenters.
Sorry Kat didn't mean to offend thanks for the information about inpatient care.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 6:27:00 PM EST
: Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 6:27:00 PM EST
Mrs. 5ft, I respect you and I am sorry if we bent the rules in a way that you are unhappy with! It is probably best if I watch the novelas alone as I have done for years....don't want to be a part of a problem situation!
"I feel like I'm aiding and abetting a gossip session taking place behind someone's back." Kat, that is a pretty strong statement. I was asked to interpret a comment made to another poster and yes, you could say that ENDA comments should stay on the ENDA blog. But, your word gossip implies "negative" idle comments." If you take the time to read what I wrote, it was NOT gossip, it was a positive spin on another person's comment. I did not and do not take part of "gossip sessions" behind other people's backs here or anywhere else.
Sandy i'm sorry if i got us both in trouble with Kat but i told her i wasn't trying to offend her and i apologize to both of you.I should have told you to come to the ENDA page once again i'm sorry.
Now i have a question for both of you pertaining to the mentally i don't know if we should call them insane or not but anyway here goes.
ENDA just ended tonight and the main villain was a woman who was obsessed with a man who loved her sister. She killed five people including her very own sister who the man that she loved had a child with. She tried to kill a Dr. and twice tried ti kill her own niece.
Along with these murderous actions she displayed unreasonable anger control issues by doctoring her sister insulin medicine, and changing the will of her niece inheritance so she could keep control of her money.
Early on it was shown how she killed animals from a Yorkie puppy to the birds that her sister and niece kept in their house. As a matter of fact when the puppy was discovered drown in a fountain the her sister went immediately to her to confront her about it.
Also the same with the birds giving us a indication that she had a past history of killing animals. Anyway she ended up in a regular prison for her crimes.
This leads me to ask does a criminally insane psychotic person end up in a regular prison or do they deserved to be locked up in a mental institution.
Also she had a pathological jealousy like Clara and lying for her was like second nature for her, one other thing her family kept overlooking her cruelty and killing animals. Therefore she wasn't see a therapist like she should it wasn't taking any medication.
Now i have a question for both of you pertaining to the mentally i don't know if we should call them insane or not but anyway here goes.
ENDA just ended tonight and the main villain was a woman who was obsessed with a man who loved her sister. She killed five people including her very own sister who the man that she loved had a child with. She tried to kill a Dr. and twice tried ti kill her own niece.
Along with these murderous actions she displayed unreasonable anger control issues by doctoring her sister insulin medicine, and changing the will of her niece inheritance so she could keep control of her money.
Early on it was shown how she killed animals from a Yorkie puppy to the birds that her sister and niece kept in their house. As a matter of fact when the puppy was discovered drown in a fountain the her sister went immediately to her to confront her about it.
Also the same with the birds giving us a indication that she had a past history of killing animals. Anyway she ended up in a regular prison for her crimes.
This leads me to ask does a criminally insane psychotic person end up in a regular prison or do they deserved to be locked up in a mental institution.
Also she had a pathological jealousy like Clara and lying for her was like second nature for her, one other thing her family kept overlooking her cruelty and killing animals. Therefore she wasn't see a therapist like she should it wasn't taking any medication.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 11:43:00 PM EST
: Sunday, March 7, 2010 at 11:43:00 PM EST
Anon, you don't have apologize to me!
Too bad there isn't a "general" comment page were related issues brought up by the different novelas could be discussed. We could also talk about the ins and outs of commenting and recapping as well. It does seem as though many of the things that are pertinent to one are pertinent to the others.
I really know so little about our prisons and where the different types of inmates go. Also, I know almost nothing about therapy and how that relates to incarceration. It sounds like Kat has a working knowledge of this subject, maybe she can answer your question.
Have a good day, hope to "see" you soon.
Too bad there isn't a "general" comment page were related issues brought up by the different novelas could be discussed. We could also talk about the ins and outs of commenting and recapping as well. It does seem as though many of the things that are pertinent to one are pertinent to the others.
I really know so little about our prisons and where the different types of inmates go. Also, I know almost nothing about therapy and how that relates to incarceration. It sounds like Kat has a working knowledge of this subject, maybe she can answer your question.
Have a good day, hope to "see" you soon.
Sandy thanks maybe Melinama will give us a page like that, hope you have a good day also.
Permalink posted by : Monday, March 8, 2010 at 9:44:00 AM EST
: Monday, March 8, 2010 at 9:44:00 AM EST
Kat: Another marvelous recap.
So many times during the show, I kept wishing I knew what was being said but greatly comforted in the fact you would explain all - which you did so well. Your writing skills are superb.
This was unusual in that we didn't know who actually died until the end. I kept hoping it was Clara...I was a huge fan of Ana in QE and thought her performance was understated and powerful. I enjoyed Rene's performance as well and Edith Gonzalez was wonderful.
I think Clara's murder was particularly sad as she seemed so sorrowful and beaten down when we first saw her. I would imagine most of this caused by her husband's death. And to die so violently, ack...I kept yelling "no, no" as she took the kitchen shears out of her handbag.
Sandy and anon your stories were chilling - glad you are both all right and thank you for sharing.
Diana
So many times during the show, I kept wishing I knew what was being said but greatly comforted in the fact you would explain all - which you did so well. Your writing skills are superb.
This was unusual in that we didn't know who actually died until the end. I kept hoping it was Clara...I was a huge fan of Ana in QE and thought her performance was understated and powerful. I enjoyed Rene's performance as well and Edith Gonzalez was wonderful.
I think Clara's murder was particularly sad as she seemed so sorrowful and beaten down when we first saw her. I would imagine most of this caused by her husband's death. And to die so violently, ack...I kept yelling "no, no" as she took the kitchen shears out of her handbag.
Sandy and anon your stories were chilling - glad you are both all right and thank you for sharing.
Diana
Permalink posted by : Monday, March 8, 2010 at 9:48:00 AM EST
: Monday, March 8, 2010 at 9:48:00 AM EST
Anon, I'm not an expert but 1) I majored in psychology in college (many years ago!), and 2)I worked in a mental hospital for three years (also many years ago, 1978-81). There's a difference between "neurotic" and "psychotic". It may be that all of Carlota's craziness was neurotic, but not psychotic. The patients in my hospital were far, far more insane than Carlota. They heard voices telling them they were Jesus, one woman told me she was Bob Dylan, they basically had no connection with reality. Legally, if you don't understand what you did, if someone's so far gone that when they killed the baby they thought it was a grapefruit, those people go to the mental hospital, rather than the prison.
Carlota was certainly disturbed, and "sick", but she knew what she was doing, hence prison. However, Carla, in Mujeres Assesinas, was a borderline case. She was pretty much in touch with reality, but her "Beatriz" thing was unlike Carlota's stuff. There WAS no Beatriz, right? This was all in her mind. And when she stabbed Marcela 64 times, and said she wanted to get her husband "out" of her, and went to sleep calmly with her husband, that shows she does not understand what she did. Therefore, she gets put with the criminally insane, whereas Carlota, who did understand what she was doing, goes to regular jail. Again, it's not always easy to draw the line, but this is my opinion (and I'm not really an expert).
Carlota was certainly disturbed, and "sick", but she knew what she was doing, hence prison. However, Carla, in Mujeres Assesinas, was a borderline case. She was pretty much in touch with reality, but her "Beatriz" thing was unlike Carlota's stuff. There WAS no Beatriz, right? This was all in her mind. And when she stabbed Marcela 64 times, and said she wanted to get her husband "out" of her, and went to sleep calmly with her husband, that shows she does not understand what she did. Therefore, she gets put with the criminally insane, whereas Carlota, who did understand what she was doing, goes to regular jail. Again, it's not always easy to draw the line, but this is my opinion (and I'm not really an expert).
I think Hombre's covered it pretty well. The issue of "competence" is a legal one. A lawyer may call a psychiatrist or other expert to testify in support of the idea that the person really didn't know what they were doing, but it's still the lawyer who has to argue that the person can't be held responsible. And then the judge would have to agree that incarceration + treatment is the appropriate sentence.
With Carla, I could see where having her in the general prison population and not receiving treatment would be a huge mess. All she has to do is decide someone's looking at her funny and its "You! You're sleeping with my husband!" all over again.
I just realized that they never said what her husband did after she got locked up. Did he come visit her? Did he divorce her? I guess I could see him staying married to her, if he still thinks of her as the love of his life, but then again, finding out what she did might change his mind!
With Carla, I could see where having her in the general prison population and not receiving treatment would be a huge mess. All she has to do is decide someone's looking at her funny and its "You! You're sleeping with my husband!" all over again.
I just realized that they never said what her husband did after she got locked up. Did he come visit her? Did he divorce her? I guess I could see him staying married to her, if he still thinks of her as the love of his life, but then again, finding out what she did might change his mind!
Thanks Hombre and Kat but i have to ask because while i watch this episode i was so reminded by Carlota because i felt she was not dealing with reality. Her refusal to accept and not understand the object of her obsession did not love was disturbing for me.
Her wanting to place blame on first her sister then her niece for her evil actions that's neurotic? Interesting but it seem to me she was completely insane.
Here's a question i have to ask clearly she showed signs early how disturbed she was by killing small animals shouldn't her family be held accountable for not getting her the obvious therapy she needed?
Her wanting to place blame on first her sister then her niece for her evil actions that's neurotic? Interesting but it seem to me she was completely insane.
Here's a question i have to ask clearly she showed signs early how disturbed she was by killing small animals shouldn't her family be held accountable for not getting her the obvious therapy she needed?
Permalink posted by : Monday, March 8, 2010 at 1:40:00 PM EST
: Monday, March 8, 2010 at 1:40:00 PM EST
Anon, I still think that although Carlota has serious mental problems, refuses to deal with reality, doesn't accept or understand the object of her obsession, blamed her sister and niece for her own evil actions, these are neurotic, not psychotic. Other kinds of neuroses are phobias, and various disorders. They all require therapy.
But psychotic patients are far worse, often talking constantly to themselves, beating their heads against the wall, having no idea who they are, etc. It's really a different thing.
I do think Carlota's family should have done more.
But psychotic patients are far worse, often talking constantly to themselves, beating their heads against the wall, having no idea who they are, etc. It's really a different thing.
I do think Carlota's family should have done more.
Hombre i'm sure that you have read along with some others here the first warning sign about a serial killer is killing animals.
That's where i blamed Carlota's family for not taking that serious at all, just like Carla's husband did not think she would go so far as to hurting someone.
While Kat gave us information concerning involuntary inpatient treatment, i feel that Carla's husband who knew his wife was getting worse and not better should have taken Marcela's plea a little more serious.
Too many people say when someone is like Carla well i really don't think she would actually hurt someone. How do they know they won't whether they are that person's husband or family member.
No one knows what's inside another person's thoughts or just how far they will react. Once again this is why i love this show because it gives a realistic point of view. It's not something that comes off as cartoonish or a simple solution to resolve what we have to deal with. When you come across a person like Carla.
That's where i blamed Carlota's family for not taking that serious at all, just like Carla's husband did not think she would go so far as to hurting someone.
While Kat gave us information concerning involuntary inpatient treatment, i feel that Carla's husband who knew his wife was getting worse and not better should have taken Marcela's plea a little more serious.
Too many people say when someone is like Carla well i really don't think she would actually hurt someone. How do they know they won't whether they are that person's husband or family member.
No one knows what's inside another person's thoughts or just how far they will react. Once again this is why i love this show because it gives a realistic point of view. It's not something that comes off as cartoonish or a simple solution to resolve what we have to deal with. When you come across a person like Carla.
Permalink posted by : Monday, March 8, 2010 at 5:00:00 PM EST
: Monday, March 8, 2010 at 5:00:00 PM EST
Well said, Anon. I agree with your analysis, and also like the show for the same reason. Can't wait til next week!
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