Caray, Caray!

Anita, thanks for the discussion space. Looking forward to the recap.

I'm actually glad David's not getting the olive land, so he can see who (don't remember whether this was in last night's show or in the previews, so I'd better not say) he's up against.

Erica and Miguel - uhf, sizzle! Miguel, don't you kiss her like that again unless you're dropping the Luciana obsession once and for all. Otherwise, you're just a tease.

Looks like Gut never did show up for Lil.

Sonia and Lion Cub in the kitchen. Leon let's her know he better not be a substitute for anybody, not like some character in their romance novel. She swears he's not. The Leon that takes no crap is kinda sexy.
 

Great title Anita.

While the fact David did not get the land wasn't a surprise, the way he handled it garnered some of my admiration. He was regretful but respectful to the seller (sorry, can't remember his name). Although upset, he didn't sulk or indulge in self pity. He was still loving and caring with Luci and seems determined this loss isn't going to rock his world. Although, when he does learn who did purchase it, there will be somewhat of a seismic shock. Yes, now the enemy lines are more clearly drawn. Not for everyone as a viper still nests in his house, but not everything can be revealed quite this early, can it?

Miguel did seem to enjoy those kisses. But, I have a question from the patio. To me, there is nothing like a soft, lingering kiss that goes on and on. Am I too old school? The kisses I'm seeing here are sweet (for the most part) but nothing like the passionate ones I'd like to see.

"The Leon that takes no crap is kinda sexy". Agree Niecie. After last night, I'm thinking these two might have a real furture with each other after all! But, any sympathy I've had for Perla has evaporated.

I'm thinking David has quite a few unpleasant shocks coming - especially as he lears the buyers are a package deal.

C'mon Bobby. Since when have you listened to your sister? If anyone is going to come to the mature conclusion your father will pick a kind, sweet woman, it's going to be you...

Can't wait to read the recap.

Diana
 

Thanks, Anita! Yah, hard not to talk about the previews. I also hope Miguel is moving on. Erica looked like she was on cloud nine after those kisses and he kept on and on sending her into orbit! He discovers there is life outside of Luciana!

David and Luci getting more face time but, sadly, there kisses look a little painful. Anyway, I'm buyin' it because I wanted them together.

Gracie's losing a grip! When she had her eyes locked on Fernanda talking about how "we're not going to let your Dad get his heart set on anybody else because we're familia and we belong together" all rapid-fire machine-gun-like, Fer looked a little spooked! >I was getting a little spooked listening to her speaking English!

And Marta, instead of supporting Luciana, upbraiding her because los niños were upset and afraid for David to start a relationship! Luci always knew where Marta's loyalties laid. Good job, Marta.

Can't wait to see the recap! Thanks!
 

*their

Hey, Diana! Yah, the lingering kisses are wonderful. I've seen so few in the two novelas I'm watching, I take what I can get. Miguel's kisses kinda looked like, ehhump...er..maybe we should leave them alone. . .those were fuse-lighting, engine-starting kisses! Phew! From the looks of those smackeroos, Erica and Miguel may be our first young couple to make it to San Fransisco!
 

Thank you, Anita.

Well, Dave is wearing that leather vest a lot lately. I get visions of the old west. Marshall Dave. Large and in charge. Getting ready to Kick things and take names.

I think that Sonia and her lion cub are going to be a thing soon. I am hearing Foreigner "I want to know what love is...I want you to show me."

Miguel,my lad, kissing like that is playing with some serious feels. Don't do it if you don't mean it. Erica seemed all in.

Dave was a good sport about losing the land. We got to hear a native speaker of English. Can't blame the landdowner for taking the best offer . I liked seeing Juan go all BSC when the guy told him that he got a better offer and Juanny would have to pay more if he wanted the land of olives.

Speaking of BSC, Disgrace looked as though she was going to explode during that little talk with Fer. Yikes.

Lilian seems to be drinking more and bunnyhopping less now that Gut is the new law in town and not coming around. hmmm??

Watching Juan and Disgrace square off was exciting. I think I heard growling and snarling. So, Juan , what's in that little box?
 

Thanks Lila!

Yes, I wouldn't be surprised if Erica and Miguel "make it to San Francisco" (good one :)

You also nailed it with your description of David and Luci's kisses. I really have to fault Lucia, her besos seem emotionless and robotic. If they are really to be believable together, they must emanate some genuine chemistry which is sadly lacking currently.

Susanlynn, I do think Graciela is cra cray and very emotionally unstable. I would not want to be Juan now. Or at any other time come to think of it.

Diana
 

San Francisco, here we come..finally? ..someone??! ..anyone who is not Lilian,Gut, Perla, Juan, or Marked.

I see the couples lining up at the boarding gate..Dave and Luci, Soosan and Seize her, Sonia and her cub, Tano and Fer, Lilian and a bottle , Disgrace and Satan on a double date with Perla and Juan . Ramon hasn't been seen following Marta around much lately. I don't think that match is going to happen. Poor Ramon. Could the writers possibly think that Marta could forgive Gut if he saves one of her kids ? Gut servicing Lilian gives me the creeps. He should just go away.
 

Niecie, with you about Miguel. He started with the "but", errrrr. Why does he get someone like Erika longing for him? She's beautiful, smart, funny, a land owner and doesn't really need Miguel. If she hangs in there at least put a time limit on it and don't tell Miguel and punt him if he doesn't come round.

Now looks like Bobby will have a little girlfriend too. Gawd.

I don't believe a word Luciana tells David. Right before they kiss she reminds me of when I was little my mother made a dish, heavy with fermented shrimp paste, I just couldn't get past my lips but my father would make me. I sat and squirmed, almost gag at the smell, touch it to the tip of my tongue, count to 3, hold my breath and shovel it down. Barf

 

OMG! Seize her I am so glad I hadn't taken a sip of my tea! Susanlynn, that is side-splitting good! I love the date line-up as well. . DisGrace and Satan! Yah, I can see that!
 

Hi, everyone. I have enjoyed all your comments.

Did we really need to introduce a girlfriend for Bobby? What is he..8 ?

OT..If anyone has Starz, starting this week, they will show Outlander season one and two. One episode per week every Friday at 9 pm until season three starts in September. Very good kissing scenes.
 

Hey, Susanlynn! What books are covered in season 1 and 2? Thanks!
 

The dates lining up for a trip is a classic. Sieze Her ! Noun or verb?

Lillian and a bottle, too funny thanks Sue, when you are good you are real good.

Yep DisGruntled looks like she is about to overheat and blow a head gasket. (Always Messy)

Tofie: T H A T explains a lot ! :-)
 

Bobby's new girlfriend maybe will go on about how her new Mom is the coolest thing since sliced bread.
 

Just got home, tired. I will cherry pick some of the best lines to add to the shorter recap I'll do tomorrow. All the comments are right on point.

Diana, Lila--I'm with you on kissing in telenovelas. Some directors feel that if you eat your partner's mouth it's somehow sexy--yech. I like it slow and lingering, too. I've seen GS kiss before in other tns. He's always a little awkward, but sincere. This pairing just has no spark, no desire, no fulfillment. We just get Luci's toothy smile before she lets Daahveed kiss her.

Miguel's kisses fogged up my screen.

I'm tired of the brown leather vest.
 

Anita- Maybe Televisa needs to bring William Levy back, just to have him give their other galan stars kissing lessons. His kisses are so well known, people have compiled videos of just his kissing scenes from tns. See this example of the Sortilegio kisses: http://tinyurl.com/gq2lxg6

 

Vivi....three words for Sweet William ..wet, white pants. However, I always liked Fernando Columba's kisses. My mother (who was the opposite of a romantic) used to hate scenes of what she called "fish kissing."

Anita. I agree about the brown leather vest. Dave seems to be wearing it a lot lately. I think that it is supposed to signify that he has unleashed his badass self and now needs leather instead of fabric vests. Is he channeling Wyatt Earp? Spartacus?

Kirby, thanks. Glad to give you a grin.

OT..Lila, season one is book one. Season two is Dragonfly. If you have StarZ , I encourage you to watch. Have you finished Dragonfly? They are currently filming season three which is Voyager book 3. Jamie is Sam Heughan..Verra bonnie lad...Olympic gold medal kisser. Smitten. Go to outlander on YouTube and check out all the fanmade music videos of Claire and Jamie.


 

Colunga..thank you, autocorrect...very helpful.
 

C O L U N G A...Oohhh
I thought you were talking about Columbo. I never thought peter Faulk was all that sexy myself. :-(
 

Anita.."Semi Official Sonoma Vigilante " gave me a giggle. I agree that those kisses were pretty steam inducing. Did he play a lot of Spin the Wine Bottle in his youth, or is he just a natural?
 

Thanks for the discussion page Anita.
What is it with y'all and this vest? Look past the vest Lol, he makes the vest look good, "the man makes the vest, Lol. This discussion page is fun
That means the recap will be dynamite!
(Thank you JJ).
Crazi-ella is about to blow her top off. Braty better be careful.
Lil is dating her bottle,now that's funny. Serves her right.

These people are really hating on David something fearce. And that dumb
Reason whinyjuan gives for hating is just dumb. His daddy made a bad business choice that would have fallen
Through, and the Ol man offed himself,
Not David's fault. But whinyjuan and
His "you made my daddy kill himself song"will go hold. This about to get nasty. David's grapes get irrigation
From water that comes through kent's Olive Grove. Juan's gonna enjoy cuttin that off. Grapevine murderer. Has his
Hair gotten grayer around the temple?

I agree mig shouldn't do the tongue dance with Erica If his hearts not in
It. Just his tongue. Yuck, not good mug.
Thanks Anita. Come short recap :).
 

"Will go gold" the juanywine song.
 

I'm afraid my engineer is showing.
One word David:

WELL.

Correction-- two words
WELL----PUMP

Final Answer.
 

Just caught up with this episode. Not a good development for David because Juan isn't going to reveal his true colours that quickly. The one thing that could do that is if David finds out that SkidMark has 20% of that action.

I have only two words for Fernanda: Grow up! Your father is too young to live like a monk. He can't be a martyr to lost love for the rest of his life and the stepmother you really don't want is your Aunt Succubus.
 

Mr. Kent Niecie.
It is a simple matter to look up the real estate transaction. In U S A who owns which property is not exactly a big fricking secret. So maybe Dim Bulb Dave will soon figure out NoJuan, and hopefully get a hint about succubus-in-law too.

After all Dave has done for NoJuan and all he has put up with and let NoJuan get away with, this should bump our Dim Boy off his boring dead center. He should give him an ass whipping as a going away present. Then we could stop wondering about who would win a fight between the two.

When/If Dave figures it out, will this 'polio vaccine level' discovery open his eyes and cause Dave to view some other relationships with a jaundiced eye? I hope so, as he has already set our 'watch stupidity' threshold to a record high.

Kimy Two R is at her best as a raving psycho bitch. She is pretty when she laughs, but is on fire when she is about to have an aneurysm at NoJuan. Wow. I am sure she is already working on a plan to profit from NoJuan's betrayal of David and hoping to all hell NoJuan does not spill the beans about her being the next highest bidder.
 

I don't think she is in a strong bargaining position with Juan. She didn't have enough money to outbid him and he knows about her having killed Lisa even if he has no material proof. All he has to be is observant enough to know what buttons to push to get her to fly off the edge.

Or get Lillian to do it because she's better at it. That would be a better idea (if he's smart enough to think of this) because that would set the two of them against each other.
 

Yeah, David is a good guy and tries to be fair with everyone and unfortunately this allows people to take advantage.

David was fair with Cesar and confessed to kissing Graciela. Allowed Graciela to stay at the house for the kids despite the trouble she caused when Lisa was alive. Felt guilty about Juans father. Knows Lilian is a mooch but she's the grandmother. Didn't want to tie Luciana down, even asking Miguel to take care of her, though they both rubbed it in his face constantly. Agreed to split the fine when Leon harbored an illegal. Took Susan under his protection and beat Mark down. Gave Miguel a good reference though he taunted him over the woman he loves. Doesn't say a word about Luciana's "friendship" with Miguel though Miguel tells him to his face she'll be his one day with no protest from her. He is fiercely loyal to Marta and defends her from Lilian though both women squabble over the same man in his house. Out of respect for Marcos and guilt for not being able to bring him back to the US gave Luciana a job.

Unfortunately, Bobby's gone wobbly so all David has is Cesar and a fair weather Luciana who is more concerned daily with her ex bf who still doesn't know for certain she has even kissed David.

I worry what happens when Luciana dumps David for Miguel, his world will be crushed with another pile on. Susan asked her what she will do when the new and improved Miguel shows up at her door to reclaim his prize and she wouldn't answer but had her trademark avoid the uncomfortable question look.

Maybe the mother of Bobby's little girl friend is single.

 

When Dave finds out, (surely he will) DisGracie could pretend to be on Dave's side against that mean old double crossing NoJuan. She won't let a blowup pass without trying to make something positive (for her) out of it.

I'm not sure how, unless she claims that she found out NoJuan's evil scheme at the last minute and tried to short circuit it (on David's behalf) by bidding on the land herself.

NoJuan certainly has the upper hand in that he has a very strong suspicion that DisGrace killed Lisa. But not proof.
But as things spiral downward, he always has that as an ace up his sleeve.

DisGrace is showing herself to be highly unstable, although a good actress, hiding her volatility most of the time except that little spurt of steam that escaped toward FerBrat recently.

NoJuan's issues with her is that mostly she is just in his way. He wants to destroy David, while she wants David kept alive until she can capture him.
 

The people here on the patio are much smarter than the characters...and the writers. You all could write much better stories .

Tofie..you have convinced me that Dave has definitely turned..slowly..into the galan now that Sleeping Beauty has awakened.

I must have been dreaming about this story because when I woke up , I thought of the perfect name for Santa Barbara wine..Better Than Dave's. Maybe I should change careers and go into marketing .
 

Oooops, didn't mean David is the galan Susanlynn. I like him and wished he were but David is only a plot whipping boy that happens to own the playhouse and buys the groceries. I don't like Miguel but he is the galan, with three women that would die protecting him and a couple may. Heck, the writers spend more time on Miguel than any character and made certain to give him a sweet landing as Luciana works through the crush she has on the boss. No makeout session between David and Luciana is without a timely cutaway to Miguel. They don't have to be so obvious but Luciana has left the door open for his return with tickets to San Francisco in hand.
 

Tofie..I still think that Dave and Luci are meant to be together in the end since Gab Soto is a star and the guy playing Miguel is a newbie. But then...I am never right, so....who knows.

I wish that the writers would start revealing what is up with Gut. Ramon has been following Marta like a puppy (well, more like a loyal hound) probably since his wife left him. Marta seems to have no interest in him. I think that Ramon has to embrace technology and start online dating. I am sure that some lady would love to find a good,faithful soul. Yeah, Ramon makes Cesar look like a badass.
 

Recap is ready. I didn't think incorporating comments would be so hard. I wanted to include them all and had a tough time choosing. Enjoy this AFTER-THE-FACTS recap.
 

Anita! What a treat this mahvelous recap is! Thank you for making it feel like even more of a conversation among friends than it always does! Gracias!

Be back in a minute to read comments, just wanted to say how happy these lines, among others, made me:

Mr. Kent tells the expectant couple This Land is their Land. .

Loved it, Anita! I think I may go back and look at those last two kisses which maybe weren't as snaggle-toothed as the first ones!
 

BTW--Question--Why is Lil drinking herself into a stupor. She always had the upper hand with Gut. Hasn't she used her cell phone, text messages, in person visits whenever she felt like intruding in his life? I'd love to know if she's tried and got rebuffed. In her normal state she wouldn't have taken getting stood up lying down (hehe).

Thank you, Lila. It was fun.
 

Thanks to you, Anita, and Trini Lopez. Too many funny remarks to quote. You always give me some giggles , and I love anyone who can make me laugh.

Isn't it interesting that some screen couples just have chemistry and some don't. Sometimes, we find out later that the chemistry was happening in reality. Also, what makes someone attracted to someone ? It must be difficult to have a believable love scene with somebody who is not your cuppa tea. People often have a certain "type" that they are always attracted to. Beauty is truly in the eyes of the beholder. Which couple do you think has the most believable chemistry? Lilian and her bottle do not count.

Right now, I look forward to watching Disgrace spinning out of orbit...delicious. You can see the lightning bolts shoot out of those gray eyes . She loves to throw stuff because she evidently never has to pick that stuff up later. ..like we mere mortals do;-) Just saying. I am waiting for he corked bottle that is Disgrace to explode.
 

Oy, Vivi--Sweet William still leaves me weak in the knees and heart pounding. Thanks for the trip down memory lane.
 

Tofie: We know David & Luciana are endgame!

 

Darn it! Don't know what happened to my other lines I liked of yours, Anita. Here are a couple:

Bobby is delighted she speaks soccer.

David tells Luci the bad news about the olive tree farm. She picks him up, dusts him off and winds him up to get started again.


 

Awesome how you weaved the comments into the recap Anita. Thanks


 

Anita, I can't begin to imagine how difficult this was to piece together. But, you did it. Seamlessly. And brilliantly.

Your taking the time and effort to incorporate our comments so cleverly is greatly appreciated. I had a smile on my face the entire time. I think although our opinions of the characters aren't always in sync, our varying insights and opinions somehow meshed together. Our Lila said it best with "Thank you for making it feel like even more of a conversation among friends than it always does!" The camaraderie here is so unique and very special.

"Mr. Kent (who is no Clark)" and "She picks him up, dusts him off and winds him up to get started again" were great.

"[I'm tired of his vest AND his kisses.]" Sometimes there can be palpable sexual tension between characters with only a glance, without touching. I think we are all wishing for it with David and Luci, but it just isn't showing. If the raging inferno is not going to ignite, I'll be disappointed. All I'm seeing is a whiff of smoke and the embers are just cold.

Anita, thank you!

Diana
 

Thanks, Tofie--you all gave me plenty of fodder to feed the cannon.

Susanlynn--To be honest, the only couple here that is totally believable ARE Erica and Miguel. He seemed so overpowering and possessive and obsessive with Luci--all over her, panting, slobbering, hanging on to her--and I guess we were supposed to see him that way. But maybe it was Luci lacking chemistry all along.

This is the NEW Miguel and I'm liking him a lot--gentle, tender, sexy, seductive, playful and to begin with a good kisser (we'll see what comes next). And Erica bided her time so that kiss was meaningful for both of them.

Tano and Fer seem to be believable, but I really don't count them. This is a very young love and could change at any moment.

Ya, haha, Lil and her bottle don't count. You, Susanlynn, have a wicked sense of humor and I'm so glad you are watching and commenting on this tn. I've missed you and your insight and your barbs for far too long.
 

Anita...wow ..you are really turning my head. Em...You may not be surprised to find out that not everyone appreciates my sense of humor.. Especially the very serious folks.

So..if you had to pick your favorite guy on this show, would it be Miguel? To tell truth, going by looks alone, I am enjoying looking at Juan..definitely..dark hair, dark eyes, some gray in the beard, no vests. I also think Tano is very cute and will become a very handsome man as he matures . I have liked Miguel from the start ..rugged good looks , and I evidently am okay with a guy who hovers all over. ..protective, passionate, hopelessly devoted. As for my favorite couple, I think it has to be Tano and Fer despite the fact that she is an immature brat. There is real chemistry between the two , and Tano is a good guy and a good influence on Fer.

Okay, back to surfing between "Son of Zorn" and the Oscar Red Carpet.
 

Thanks, Anita. Fab job. So cute the way you weaved in all our conversation. Loved this Anita-ism: He reminds her that since the two other legs of their three-legged stool pulled out, it’s every leg for themselves. - lol

 

Good work, Anita. I've finally caught up.

I agree that Bobby is a little young for a girlfriend, but so is little Diego in MdN. This is nothing we haven't seen before. Tonight's recap will be on time unless I have technical problems.

Perla knows that Juan is looking to ruin David. You'd think she'd find that a little disturbing. I am so done with her.
 

Maybe Bobby and his gf have time to enter the young wine contest and steal a victory from daddy and Miguel.




 

Isn't Bobby supposed to be around 12 or 13? I don't think that FerBrat was 10 when he was born.
 

Wasn't he having a birthday party the day Lisa was stoned? Wasn't he turning 8 or 9? I don't think he's supposed to be 13, but I would put him at 10 or 11 (9+2=11).

Urban, I quote you from Episode #4, "Lillian returned to Lisa and David's home. Same vitch, different year. Bobby, the son who was just conceived in the last episode, is now about 9 or 10; it's also his birthday. He obviously preferred Marta's company to his abuela's. Fernanda looks about 12 and seems to be spoiled. She wanted to skip out on Bobby's birthday to see her Tia Graciela and hear all her exciting stuff."

I seem to remember Fer being a toddler of 2 or so when Marcos and Luciana were deported. So, Bobby was conceived soon after.
 

I knew she couldn't have been as old as 10. Bobby has a 12-year-old face but he's rather short to be that age. He's cute, though.

I'm now wondering about the twins from MCET. They were such handsome little boys in that series.
 

OMG the twins in MCET were adorable. Mischievous little rascals, but cute as a button.. I would watch a TN just to laugh at their antics.
 

They say the fruit doesn't fall far from the tree, so little Bobby's girlfriend's chastity is safe for the next twenty years or so.
 

I loved those twins. They also actually looked like they were sons of Jorge Salinas (my favorite leading man).
 

Gracias, Anita! Very cool to incorporate the Patio commentary.

What really stunned me was when Marta and Luci were talking, and Marta referred to the kids as "mis ninos." OK I get that she feels responsible for them, but to call them that to her ACTUAL daughter's face... boo hiss.

So do we have a new rule that we can't talk about what we see in the avances? Why not, they're part of the episode? We never had this restriction before.

One thing I don't get about Erica - why does she want to be the rebound girlfriend?

The worst TN kissing I ever saw was in Destilando Amor, between Isadora and Frankie the grifter. They looked like two lampreys.

I've seen kiddie-romance storylines in TNs before and usually they are annoying, but I'm okay with Bobby and Summer. They're cute without being precious. Maybe this will bring him back to his senses regarding his father's right to be happy.
 

Julie - I don't remember Caray's policy on previews so I stay on the safe side and don't mention them, but I do remember watching a Telemundo TN (Dueños del paraíso, I think) where everybody agreed not to talk about previews because they were giving away too much.
 

I don't mind Bobby having a gf as much as why? We already have Luciana that acts like a 13 year old with her first bf.
 

The kids in MdN are just friends not novios.
 

Julie--The tns we watch on Univision do include avances and we all see them, but there's no hard and fast rule about not mentioning what's coming in the comments. Sometimes the recapping team leader requests it, sometimes not. Sometimes the avances are mentioned at the end of the recap, sometimes not.

Over on Telemundo, they have established their own code of NOT bringing the avances into the recap or comments section.

While there is no strict prohibition on Looneyvision, nor is it a new rule, most commenters don't bring them into the conversation.

Personally, I think it's more fun not to mention them and perhaps "be surprised." There is enough to talk about with the episodes just shown (or earlier ones--hehe, due to failing memories). Of course, from Friday night to Monday night is a long time, so if we drop a hint or two, no one is going to get too excited.

I did remove the description of one scene in Mujeres de Negro that wasn't going to be shown until the next day. My mind's eye is on the future. I appreciate not knowing anything ahead if I'm watching a telenovela that finished on xfinity, Netflix or YouTube, but reading the wonderful recaps and comments as I go along (right now it's A Que No Me Dejas).

So, there it is in a nutshell.

Tofie--you are always good for a "stop, wait a minute, what did she say? Oh, that's funny and so true." In this case it's your reference to VeA already having a juvenile with her first boyfriend being Luciana. De verdad!
 

I have been around a lot of kids , and Bobby and friends do not look like 13 year oldsfo me. Anyhoo, I can suspend my disbelief.

As for not mentioning previews, when I first came to Carey Carey when it first started about 9 years ago, people sometimes commented on the previews. Then, later, we were told not to comment on previews. Whatever. The previews on Friday were quite...hem...interesting , so I can't wait until we see things play out tonight .
 

We have not seen much if Gut since he won the election for sheriff, so I am wondering what is going in with Hus storyline. Has he dropped Lilian like a hot potato now that he us sheriff? Is he closing in on the people who brought in the illegal immigrants?

So..we all know that certain people have anvils hanging directly over their heads, but exactly what will those anvils be? Is there death or prison waiting for some folks?
 

Thanks Anita. That's all news to me. I used to include the avances in my recaps. The only reason I quit for Yago is that I had to watch on Hulu, which didn't show avances. (Come to think of it, I think we did agree not to talk about avances on Yago because we couldn't all see them.)

We used to discuss avances all the time - often getting worked up over what we saw - only to discover the next day that they we had been misled. E.g., that apparent attack turned out to be part of a dream sequence; someone who seems to be discovering a shocking secret is actually gaping for some innocuous reason.
 

Susanlynn, I hope Disgrace goes to prison. I don't think the other ladies would like her very much.
 

We have almost 60 episodes to go and this isn't AQNMD so nobody's going to hell yet.

Some of us don't see avances where we view and others see different ones so I'm in favor of not talking about them.

But it continues to amaze me that this series usually gets a higher comment count when it's the least well-written of all the ones we're currently covering.
 

I know Vino isn't Televisa's finest work, but we're having fun here in the comments. I've only got time for one TN, and the timing worked out for this one - starting right after TVA.

Also, I like the agricultural setting and the fact that everyone speaks a little English!

But yeah, I agree it's a bit of a stinker. But I feel like all the ingredients are there for a good TN; I keep hoping it will somehow miraculously get better.
 

Despite my disappointment this is not a bad story and plenty of angles to ponder and golly 60 more episodes a lot will happen.

My biggest unmet expectation is the absence of any sizzle between Luciana and David after waiting and watching 60+ episodes of Miguel and Luciana heavy petting.

It's hard for me to take Luciana serious no matter how many belt buckles, leather bracelets and embarrassed honeys she delivers to a grown ass man that has declared his love, removed his wedding ring, given his deceased wife's stuff away, willing to pitch out his inlaws, upset his children, upset his kids nanny, marry her and make her a business partner. The relationship is so one sided David looks desperate and Luciana amused.
 

I wish I could know whether Luciana is supposed to look that way (indifferent, amused) or if this is a failure on the parts of the actress and director. It really doesn't make any sense to me. I feel that we are supposed to believe that her devotion to David is real and deep, even though it doesn't look that way.
 

Urban..wow..I never keep track of the number of episodes, so I am wondering how the writers are going to s t r e t c h this show for 60 ...60 ! .. More episodes. Maybe Bobby will get more girlfriends. Maybe he will date an older woman..like 14.Maybe Dave will suddenly and without warning stop wearing vests , and Miguel will start wearing them. Maybe Tano will decide to get a buzzcut. Maybe Marta will stop wearing those dreadful black orthopedic shoes. How are they going to fill those 60......60 ! Episodes ?

As for the number of comments, I remember Jane, our blog mom , saying that the worst telenovelas are often the most fun to watch. I watch for the fun, the escape from harsh reality, and and the friendly atmosphere. I have been "talking " to several people here for years.

I usually watch just one telenovela at a time , and it is often in the 9 pm spot.


 

Julie..After seeing Irina (Luci) playing the bad girl in PyP and doing a terrific job, it seems as though the actress is more comfortable playing nasty and spoiled than sweet but strong-willed. Luci comes off more cranky and impatient than strong and confident to me. I still don't like the character.
 

Julie I got a severe spanking for talking about a little preview that showed after the episode like you mentioned. Right of wrong, I learned my lesson and keep my big mouth shut from now on. It is not as bad as it used to be years ago when all the neurotic old cat ladies took over for a while. I was banned. Note: If you just have / like a cat, I'm not talking about you, But if you have twenty...if the shoe fits.
 

Susanlynn, as horrible as that prospect is, it's enough time for an upgraded Miguel to come back to Los Angeles and re-claim Luci who has stomped away from David who has taken up with Gracie because he doesn't want to upset Fer and Bobby. As improbably and crazy as that sounds, perhaps it's not impossible. I would be totally turned off but seems it could happen. :/
 

Lila, with the vast number of episodes still ahead of us, I feel as though what you describe is almost inevitable. I don't really want to see Disgrace sink her fangs into David, but there's plenty of time for her to seduce him, trick him, or maybe just drug him so they have at least one icky night together.
 

Urban I am surprised with the comment count too. I...think it is more the recappers and the patio than how interesting the show is. A so so show with great recappers AND a group on the patio who all enjoy it will get comments out the ying yang. But even a good show and a few commenters who are out there seems to water down the comments. Likewise, a couple Napoleons recapping and I'm gone, I don't know about anybody else.
 

OK, well it's fine with me not to discuss avances now that I know - but I do worry because sometimes I remember something I've seen and I don't even realize it was only in the avances.

Although, it's a lot easier to remember now that the avances are shown in a little frame. They used to be full-screen and sometimes I didn't know the regular episode had already ended.
 

I don't see David trying with Graciela but I do see him disappointed and crushed by another bout of "confusion" by Luciana. No way Miguel isn't gonna try and she'll go and desperate Dave will be left scratching his head. Miguel totally disrespected David, telling him to his face he would reclaim Luciana and she didn't dispute his claim then and hasn't yet. If she loved David as she pretends she would tell Miguel it's not gonna happen and why. She couldn't even tell Susan it wouldn't happen.
 

You're right, Tofie, and that is a big turn off in a "Leading Lady" for me! David IS way more into her while Luci is dipping into dangerous, even life-threatening waters to "protect and defend" Miguel! What is he, seven? It will be VERY disappointing if she "saws the limb off" that Dave is out on, as you have described. The lack of chemistry is one thing, but her refusal to declare her love for David in front of David to Miguel's face when he makes these stupid, "Ahma come back and claim you, woman" declarations is frustrating.

60 episodes? Eh, by the time we get to the end, I prolly will give less of a damn how this all shakes out. And I can't even get STARZ! Grrrr!
 

Good point, Tofie - I can't blame the actress or the director for Luci's failure to dispute Mig's claim on her. That was in the script. So we are actually SUPPOSED to not like her? Or identify with her "confusion"? That doesn't work for me.
 

I am surprised that so far Disgrace has been so subtle and patient in her attempts to seduce Dave. However, with 60 episodes remaining, we may just see desperate Disgraceful resorting to wilder options. We have all seen telenovelas in which the bad girl gets the galan drugged or drunk and puts him in a compromising position. Cellphones have added a new ease to snapping photos of the orchestrated tryst. Bleeecchhh.

OT..Lila....so, what page are you on?
 

This is true. The drugged unconsciousness and the cell phone camera are a nasty combination. I often curse whoever came up with the idea of putting digital cameras in cell phones.
 

It is starting to sound like we are talking about a gold mine instead of a woman with all the talk about "claiming" and "reclaiming" her. Does the winner get a deed?

On another site that I visit, folks had a discussion of the word "conquest." If someone is smitten with someone , does that constitute a conquest even if the person smitten upon (?)doesn't want it? Or do you have to set out to win someone to make it a conquest.
 

Seems to me that if you didn't set out to win someone, then what you have is not a conquest but an accident.
 

I waiver between one opinion and the other. As an example, many boys were smitten by my friend Mary Jane even ones she was not interested in. However, had she , in effect, conquered them without even trying?
 

I'd say she "collected" them, maybe. I dunno. There's got to be a word for that, but I don't think it should be considered a conquest if she didn't have to lift a finger.
 

Ah, the conquest! Just find a "sex positive" girl like we have over in AQNMD, and it doesn't matter!

OT--Susanlynn, I'm on page 290 of Dragonfly!
 

Whoa! Thanks for the BESOS link, Vivi!
 

I'm thinking Acquired, or even in Star Trek assimilated.

Acquired is good, though. Like when you achieve lock on a target.

Or if she's a 'Fan Club Builder', then the sap is just simply added.
 

Goodness Gracious we have been chatty today. It's been quite a lively discussion.

I've always been bothered by the way the Spanish word "conquistar" is thrown around meaning, set your eye on someone, go after him/her, hook him/her, and reel him/her in. Then you can fillet it and throw away the bones. You'll have putty in your hands.

It just doesn't sound right to translate conquistar as conquer. I tend to think of is as subjugate or vanquish, like Tamarlane, Gengis Kahn, William the Conqueror, and others of more recent vintage, who tend to conquer and rule over people and land masses, not lovers.

I hadn't thought about the 60 episodes left. Plenty of time for DisGracie to bed David and for Luci to run away with Miguel. I can't see David and Luci carrying on a hidden romance for even 30 of those 60 before someone catches them.

Tofie and everyone--I so agree, if it's in the script, we can't fault Luci entirely. They must be prepping us for another round of confusion when our "conquering" hero returns to claim his prize. The big hint is there, we just haven't seen it--Luci not proclaiming her love for David infront of David and Miguel.

So far, only Susan and her mother know her most recent feelings for David.
Ok, time to sign off and get ready for tonight's fun times.
 

Just thought of an old song that could have been the theme song for this novela. Go to YouTube and check out "If you're going to San Francisco..."
 

Lila- You're welcome! ;-) Those kisses are so hot, YouTube asks us if we're 18 before they let us watch. Ahhh, the days before Uni decided they needed to be our nanny and censor everything.
 

I don,t think Erica sees herself as the rebound gf. She could be thinkin by the time she done lovin him up he'll go...luciana who? And he's not far from that.