Saturday, April 22, 2017
Vino el Amor, #131, Friday Apr 21, 2017: Between a Rock and Another Rock
Lilian tells Marta, "you're a hussy just like your damned daughter!" This brings out Marta's little fists of fury. Bobby walks in and asks what's happening. Marta tells him everything's fine! David comes in and wants to know what's going on. Lil pulls herself up and says that Marta attacked her, she doesn't know why. David wants an explanation.
Bobby is very upset about what he just witnessed. Lilian says that Marta is a savage and was screaming at her like a crazy person. Marta yells at her not to lie. She demands that Lil tell the truth. (Marta, if YOU would tell the truth once in a while, it would be better for everyone. Like that time she overheard Lilian in the coffee shop.) David sends Marta to the employee house.
Alone with David (and Bobby), a trembling Lilian repeats that Marta came in angry and crazy. Then she announces that the sheriff was killed, and starts to cry. Although her grief is real, it also appears as though she is putting on a little show for David and Bobby as she mentions again that Marta came in and attacked her. Bobby tries to comfort her. David pulls Bobby away and tells him to watch TV (which is probably being pre-empted with coverage of the sheriff's murder). David says to Lil in English, "I'll be right back."
Perla and Juan have calmed down somewhat. Perla says the police will be looking for them, and she doesn't want to go to jail. Juan thinks Carito will be too afraid to talk. He's also sure that there's no evidence linking them to Gut's death, and whatever Carito told the Sheriff won't matter now. (He is making a lot of assumptions.) If they leave town now, it'll look suspicious, so Juan thinks they should just be cool and go on as usual.
Juan says he never intended for Carito to be harmed. Those guys were just supposed to bring her here if she went to the sheriff. It was all just an accident. Perla looks like she's thinking really hard about it.
Perla asks Juan to swear that it was an accident. Juan swears that he didn't plan to hurt Gutierrez - nor Carito, he adds at Perla's prompting. She's still worried. They could even be sentenced to death. What if those guys said something before they shot Gut? He brushes this off. She makes him swear that he'll protect her.
Bobby is still upset about the fighting fieras. David wants to know exactly what Bobby saw. Bobby was watching TV and heard yelling. He came out to see, and Marta was pushing Grandma around. They were yelling ugly things and crying. David asks Bobby to confirm that they were hitting one another. Bobby says that Marta was hitting Lilian.
David wants to take care of it, but Bobby asks him to stay a little longer. David pulls him into a hug.
Gracie comes home all chipper and finds her mother crying. "Gutierrez got killed defending Marta," Lilian sobs. "She took everything from me. And he said that he loved Marta. And she hit me. I hate her!"
Grace responds with all the empathy she can summon - that is, none. She doesn't understand why Marta was even here - she was supposed to be away on vacation. Lilian vows to destroy Marta. She wants Marta out of here, never to come near this house again. Grace's facial expression reflects mild bemusement, as if she just noticed a ketchup stain on her blouse and didn't remember eating anything with ketchup.
Marta comes home - she still has some of Brian's blood on her face and neck, by the way - still crying. She tells Carito she beat up that old woman who had Marcos and Luciana deported. She asks Carito to tell her what she told Brian. Why were those guys following her?
Carito doesn't want to say anything to put Marta in danger. Marta asks that when she's ready, to please go to the police and tell them everything - she owes it to Brian for saving her life. Tell them her secret so that Brian's death won't have been in vain.
Grace brings her mother some pills and water, but Lil doesn't want any. "The man I loved just died." Grace sighs impatiently. Then David comes in, and Grace hurriedly grabs her mother, hugs her and says how worried she is to see her mother this way. David wants to hear Lilian's side of the story.
Lil says she was still in shock over Brian's death when Marta came in all crazy, hurling insults at her when she was in so much pain. David asks, why was Marta yelling at you? Lil says that Marta said Gut died in her arms and gave his life for Marta because he loved her, and he never loved Lilian. Grace acts very wounded and bewildered. Lil continues that Marta said she hated Lil because it was Lil's fault that Brian had deported Marta's husband and daughter.
"But that's absurd," Lil adds. David doesn't think so, though. He doubts that Marta would have said that if she didn't have a reason to. Grace's head whips around (not quite 180°) to face David, and she makes a sound that can best be expressed as "?!?".
Lilian admits that back in those days, Brian was an immigration officer, and she advised him to do something to get the respect of his superiors. That's all. Gracie adds that he was just doing his job. Lil says that Marta took it personally because of all the problems they've had between them.
David says he'll talk to Marta, but he tells Lil he doesn't want this to happen again in his house, and especially not in front of Bobby. Lil gets angry and accuses him of being on Marta's side. She walks off. Grace gives David a look of disgust and waves her hand disapprovingly at him.
Well, maybe Gracie's not as angry with David as I thought, because now she just seems to be worrying aloud about her mother. She pretends to be mystified by Marta's sudden behavior after being so nice for so many years. She says it's the second time she's acted this way. David agrees that it's strange and worrisome. Grace suggests that Marta might be "going through something" that they don't know about. She urges him to speak to Marta because she's worried about Marta... and the kids. Bobby was so frightened.
David agrees, but believes that Marta will have an explanation. Grace says okay, just take care of it so it doesn't get worse. She doesn't like the way Marta spoke to her mother. But she's sure David will do the right thing - because he always puts the faaaaamily first.
Carito has just made Marta a cup of tea. Marta still hasn't washed her face yet. Ramon, Tano, and Leon come home. Marta rushes into Ramon's arms, and I am curious how she's going to spin this. How does one tell one's boyfriend that she's sad because her other boyfriend just died in her arms? Then she lets Leon hold her. She tells them that some men accosted them on the street, Brian defended Marta and Carito, and the men killed Brian. "Brian gave his life for me!" (Ramon must be wondering how much longer he's going to have to hear about this guy.)
Leon calls Luciana and tells her she's needed at "home." He tells her what happened. Luci tells Miguel. He wants to go with her, but she says no.
In the employee kitchen, there is a lot of sadness and hugging as Carito tells them the story. Ramon says he's grateful to Gut for giving his life for "mi Marta." Then Luci flies through the door like Kramer. Marta tells Luci the story. "I couldn't do anything to save him," Marta finishes, as if she would be expected to heal a gunshot wound to the chest.
Marta tells Luci and Leon that Lilian is the one who had Luci and Marcos deported. Supposedly he had never had the chance to tell Marta before. Luci wants to settle Lil's hash right now, but Marta doesn't want her to make things worse. Luci thinks Marta should at least tell David. Leon agrees, but Marta believes that David would only take Lilian's side since he's marrying her daughter. (I notice that when Luci hugs her mother, she doesn't make a fist.)
Luci doesn't think the one thing has anything to do with the other, but Marta says that Bobby saw the fight and he was upset. (Just admit it, Marta: YOU SCREWED IT UP.)
Graciela sits down with Bobby, who is still disconcerted. Grace says she's very worried about Marta, but Bobby doesn't have to worry, because nothing ugly like that will happen in this house again (FAMOUS LAST WORDS). She swears to it; and friends, if her word isn't good, then what hope is left in the world? She pulls him to her bosom and ominously adds that it's very sad that Bobby's nana is changing so much and behaving this way, but Gracie will be there for him. She smirks over the boy's head.
David arrives at the employee kitchen. "My mother has something very important to tell you," Luci announces. (If this wine thing doesn't work out for her, she could become a TV show host.) Marta tells David about Gut's statement that Lilian is the one who told Gut to deport the family. "For that reason, I hope that you understand why I quarreled like that with her." David said that wasn't the way to go about it, and especially not in front of Bobby, who was very anguished to see it. He insists that Marta apologize to Lilian.
Leon shakes his head in disbelief. Luci protests. Leon says that David should talk to Lilian. David said he already got her version of things. Marta says she's quite sure that he got Lil's "version." David is more focused on the harm to Bobby, which makes me think that Marta should apologize to Bobby, not Lil, but nobody asked me. Marta refuses to apologize to Lil. David tells her not to be prideful; it sets a bad example for his employees. "Ah, so LILIAN is a good example?" Luci inquires sarcastically.
David tells Marta to think about it, but Marta says there's nothing to think about. She won't do it. In that case, David says, he has no choice but to ask her to leave the vineyard. Everyone gapes. Marta asks him not to say that. David begs her to think about it. Luciana is very angry. David says Luci didn't see. Luciana asks if her mother was supposed to take this lying down. David says he won't allow any violence in front of his children. It's just not proper.
Marta admits that she did wrong, but she will not bow down (agachar) before that woman this time. She's done it all her life and she won't lower her dignity for a woman who doesn't deserve it.
David AGAIN asks her not to leave and says "that's why I'm giving you this option." Though it seems like it's more of an ultimatum, and he's confused that it's not going the way he hoped. Marta says that with pain in her heart, she'd prefer to leave.
Luci says to David, "I don't know what they've been saying to you, but every day you disappoint me more." David tells Luci to tell her mother to think it over. With a cool head, maybe she'll make the right choice.
Now it's Fernanda's turn to comfort Bobby. When he says that he saw Marta beating Grandma, Fer thinks his eyes must have been playing tricks on him. He tells her the whole story, as he understands it, and asks why Marta's gotten so mean all of a sudden? They thought the vacation was supposed to make Marta feel better, but it seems to be doing the opposite.
Fer conjectures that Luciana might have "told her something" or maybe they spent too much time together and Marta's getting to be like Luciana. Bobby objects; Luci is good. Fernanda says Bobby doesn't know how bad she is. She's always got a problem with someone. Bobby disagrees. Fer will get the story from Tano.
Disgrace reports to her mother that Bobby is on their side. Lil is still mumbling about how Marta robbed her of everything: the love of Fernando, the love of her grandchildren, the love of Luis (who?? that's what the captions say - maybe she said Lisa?), the love of Brian... and it's her fault that Brian died; why doesn't someone kill Marta? David had better do something about this, Lil declares. She's not sure what she'll do the next time she sees her. She literally wants to kill Marta.
Startled, Grace tells her mother not to say that. Someone might hear her. Bobby is a very nervous child. "What will I do without Brian?" Lilian wails. Grace does her pragmatic best to console her, but Lil says the pain and hate she's feeling are too much. "You don't understand," she says in a textbook example of dramatic irony. Grace just says they can't let Dave see Lil like this. Lil wants Marta out of here forever. Grace had better make sure that David makes it so, or else LIL will be the one to leave. And Grace will go with her, or be bereft of Lilian's love!
Taken aback by her mother's intensity, Grace tells her to relax and breathe while Grace goes for an update. Then she dashes out of that room as if she's running for her life.
The employees try to console Marta. Leon doesn't want her to leave, but Marta says it's her only option. She knows David is doing this for his faaaamily, so maybe she should apologize to Lilian after all. Luci and Leon are opposed to this, but they and Ramon agree to support her in whatever she decides. Luci says Marta doesn't have to stay here, and tomorrow they can look for somewhere else to live.
Luci leaves, and Tano and Carito beg Marta not to leave. Ramon says that if her heart tells her she can't, then that's what's right. Ramon says that if she stays, they'll do all her chores for her. But Marta is leaning towards leaving. She'd rather die than ask that woman's pardon. She deserved every slap.
Grace is admiring her engagement ring when David comes home. He tells her Marta's side of the story, and that he said Marta would have to apologize to Lil, but she wouldn't, so she's gonna have to leave. (Grace stands with her back to him and smiles as he says this - and then turns to him with a perfect expression of dismay.) David doesn't understand Marta's attitude. Grace drops some hints about uppity employees setting a bad example. She promises to take good care of the kids. They'll be resentful about losing their nana, but she will cheer them up.
Luci goes back to viñedo de Santa Barbara and tells Miguel the whole story. He wants Marta to join them there. He can give her a job and a place to live. Luci says no, but Miguel says he'll talk to Adolfo. Luci smiles.
Fer finds Tano in the distillery and asks for the skinny. She starts getting angry when she sees that Tano is sympathetic towards Marta. He agrees with Fer that it's not okay that Marta hit Lil, but Fer needs to know what happened. Fer looks skeptical.
Tano tells the story in between scenes, and now Fernanda is more sympathetic to Marta. However, Bobby saw with his own eyes how his beloved Marta was waling on Grandma, and it really scared him. She wonders why does everything have to be so complicated now, when at last they were all happy? Tano reminds Fer that Marta has always cared for her, and Fer shouldn't be so hard on her. Now Fernanda doesn't know what to think.
Marta sits on the stairs and talks to her photo of Marcos. She tells him it was all Lilian's fault. Now she has to be away from the kids, this place that he loved so much and where his ashes are. She doesn't want to leave. "Tell me what to do!"
Night. The employees are back in the kitchen with their jackets on. Leon offers Marta the money that Luci gave him to start his food truck business. She refuses it. The other employees disperse, leaving only Marta and Ramon. Ramon offers his support as well as rent money if she needs it. She says the last thing she told Brian was that Ramon is a great man. Ramon is grateful that because Brian saved her, Ramon can be at her side. He would give his life for her, too. He will love her FOREVER.
Lilian is still crying in her room. Her nose is red. She asks Brian, why didn't you prefer me? Why didn't you love me? I was going to forgive you, we were going to be okay. Oh God, why? I love you, Brian.
Fernanda demands an explanation from Graciela. She understands that her grandmother is distraught about the sheriff. ("They had a very special relationship," Grace says truthfully.) Fer says that Tano said that Marta was upset too. Grace says of course, for the lack of respect that she showed to Lil. But Fernanda says Marta isn't like that. Grace says David is taking care of it and even though Marta cared for Fer when she was little, he can't allow this in his house. Fernanda agrees.
Adolfo returns to the MPR after a day of client-wooing. Miguel tells him about the death of the sheriff and the trouble with Marta. Mig gets quite agitated as he talks about what a jerk David is. They were always loyal to David, but now he's acting this way...
Late night. Perla calls Carito and leaves a message. (That did not sound like the voicemail lady's voice!) Perla scolds her friend "for doing this to me" when Perla always treated Carito like a sister. Juan overhears and tells Perla they have no use for someone who betrays them. Perla can't believe Carito would do that.
Morning. In the distillery, as a representative of the employees, Ramon tells David that they don't agree with what he's doing to Marta. Individually, each employee tells David how much Marta means to them. Leon reminds David that she's dedicated her life to David's family. "That's why I gave her the option," says David.
Ramon says Marta won't be apologizing to Lilian. David says this is a family matter and nothing to do with vineyard business. But Ramon says that if Marta goes, we're ALL going.
Lil is still in bed. She mutters stubbornly to Graciela, but does not open her eyes. Grace says that Lil always taught her to be strong. "I have some good news to cheer you up," Grace says. She explains that David told Marta to come and apologize to Lil. This does rouse Lil enough to lift her head and angrily retort that if Marta comes near, she'll kill her. Grace brushes this off and says Marta is being proud and won't do it... so David told her to leave the vineyard.
Lilian sits up in bed, wide awake now. "That's the least she deserves!"
Bobby is very upset about what he just witnessed. Lilian says that Marta is a savage and was screaming at her like a crazy person. Marta yells at her not to lie. She demands that Lil tell the truth. (Marta, if YOU would tell the truth once in a while, it would be better for everyone. Like that time she overheard Lilian in the coffee shop.) David sends Marta to the employee house.
Alone with David (and Bobby), a trembling Lilian repeats that Marta came in angry and crazy. Then she announces that the sheriff was killed, and starts to cry. Although her grief is real, it also appears as though she is putting on a little show for David and Bobby as she mentions again that Marta came in and attacked her. Bobby tries to comfort her. David pulls Bobby away and tells him to watch TV (which is probably being pre-empted with coverage of the sheriff's murder). David says to Lil in English, "I'll be right back."
Perla and Juan have calmed down somewhat. Perla says the police will be looking for them, and she doesn't want to go to jail. Juan thinks Carito will be too afraid to talk. He's also sure that there's no evidence linking them to Gut's death, and whatever Carito told the Sheriff won't matter now. (He is making a lot of assumptions.) If they leave town now, it'll look suspicious, so Juan thinks they should just be cool and go on as usual.
Juan says he never intended for Carito to be harmed. Those guys were just supposed to bring her here if she went to the sheriff. It was all just an accident. Perla looks like she's thinking really hard about it.
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| Quiet... I'm thinking... I'm very smart |
Bobby is still upset about the fighting fieras. David wants to know exactly what Bobby saw. Bobby was watching TV and heard yelling. He came out to see, and Marta was pushing Grandma around. They were yelling ugly things and crying. David asks Bobby to confirm that they were hitting one another. Bobby says that Marta was hitting Lilian.
David wants to take care of it, but Bobby asks him to stay a little longer. David pulls him into a hug.
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| This is what a hug looks like, Luciana! |
Grace responds with all the empathy she can summon - that is, none. She doesn't understand why Marta was even here - she was supposed to be away on vacation. Lilian vows to destroy Marta. She wants Marta out of here, never to come near this house again. Grace's facial expression reflects mild bemusement, as if she just noticed a ketchup stain on her blouse and didn't remember eating anything with ketchup.
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| My mom is such a whiner |
Carito doesn't want to say anything to put Marta in danger. Marta asks that when she's ready, to please go to the police and tell them everything - she owes it to Brian for saving her life. Tell them her secret so that Brian's death won't have been in vain.
Grace brings her mother some pills and water, but Lil doesn't want any. "The man I loved just died." Grace sighs impatiently. Then David comes in, and Grace hurriedly grabs her mother, hugs her and says how worried she is to see her mother this way. David wants to hear Lilian's side of the story.
Lil says she was still in shock over Brian's death when Marta came in all crazy, hurling insults at her when she was in so much pain. David asks, why was Marta yelling at you? Lil says that Marta said Gut died in her arms and gave his life for Marta because he loved her, and he never loved Lilian. Grace acts very wounded and bewildered. Lil continues that Marta said she hated Lil because it was Lil's fault that Brian had deported Marta's husband and daughter.
"But that's absurd," Lil adds. David doesn't think so, though. He doubts that Marta would have said that if she didn't have a reason to. Grace's head whips around (not quite 180°) to face David, and she makes a sound that can best be expressed as "?!?".
Lilian admits that back in those days, Brian was an immigration officer, and she advised him to do something to get the respect of his superiors. That's all. Gracie adds that he was just doing his job. Lil says that Marta took it personally because of all the problems they've had between them.
David says he'll talk to Marta, but he tells Lil he doesn't want this to happen again in his house, and especially not in front of Bobby. Lil gets angry and accuses him of being on Marta's side. She walks off. Grace gives David a look of disgust and waves her hand disapprovingly at him.
Well, maybe Gracie's not as angry with David as I thought, because now she just seems to be worrying aloud about her mother. She pretends to be mystified by Marta's sudden behavior after being so nice for so many years. She says it's the second time she's acted this way. David agrees that it's strange and worrisome. Grace suggests that Marta might be "going through something" that they don't know about. She urges him to speak to Marta because she's worried about Marta... and the kids. Bobby was so frightened.
David agrees, but believes that Marta will have an explanation. Grace says okay, just take care of it so it doesn't get worse. She doesn't like the way Marta spoke to her mother. But she's sure David will do the right thing - because he always puts the faaaaamily first.
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| Gaze into my eyes and feel the power of the Tassel Earrings of Doom! |
Carito has just made Marta a cup of tea. Marta still hasn't washed her face yet. Ramon, Tano, and Leon come home. Marta rushes into Ramon's arms, and I am curious how she's going to spin this. How does one tell one's boyfriend that she's sad because her other boyfriend just died in her arms? Then she lets Leon hold her. She tells them that some men accosted them on the street, Brian defended Marta and Carito, and the men killed Brian. "Brian gave his life for me!" (Ramon must be wondering how much longer he's going to have to hear about this guy.)
Leon calls Luciana and tells her she's needed at "home." He tells her what happened. Luci tells Miguel. He wants to go with her, but she says no.
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| Yes, I can totally hear you! The wind is not a problem at all. My phone is awesome. |
Marta tells Luci and Leon that Lilian is the one who had Luci and Marcos deported. Supposedly he had never had the chance to tell Marta before. Luci wants to settle Lil's hash right now, but Marta doesn't want her to make things worse. Luci thinks Marta should at least tell David. Leon agrees, but Marta believes that David would only take Lilian's side since he's marrying her daughter. (I notice that when Luci hugs her mother, she doesn't make a fist.)
Luci doesn't think the one thing has anything to do with the other, but Marta says that Bobby saw the fight and he was upset. (Just admit it, Marta: YOU SCREWED IT UP.)
Graciela sits down with Bobby, who is still disconcerted. Grace says she's very worried about Marta, but Bobby doesn't have to worry, because nothing ugly like that will happen in this house again (FAMOUS LAST WORDS). She swears to it; and friends, if her word isn't good, then what hope is left in the world? She pulls him to her bosom and ominously adds that it's very sad that Bobby's nana is changing so much and behaving this way, but Gracie will be there for him. She smirks over the boy's head.
David arrives at the employee kitchen. "My mother has something very important to tell you," Luci announces. (If this wine thing doesn't work out for her, she could become a TV show host.) Marta tells David about Gut's statement that Lilian is the one who told Gut to deport the family. "For that reason, I hope that you understand why I quarreled like that with her." David said that wasn't the way to go about it, and especially not in front of Bobby, who was very anguished to see it. He insists that Marta apologize to Lilian.
Leon shakes his head in disbelief. Luci protests. Leon says that David should talk to Lilian. David said he already got her version of things. Marta says she's quite sure that he got Lil's "version." David is more focused on the harm to Bobby, which makes me think that Marta should apologize to Bobby, not Lil, but nobody asked me. Marta refuses to apologize to Lil. David tells her not to be prideful; it sets a bad example for his employees. "Ah, so LILIAN is a good example?" Luci inquires sarcastically.
David tells Marta to think about it, but Marta says there's nothing to think about. She won't do it. In that case, David says, he has no choice but to ask her to leave the vineyard. Everyone gapes. Marta asks him not to say that. David begs her to think about it. Luciana is very angry. David says Luci didn't see. Luciana asks if her mother was supposed to take this lying down. David says he won't allow any violence in front of his children. It's just not proper.
Marta admits that she did wrong, but she will not bow down (agachar) before that woman this time. She's done it all her life and she won't lower her dignity for a woman who doesn't deserve it.
David AGAIN asks her not to leave and says "that's why I'm giving you this option." Though it seems like it's more of an ultimatum, and he's confused that it's not going the way he hoped. Marta says that with pain in her heart, she'd prefer to leave.
Luci says to David, "I don't know what they've been saying to you, but every day you disappoint me more." David tells Luci to tell her mother to think it over. With a cool head, maybe she'll make the right choice.
Now it's Fernanda's turn to comfort Bobby. When he says that he saw Marta beating Grandma, Fer thinks his eyes must have been playing tricks on him. He tells her the whole story, as he understands it, and asks why Marta's gotten so mean all of a sudden? They thought the vacation was supposed to make Marta feel better, but it seems to be doing the opposite.
Fer conjectures that Luciana might have "told her something" or maybe they spent too much time together and Marta's getting to be like Luciana. Bobby objects; Luci is good. Fernanda says Bobby doesn't know how bad she is. She's always got a problem with someone. Bobby disagrees. Fer will get the story from Tano.
Disgrace reports to her mother that Bobby is on their side. Lil is still mumbling about how Marta robbed her of everything: the love of Fernando, the love of her grandchildren, the love of Luis (who?? that's what the captions say - maybe she said Lisa?), the love of Brian... and it's her fault that Brian died; why doesn't someone kill Marta? David had better do something about this, Lil declares. She's not sure what she'll do the next time she sees her. She literally wants to kill Marta.
Startled, Grace tells her mother not to say that. Someone might hear her. Bobby is a very nervous child. "What will I do without Brian?" Lilian wails. Grace does her pragmatic best to console her, but Lil says the pain and hate she's feeling are too much. "You don't understand," she says in a textbook example of dramatic irony. Grace just says they can't let Dave see Lil like this. Lil wants Marta out of here forever. Grace had better make sure that David makes it so, or else LIL will be the one to leave. And Grace will go with her, or be bereft of Lilian's love!
Taken aback by her mother's intensity, Grace tells her to relax and breathe while Grace goes for an update. Then she dashes out of that room as if she's running for her life.
The employees try to console Marta. Leon doesn't want her to leave, but Marta says it's her only option. She knows David is doing this for his faaaamily, so maybe she should apologize to Lilian after all. Luci and Leon are opposed to this, but they and Ramon agree to support her in whatever she decides. Luci says Marta doesn't have to stay here, and tomorrow they can look for somewhere else to live.
Luci leaves, and Tano and Carito beg Marta not to leave. Ramon says that if her heart tells her she can't, then that's what's right. Ramon says that if she stays, they'll do all her chores for her. But Marta is leaning towards leaving. She'd rather die than ask that woman's pardon. She deserved every slap.
Grace is admiring her engagement ring when David comes home. He tells her Marta's side of the story, and that he said Marta would have to apologize to Lil, but she wouldn't, so she's gonna have to leave. (Grace stands with her back to him and smiles as he says this - and then turns to him with a perfect expression of dismay.) David doesn't understand Marta's attitude. Grace drops some hints about uppity employees setting a bad example. She promises to take good care of the kids. They'll be resentful about losing their nana, but she will cheer them up.
Luci goes back to viñedo de Santa Barbara and tells Miguel the whole story. He wants Marta to join them there. He can give her a job and a place to live. Luci says no, but Miguel says he'll talk to Adolfo. Luci smiles.
Fer finds Tano in the distillery and asks for the skinny. She starts getting angry when she sees that Tano is sympathetic towards Marta. He agrees with Fer that it's not okay that Marta hit Lil, but Fer needs to know what happened. Fer looks skeptical.
Tano tells the story in between scenes, and now Fernanda is more sympathetic to Marta. However, Bobby saw with his own eyes how his beloved Marta was waling on Grandma, and it really scared him. She wonders why does everything have to be so complicated now, when at last they were all happy? Tano reminds Fer that Marta has always cared for her, and Fer shouldn't be so hard on her. Now Fernanda doesn't know what to think.
Marta sits on the stairs and talks to her photo of Marcos. She tells him it was all Lilian's fault. Now she has to be away from the kids, this place that he loved so much and where his ashes are. She doesn't want to leave. "Tell me what to do!"
Night. The employees are back in the kitchen with their jackets on. Leon offers Marta the money that Luci gave him to start his food truck business. She refuses it. The other employees disperse, leaving only Marta and Ramon. Ramon offers his support as well as rent money if she needs it. She says the last thing she told Brian was that Ramon is a great man. Ramon is grateful that because Brian saved her, Ramon can be at her side. He would give his life for her, too. He will love her FOREVER.
Lilian is still crying in her room. Her nose is red. She asks Brian, why didn't you prefer me? Why didn't you love me? I was going to forgive you, we were going to be okay. Oh God, why? I love you, Brian.
Fernanda demands an explanation from Graciela. She understands that her grandmother is distraught about the sheriff. ("They had a very special relationship," Grace says truthfully.) Fer says that Tano said that Marta was upset too. Grace says of course, for the lack of respect that she showed to Lil. But Fernanda says Marta isn't like that. Grace says David is taking care of it and even though Marta cared for Fer when she was little, he can't allow this in his house. Fernanda agrees.
Adolfo returns to the MPR after a day of client-wooing. Miguel tells him about the death of the sheriff and the trouble with Marta. Mig gets quite agitated as he talks about what a jerk David is. They were always loyal to David, but now he's acting this way...
Late night. Perla calls Carito and leaves a message. (That did not sound like the voicemail lady's voice!) Perla scolds her friend "for doing this to me" when Perla always treated Carito like a sister. Juan overhears and tells Perla they have no use for someone who betrays them. Perla can't believe Carito would do that.
Morning. In the distillery, as a representative of the employees, Ramon tells David that they don't agree with what he's doing to Marta. Individually, each employee tells David how much Marta means to them. Leon reminds David that she's dedicated her life to David's family. "That's why I gave her the option," says David.
Ramon says Marta won't be apologizing to Lilian. David says this is a family matter and nothing to do with vineyard business. But Ramon says that if Marta goes, we're ALL going.
Lil is still in bed. She mutters stubbornly to Graciela, but does not open her eyes. Grace says that Lil always taught her to be strong. "I have some good news to cheer you up," Grace says. She explains that David told Marta to come and apologize to Lil. This does rouse Lil enough to lift her head and angrily retort that if Marta comes near, she'll kill her. Grace brushes this off and says Marta is being proud and won't do it... so David told her to leave the vineyard.
Lilian sits up in bed, wide awake now. "That's the least she deserves!"
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Well, that was painful, watching David issue an ultimatum that can't possibly work out in his favor no matter what happens. He thinks Marta can't bear to be away from his children, but it did not occur to him that she's already away from them because he made her take a "vacation." Of course, Lilian had a hand in that too and Marta never told David about that when she had the chance.
Did I say it was painful? Well, stupidity causes me pain. But I can't say I'm not amused by the pickle he's in. Now he's getting an ultimatum thrown at him. If he lets Marta go, he will need to hire a lot of people in a hurry. (I hear Juan knows some people.)
Of course, it would kind of suck for Marta if David lets her stay, because Lil might murder her... if she can drag her sorry ass out of bed.
Did I say it was painful? Well, stupidity causes me pain. But I can't say I'm not amused by the pickle he's in. Now he's getting an ultimatum thrown at him. If he lets Marta go, he will need to hire a lot of people in a hurry. (I hear Juan knows some people.)
Of course, it would kind of suck for Marta if David lets her stay, because Lil might murder her... if she can drag her sorry ass out of bed.
Oh and when Grace said that was the second time Marta's acted this way, what was she talking about? Why didn't David question that? Did I miss an episode? Or was she referring to the time when Marta got defensive about being told to take a vacation? I don't think that was comparable to this.
Julie I understood it to be when they were going at each other on the balcony and Luciana overheard Marta's aggressive taunting about Fernando.
You made much better sense of what I saw last night than I did and thank you. You smart and clever.
"as if she just noticed a ketchup stain on her blouse and didn't remember eating anything with ketchup"
"Marta, if YOU would tell the truth once in a while, it would be better for everyone"
I thought the last thing Marta told Brian is she loved him not that Ramon was a good man.
Pathetic or admirable, I cannot decide, but Ramon really believes Marta's poop don't stink.
You made much better sense of what I saw last night than I did and thank you. You smart and clever.
"as if she just noticed a ketchup stain on her blouse and didn't remember eating anything with ketchup"
"Marta, if YOU would tell the truth once in a while, it would be better for everyone"
I thought the last thing Marta told Brian is she loved him not that Ramon was a good man.
Pathetic or admirable, I cannot decide, but Ramon really believes Marta's poop don't stink.
Thank You abazillion times over for recapping thiis. You have more constitution than me. Clever too.
Perla and NoJuan in what I must now assume passes for foreplay for them...spare me..!
Carito trying to fit in with at Incompetent Wines by being a complete DUMBASS.
So DudVid does for Martrya what she will not do for herself. Bye Bye.......
And the remainder of his working employees are ready to leave too.
Incompetent Winemakers Local #1234 AFL CIO
Without any key employees, will Lillian and DisGraceful, Fer and David have to maybe hit a lick at a snake? Heavens forbid ! I would not count on anything getting done. Right...
I guess DisGrace could work smooshing grapes ….IF THEY USE R O C K S !
Actually Fer was trying to help Tano and David in one calamity, can't remember which one.
What a wasted hour. I could have instead been scratching my ASS or practicing Yodeling.
Perla and NoJuan in what I must now assume passes for foreplay for them...spare me..!
Carito trying to fit in with at Incompetent Wines by being a complete DUMBASS.
So DudVid does for Martrya what she will not do for herself. Bye Bye.......
And the remainder of his working employees are ready to leave too.
Incompetent Winemakers Local #1234 AFL CIO
Without any key employees, will Lillian and DisGraceful, Fer and David have to maybe hit a lick at a snake? Heavens forbid ! I would not count on anything getting done. Right...
I guess DisGrace could work smooshing grapes ….IF THEY USE R O C K S !
Actually Fer was trying to help Tano and David in one calamity, can't remember which one.
What a wasted hour. I could have instead been scratching my ASS or practicing Yodeling.
Gracias, Julie. This was truly painful and I think David lost at least another 20 IQ points. I hope Luciana isn't planning to have children with him if they get together in the end.
In fact, this ultimatum should finish them once and for all.
Marta did go about ths the wrong way. However, she has a legitimate grievance. Carito had to have heard Brian's dying words about this so she should be a witness.
I stand on my Invasion of the Body Snatchers subplot because only a victim of that could possibly not sympathize with someone whose husband and daughter were taken away from her that way. Juan was an accomplice in this by not filing the necessary documents when he was supposed to.
There are so many inconsistencies in Lillian that I have to marvel at Azela Robinson not turning on the writers in a fury, but the one consistency is her lack of understanding of human free will, particularly as regards one of the biggest novela cliche lines of dialogue: El corazon no se manda:
Fernando wasn't "stolen" against his will. I doubt that the young Marta would have initiated the relationship with him. Brian knew the man well enough to tell both women that Fernando had always been a dog on the prowl and more, that Fernando had married Lillian specifically to get his green card. He was sick of the two women's mutual hatred and he didn't even have to live with it (though he would have heard Lillian bitch and moan about it more than David ever did).
As to Brian himself, Marta might have been exactly what he needed when he met her. A Mexican woman who didn't fit the stereotype, Marta is fair-skinned and blonde with blue eyes like a gringa. However, she is Mexican and unashamed of it. She has a heart, which Lillian almost doesn't. He was attracted to her right away because he saw that difference. Lillian could not make Brian love her just as DisGrace can't make David love her. Neither Fernando nor Brian were Ken dolls to be fought over by two little girls in a sandbox but grown men with free will and hearts that could not be commanded, even by themselves.
BTW, the subtitle was wrong; it was Lisa whom Lillian mentioned in the episode. I'm glad I didn't get subtitles on the TV that died on me because I'm reading all over this blog how bad they can be.
More later. I have to do my Good, Bad, and Ugly about MdN.
In fact, this ultimatum should finish them once and for all.
Marta did go about ths the wrong way. However, she has a legitimate grievance. Carito had to have heard Brian's dying words about this so she should be a witness.
I stand on my Invasion of the Body Snatchers subplot because only a victim of that could possibly not sympathize with someone whose husband and daughter were taken away from her that way. Juan was an accomplice in this by not filing the necessary documents when he was supposed to.
There are so many inconsistencies in Lillian that I have to marvel at Azela Robinson not turning on the writers in a fury, but the one consistency is her lack of understanding of human free will, particularly as regards one of the biggest novela cliche lines of dialogue: El corazon no se manda:
Fernando wasn't "stolen" against his will. I doubt that the young Marta would have initiated the relationship with him. Brian knew the man well enough to tell both women that Fernando had always been a dog on the prowl and more, that Fernando had married Lillian specifically to get his green card. He was sick of the two women's mutual hatred and he didn't even have to live with it (though he would have heard Lillian bitch and moan about it more than David ever did).
As to Brian himself, Marta might have been exactly what he needed when he met her. A Mexican woman who didn't fit the stereotype, Marta is fair-skinned and blonde with blue eyes like a gringa. However, she is Mexican and unashamed of it. She has a heart, which Lillian almost doesn't. He was attracted to her right away because he saw that difference. Lillian could not make Brian love her just as DisGrace can't make David love her. Neither Fernando nor Brian were Ken dolls to be fought over by two little girls in a sandbox but grown men with free will and hearts that could not be commanded, even by themselves.
BTW, the subtitle was wrong; it was Lisa whom Lillian mentioned in the episode. I'm glad I didn't get subtitles on the TV that died on me because I'm reading all over this blog how bad they can be.
More later. I have to do my Good, Bad, and Ugly about MdN.
I am convinced that David crawled out from under THAT ROCK when DisGrace picked it up to Rock Lisa.
He has NO people skills, NO managerial gifts, and he appears to not use his eyes, ears, and thinking organ.
I don't know where "Dumber than a box of rocks" came from, but it comes to mind every time David is on screen.
Now that the people who run the Vineyard where he lives have given him a matching ultimatum, he will need to think.
THIS Could Be Tough for you DudVid, good fricking Luck.
He has NO people skills, NO managerial gifts, and he appears to not use his eyes, ears, and thinking organ.
I don't know where "Dumber than a box of rocks" came from, but it comes to mind every time David is on screen.
Now that the people who run the Vineyard where he lives have given him a matching ultimatum, he will need to think.
THIS Could Be Tough for you DudVid, good fricking Luck.
Nursing picture:
My payment for today's excellent recap, cuteness always is well received here.
Look at the front and back hands.
My payment for today's excellent recap, cuteness always is well received here.
Look at the front and back hands.
David is "Giving You This Option." like he is "Giving Himself a Chance" with DisGhost (OfYourComingDoom)..
No wonder Mr. Giving knows nothing about running a vineyard, he is the guy who always says,
"But wait, There's more, just pay separate shipping and....."
Oooommmmmmm...OOooommmm......it's not the computer's fault, it's not the computers fault, put down the hammer....
No wonder Mr. Giving knows nothing about running a vineyard, he is the guy who always says,
"But wait, There's more, just pay separate shipping and....."
Oooommmmmmm...OOooommmm......it's not the computer's fault, it's not the computers fault, put down the hammer....
Closing remarks for MdN finished and posted. Not much to write there, unlike this one when the time comes.
Getting back to general observations, if the writers paid off on the two prophetic lines of dialogue in this episode we can expect:
-- Somebody to overhear something incriminating
-- DisGrace to either end up dead or in prison
Getting back to general observations, if the writers paid off on the two prophetic lines of dialogue in this episode we can expect:
-- Somebody to overhear something incriminating
-- DisGrace to either end up dead or in prison
I'm fascinated with Graciela and want so bad for her to win. She's perfect for David, perfect. The whole family are entitled snowflakes and aside losing Lisa, wouldn't know difficult if it bit them on the butt. Better for the loyal staff to move on and take drama with them so the snowflakes can live in their idyllic world.
I think I'm starting to come around to UA's Invasion of the Body Snatchers theory, because otherwise THE STUPID! IT BURRRRRNS!!!
David's overreaction--yes, even for him--to Bobby's freakout over the abuela/nana catfight, even in the face of Marta admitting the reason for it, just defies logic. Julie, you're absolutely right--why the hell isn't she being asked to apologize to the indestructible moppet directly, or if absolutely necessary him and Lilian at the same time, rather than just to Lilian? Of course it goes back to David's ongoing manipulation at the hands of his in-laws, but we're still so far into that rabbit hole and so late in the show that I seriously have to wonder--AGAIN: did the writers deliberately want to make David so unlikable? And if so, why? Because it's not forking helping anybody except Graciela look good. At this point he kind of deserves to have Ramon, Leon, Tano and Susan bail on him...and damn you to hell, show, for doing that.
I've only ever seen one other novela protagonist this overtly hamstrung: Piedad from Alguien te mira, and she ended up marrying a serial killer.
By the same loose token, though--I think we're all in agreement that Marta lied to Ramon's face about the last thing she said to Brian. Comparatively it's a lesser sin, but coming after all her other crap...never mind, I'm too annoyed at the Vestmaster General to bitch about Marta at this point.
Flip side, since Juan and Carito/Marta basically established it: to this point, Carito still hasn't told anyone besides Brian about Traffickers Inc. Marta telling Carito to tell the police whatever she knew so that Brian's death wouldn't be in vain was the cherry on top of this sundae of stupid self-preservation, even if it was utterly eclipsed by THE STUPID...sorry, for some reason my fingers keep wanting to capitalize THE STUPID...
At least Azela Robinson got to run the table angst-wise, which weirdly might have been more important for showing Graciela's general lack of sympathy for her. Another sign that Lilian's got one hell of a karma backlash coming...perhaps the only thing that makes any forking sense right now.
David's overreaction--yes, even for him--to Bobby's freakout over the abuela/nana catfight, even in the face of Marta admitting the reason for it, just defies logic. Julie, you're absolutely right--why the hell isn't she being asked to apologize to the indestructible moppet directly, or if absolutely necessary him and Lilian at the same time, rather than just to Lilian? Of course it goes back to David's ongoing manipulation at the hands of his in-laws, but we're still so far into that rabbit hole and so late in the show that I seriously have to wonder--AGAIN: did the writers deliberately want to make David so unlikable? And if so, why? Because it's not forking helping anybody except Graciela look good. At this point he kind of deserves to have Ramon, Leon, Tano and Susan bail on him...and damn you to hell, show, for doing that.
I've only ever seen one other novela protagonist this overtly hamstrung: Piedad from Alguien te mira, and she ended up marrying a serial killer.
By the same loose token, though--I think we're all in agreement that Marta lied to Ramon's face about the last thing she said to Brian. Comparatively it's a lesser sin, but coming after all her other crap...never mind, I'm too annoyed at the Vestmaster General to bitch about Marta at this point.
Flip side, since Juan and Carito/Marta basically established it: to this point, Carito still hasn't told anyone besides Brian about Traffickers Inc. Marta telling Carito to tell the police whatever she knew so that Brian's death wouldn't be in vain was the cherry on top of this sundae of stupid self-preservation, even if it was utterly eclipsed by THE STUPID...sorry, for some reason my fingers keep wanting to capitalize THE STUPID...
At least Azela Robinson got to run the table angst-wise, which weirdly might have been more important for showing Graciela's general lack of sympathy for her. Another sign that Lilian's got one hell of a karma backlash coming...perhaps the only thing that makes any forking sense right now.
Julie, thank you so very much! This is exquisite, as usual! Saturdays are difficult for me to comment compared to week days when I can steal a few minutes from work. I say this to let you know that I'd love to quote your witty and funny observations but often don't have the time. Your wonderful recaps and screen caps are much enjoyed and appreciated! Same for enjoying my Patio Pals comments.
Just want to say I'm NOt on Marta's side in this. I'm so tired of her, EVERYTHING is about her. If Brian had gone alone with Carito, he would've given his life to save HER, as well. I'm not arguing that Brian didn't love her. He did, he said so with his last breath even though he did a lousy job of showing it. Other than the Ramon arrest and detention, Brian was an honorable officer of the law and he gave his life defending both Carito and Martyra.
I wish Lil would've gotten some blows in on Marta and I said yesterday before she did that one of the bullets should've hit Marta. She's a whore and a hypocrite. Talking to Marcos' picture asking "what should I do?" You should have stood by him when he was alive but she didn't because she didn't love him. She loved Fernando's grandchildren more. Lil's being a bitch or Fernando being a dog are inconsequential, Marta made vows to Marcos and she willingly slept with the Patron while her husband was working his ass off all day to support her and their (?) two small children. That's as low as you can get and he died never knowing what a whore he was married to! The hoe was even willing to leave faithful, hard-working Marcos for Fernando but Lil is right, she was ONLY a bed-toy and stupid slut didn't know it.
Then, Marta, BY HER OWN ADMISSION, started flirting with and trying to attract and actually going out with Brian to torque Lilian! She didn't love Brian when they slept together, he loved her, she was only turned on knowing she was screwing someone Lilian loved. I don't blame Lil for wanting the slut out of her life! And yes, her ass needs to leave the vineyard. Does it play into Grace and Lil's plans? Yes, but TOUGH TITTY! She deserves it!
Despite the rant, I really think this "romance" between Lil, Bran, Fernando and Marta is the product of sloppy writing and a bargain basement budget. Think of how much it would've cost to develop the Fernando/Marta backstory or to have Fernando and Brian to have been in love with a different woman from Sonoma or some such, instead of the housekeeper/Nanny. They would've needed another actress, other supporting characters, other settings and **gasp** a car! The whole storyline made no sense cause this is a cheap production.
Ok. I write this tome after saying I don't have time on weekends! Thank you so much, Julie! I hope to hang out later!
Just want to say I'm NOt on Marta's side in this. I'm so tired of her, EVERYTHING is about her. If Brian had gone alone with Carito, he would've given his life to save HER, as well. I'm not arguing that Brian didn't love her. He did, he said so with his last breath even though he did a lousy job of showing it. Other than the Ramon arrest and detention, Brian was an honorable officer of the law and he gave his life defending both Carito and Martyra.
I wish Lil would've gotten some blows in on Marta and I said yesterday before she did that one of the bullets should've hit Marta. She's a whore and a hypocrite. Talking to Marcos' picture asking "what should I do?" You should have stood by him when he was alive but she didn't because she didn't love him. She loved Fernando's grandchildren more. Lil's being a bitch or Fernando being a dog are inconsequential, Marta made vows to Marcos and she willingly slept with the Patron while her husband was working his ass off all day to support her and their (?) two small children. That's as low as you can get and he died never knowing what a whore he was married to! The hoe was even willing to leave faithful, hard-working Marcos for Fernando but Lil is right, she was ONLY a bed-toy and stupid slut didn't know it.
Then, Marta, BY HER OWN ADMISSION, started flirting with and trying to attract and actually going out with Brian to torque Lilian! She didn't love Brian when they slept together, he loved her, she was only turned on knowing she was screwing someone Lilian loved. I don't blame Lil for wanting the slut out of her life! And yes, her ass needs to leave the vineyard. Does it play into Grace and Lil's plans? Yes, but TOUGH TITTY! She deserves it!
Despite the rant, I really think this "romance" between Lil, Bran, Fernando and Marta is the product of sloppy writing and a bargain basement budget. Think of how much it would've cost to develop the Fernando/Marta backstory or to have Fernando and Brian to have been in love with a different woman from Sonoma or some such, instead of the housekeeper/Nanny. They would've needed another actress, other supporting characters, other settings and **gasp** a car! The whole storyline made no sense cause this is a cheap production.
Ok. I write this tome after saying I don't have time on weekends! Thank you so much, Julie! I hope to hang out later!
Hell yeah Lila. With you on Marta and had she a rock she would have bashed Lilian's skull Lilian should call the police.
In reading the latest few posts something occurred to me about Lillian's situation. The difference between what Lillian intended and what actually happened with the deportation was the real beginning of her punishment for any or all of her previous actions that we didn't see.
The children came to love Marta. That's natural with nannies, something Lillian didn't know about because she didn't have a nanny for her daughters (She would have had she been wealthy enough). One wonders how Lillian made it through the years of diapers and teaching her children the basic stuff. Lillian was of no help to Lisa when Fernanda and Bobby came along. She didn't play with them, didn't read stories to them, or bake cookies for them. Marta did all that grandmotherly stuff. What could anyone else reasonably expect as a result?
David's memory of that is now severely deficient. He not only drank the Kool Aid, he's drowning in it.
If Marta actually leaves the vineyard in the next episode and the others leave with her he will be in for very hard times and his current depression will get worse. DisGrace may not be able to handle that if it lasts long enough.
Lillian was paying the price all along for trying to make Marta's life hell, which was to not have the absolute love of Fernanda and Bobby. That's not a material thing one can steal, like a designer purse. Except in romantic relationships it should not be exclusive.
DisGrace outdoes her in that she is better at concealing her contempt for the kids. That can't last forever.
The children came to love Marta. That's natural with nannies, something Lillian didn't know about because she didn't have a nanny for her daughters (She would have had she been wealthy enough). One wonders how Lillian made it through the years of diapers and teaching her children the basic stuff. Lillian was of no help to Lisa when Fernanda and Bobby came along. She didn't play with them, didn't read stories to them, or bake cookies for them. Marta did all that grandmotherly stuff. What could anyone else reasonably expect as a result?
David's memory of that is now severely deficient. He not only drank the Kool Aid, he's drowning in it.
If Marta actually leaves the vineyard in the next episode and the others leave with her he will be in for very hard times and his current depression will get worse. DisGrace may not be able to handle that if it lasts long enough.
Lillian was paying the price all along for trying to make Marta's life hell, which was to not have the absolute love of Fernanda and Bobby. That's not a material thing one can steal, like a designer purse. Except in romantic relationships it should not be exclusive.
DisGrace outdoes her in that she is better at concealing her contempt for the kids. That can't last forever.
Thanks, Tofie. I forgot the balcony fight. That was pretty intense. Not violent that I recall, though.
Maybe it was Brian who told Marta that Ramon was a good man. I didn't follow their conversation very well when Brian was spitting up blood.
I don't remember Fer trying to help Tano and David in one calamity, but obviously my memory sucks. I do remember her helping David and Luci name the wine and pick the label, and that was impressive - she might not be useless someday.
I am questioning if David really is a body-snatcher victim, because when Luci was accused of stealing the earrings, didn't he believe it at first? Maybe he's always been this way and it's more noticeable now because there are more opportunities to see his poor judgment.
Azela Robinson was really amazing. Her cold fury was stunning. And then the grief-ridden near-paralysis, mumbling how much she loved Brian (she sure had a strange way of showing it). For once, she actually scared Grace.
So she did say "Lisa." It sounded like "Elisa," but maybe that was her name (like she calls Graciela "Grace").
OH cute little squirrel!
I kept hoping that either Marta or David would talk on a cell phone so I could do a screencap of them saying "Why isn't my agent taking my calls?"
I don't know why Lil didn't fight back against Marta. She seemed frozen.
Urban, your comment about only half the family getting deported was Lilian's first anvil - right on. That one blew up in Lil's face, but she never learned her lesson. Or maybe she likes being miserable, because no one was stopping her from leaving the vineyard.
So, what next? Will David let his employees walk out? Or will he let Marta staying without apologizing to that madwoman?
If he lets Marta stay, will Lil try to kill her? Or will Lil leave?
And if Lil leaves, will Grace go with her? Or will Grace laugh and say she can do without Lil's "love"? Or smash her with a rock?
OR... will Grace smash Marta with a rock?
Maybe it was Brian who told Marta that Ramon was a good man. I didn't follow their conversation very well when Brian was spitting up blood.
I don't remember Fer trying to help Tano and David in one calamity, but obviously my memory sucks. I do remember her helping David and Luci name the wine and pick the label, and that was impressive - she might not be useless someday.
I am questioning if David really is a body-snatcher victim, because when Luci was accused of stealing the earrings, didn't he believe it at first? Maybe he's always been this way and it's more noticeable now because there are more opportunities to see his poor judgment.
Azela Robinson was really amazing. Her cold fury was stunning. And then the grief-ridden near-paralysis, mumbling how much she loved Brian (she sure had a strange way of showing it). For once, she actually scared Grace.
So she did say "Lisa." It sounded like "Elisa," but maybe that was her name (like she calls Graciela "Grace").
OH cute little squirrel!
I kept hoping that either Marta or David would talk on a cell phone so I could do a screencap of them saying "Why isn't my agent taking my calls?"
I don't know why Lil didn't fight back against Marta. She seemed frozen.
Urban, your comment about only half the family getting deported was Lilian's first anvil - right on. That one blew up in Lil's face, but she never learned her lesson. Or maybe she likes being miserable, because no one was stopping her from leaving the vineyard.
So, what next? Will David let his employees walk out? Or will he let Marta staying without apologizing to that madwoman?
If he lets Marta stay, will Lil try to kill her? Or will Lil leave?
And if Lil leaves, will Grace go with her? Or will Grace laugh and say she can do without Lil's "love"? Or smash her with a rock?
OR... will Grace smash Marta with a rock?
Julie--I removed the comment in order to delete the ending of MdN. Some folks here might want to watch it and not know how it ends. In any case, here is the original part--now following yours.
I'm sorry I couldn't join in on the "Toast" Episode. I was sleeping off my recap of MdN and my best friend's husband passed away (liver cancer took him in two months).
Will watch and read the recaps later.
I finally figured out what has made Miguel so different. It's not his earnestness or decreased obsessiveness or pain over losing Erika. Maybe you all noticed while I was away, but it took me awhile. It's his HAIR. It's not all greased up. Yes, he's quite handsome as a natural-looking guy.
Hope all that chocolate syrup tasted good on Gut's lips. (It looked very red, but that may be left-over from the new intro Televisa is using. I've heard that chocolate syrup makes the best blood.) It was the longest scene of dying I've ever had to witness (except on an opera stage), but that was mostly due to Marta's wailing and moaning.
BTW--I am preparing a Post-Mortem page for Vino, so stay tuned after the Grand Final. (It will be all about Grace, I'm afraid, with a little retirement party and some toast thrown in.)
I'm sorry I couldn't join in on the "Toast" Episode. I was sleeping off my recap of MdN and my best friend's husband passed away (liver cancer took him in two months).
Will watch and read the recaps later.
I finally figured out what has made Miguel so different. It's not his earnestness or decreased obsessiveness or pain over losing Erika. Maybe you all noticed while I was away, but it took me awhile. It's his HAIR. It's not all greased up. Yes, he's quite handsome as a natural-looking guy.
Hope all that chocolate syrup tasted good on Gut's lips. (It looked very red, but that may be left-over from the new intro Televisa is using. I've heard that chocolate syrup makes the best blood.) It was the longest scene of dying I've ever had to witness (except on an opera stage), but that was mostly due to Marta's wailing and moaning.
BTW--I am preparing a Post-Mortem page for Vino, so stay tuned after the Grand Final. (It will be all about Grace, I'm afraid, with a little retirement party and some toast thrown in.)
OK, I deleted my comment and am reposting it without the Yago ending.
I'm sorry about your friend's husband, Anita.
You're right about Miguel's hair. Without the grease in his hair and the sleeveless shirts, he looks more like a man and less like a boy.
Chocolate syrup was the best blood for black-and-white movies. I don't know what they use for color. Oh wow, here is an interesting article about that. They still use chocolate sometimes, though more often they use something containing corn syrup.
I will look forward to your postmortem for VEA. "Along Came Love," my foot. "Along Came Love and It Passed Through and Kept on Going" is more like it. That was probably the original title, but they had to cut it down.
I'm sorry about your friend's husband, Anita.
You're right about Miguel's hair. Without the grease in his hair and the sleeveless shirts, he looks more like a man and less like a boy.
Chocolate syrup was the best blood for black-and-white movies. I don't know what they use for color. Oh wow, here is an interesting article about that. They still use chocolate sometimes, though more often they use something containing corn syrup.
I will look forward to your postmortem for VEA. "Along Came Love," my foot. "Along Came Love and It Passed Through and Kept on Going" is more like it. That was probably the original title, but they had to cut it down.
It was noteworthy to see DisGrace's non-response to Lillian's declaration that if Marta did not leave she would, with DisGrace. Lillian is no longer of any value to DisGrace now, and her leaving would allow DisGrace to skip a step, extricating Lil from "HER" house in the future.
Thank you, Julie, for soldiering through that endless train wreck. Did you have toast this morning for breakfast? Saturday is always bagels here since there is a bagel shop just up the street.
Well, what can I say that has not already been said. As I was stuffing the laundry into the washer I had a sudden inspiration for a "D" adjective for Dumbbunny Dave, but I edited myself.
Anita..I did notice the lack of gel in Miguel's hair which makes him even more guaypo. Maybe the writers will surprise us and have him end up with all Dave's marbles..the ones that he hasn't already lost. Oh well, I would pick Miguel because he smiles, tries to be proactive , supportive, and loving and......the hair....and those shoulders.
Dispicable is fascinating to watch..so devoid of all human emotion...like a Barbie doll that suddenly grew like Alice in Wonderland and came to life. Then, there is Dave who seems to be just this side of catatonic. He seems so immobilized , so unable to be proactive. I cannot believe this guy was ever good in math because he is not a problem solver in any way, shape, or form. Let's face it, stuff happens to everyone, and you try to take a minute to look at your situation and then you make some kind of INTELLIGENT decision that seems logical at the time . Dave is clueless and keeps sliding further down the slope.
I cannot imagine how Lilian has managed to stay in that house with all the comments she has made and the way she acts as though it is her house and she is allowing Dave and the kids to live there. I cannot stand Lilian, and I agree that Marta is not a saint in any way .
What a contrast with Marta surrounded by her children and friends as compared to Grace having no idea how or why she should try to comfort Lilian. Apple>>>>tree. " In the end the love you make is equal to the love you take." ..my favorite Beatle lyric. So true.
Here's a quote from my newspaper : " Having children makes you no more a parent than having a piano makes you a pianist." ..Michael Levine
Well, what can I say that has not already been said. As I was stuffing the laundry into the washer I had a sudden inspiration for a "D" adjective for Dumbbunny Dave, but I edited myself.
Anita..I did notice the lack of gel in Miguel's hair which makes him even more guaypo. Maybe the writers will surprise us and have him end up with all Dave's marbles..the ones that he hasn't already lost. Oh well, I would pick Miguel because he smiles, tries to be proactive , supportive, and loving and......the hair....and those shoulders.
Dispicable is fascinating to watch..so devoid of all human emotion...like a Barbie doll that suddenly grew like Alice in Wonderland and came to life. Then, there is Dave who seems to be just this side of catatonic. He seems so immobilized , so unable to be proactive. I cannot believe this guy was ever good in math because he is not a problem solver in any way, shape, or form. Let's face it, stuff happens to everyone, and you try to take a minute to look at your situation and then you make some kind of INTELLIGENT decision that seems logical at the time . Dave is clueless and keeps sliding further down the slope.
I cannot imagine how Lilian has managed to stay in that house with all the comments she has made and the way she acts as though it is her house and she is allowing Dave and the kids to live there. I cannot stand Lilian, and I agree that Marta is not a saint in any way .
What a contrast with Marta surrounded by her children and friends as compared to Grace having no idea how or why she should try to comfort Lilian. Apple>>>>tree. " In the end the love you make is equal to the love you take." ..my favorite Beatle lyric. So true.
Here's a quote from my newspaper : " Having children makes you no more a parent than having a piano makes you a pianist." ..Michael Levine
Permalink posted by 
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 12:42:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 12:42:00 PM EDT
We've seen what Lil's idea of "love" is, so threatening to withdraw it is laughable. If she leaves, she will leave alone. And then she will have to start paying for her wine! Let's see if she calls Adolfo.
No toast, Susanlynn. Pho. Well, a Chinese version of pho. Or technically I guess it would just be called soup.
David is getting the wife he deserves, the family he deserves, and the business he deserves. The sad thing is that he has no idea why. This is so depressing.
David is getting the wife he deserves, the family he deserves, and the business he deserves. The sad thing is that he has no idea why. This is so depressing.
The inLaws have very handily boxed DudVid in. He really is between a Rock and a Rock. This is where someone would call out 'Checkmate'.
Without the benefit of a brain or gonads, he is left to flop around like a fish out of water, with similar results.
It seems to be a good time to be a bad guy in Sonoma wine country. NoJuan and his concubine dodged a bullet, which the local sheriff did not.
Lil and DisGrace have maneuvered David such that everything he could do, (except marry DG) is wrong.
BTW, is La Vineyard de Incompetencia still selling wine? We have not heard much about it lately.
"Mr. Fitipaldi, good that you survived, what happened in in turn five? That fiery crash destroyed a half million dollar race car."
"Oh Thanks. I was setting the dash clock and needed both hands. Then the car went straight into the wall. But up to that I was leading."
Without the benefit of a brain or gonads, he is left to flop around like a fish out of water, with similar results.
It seems to be a good time to be a bad guy in Sonoma wine country. NoJuan and his concubine dodged a bullet, which the local sheriff did not.
Lil and DisGrace have maneuvered David such that everything he could do, (except marry DG) is wrong.
BTW, is La Vineyard de Incompetencia still selling wine? We have not heard much about it lately.
"Mr. Fitipaldi, good that you survived, what happened in in turn five? That fiery crash destroyed a half million dollar race car."
"Oh Thanks. I was setting the dash clock and needed both hands. Then the car went straight into the wall. But up to that I was leading."
Julie, that was so awesome! I think I enjoyed reading your recap much more than watching through the actual episode. Your screenshots were perfect! Some lines I really enjoyed:
"Bobby is still upset about the fighting fieras." Well I knew what a Pontiac Fiero was but wasn't so sure about a fiera. So I looked it up. ROFLOL!
"Grace's facial expression reflects mild bemusement, as if she just noticed a ketchup stain on her blouse and didn't remember eating anything with ketchup." You hit the nail right on the head there!
Everything about this thing with Lilian is so bogus. Minutes before she was talking to Sonia about taking revenge on Brian and ruining him forever. She didn't love him, like her daughter DG, she does not know love, she only wants to POSSESS what she thinks she should own and make sure that no one else gets that perceived object of affection. As I recall from the earlier episodes, Lilian wasn't really into Brian at first. He was the one pushing for a relationship, but Lilian at first was backing away like she does with Adolfo. But just as soon as Brian started noticing Marta, that was when Lilian decided she wanted Brian. She only really wanted Brian so that Marta wouldn't take him and this became an obsession.
I do believe that this was the "2nd time" this kind of thing happened. I do remember sometime back that they did get into a physical altercation.
Yes, I heard Lilian mumbling about how Marta robbed her of everyone she loved too and I clearly heard "Luis" and it didn't sound like Lisa. I wonder if Azela Robinson said "Luis" by mistake meaning Lisa, and they just never reshot the scene because no one else really noticed.
I thought it was over the top for David to give Lilian that ultimatum. He has clearly gone to the dark side where they is no thought, wisdom, or knowledge.
It's good to see Miguel as a supportive friend who truly cares, not the possessive, patriarchal, "I'm the man" type of character who imposes his will over Luciana.
"Bobby is still upset about the fighting fieras." Well I knew what a Pontiac Fiero was but wasn't so sure about a fiera. So I looked it up. ROFLOL!
"Grace's facial expression reflects mild bemusement, as if she just noticed a ketchup stain on her blouse and didn't remember eating anything with ketchup." You hit the nail right on the head there!
Everything about this thing with Lilian is so bogus. Minutes before she was talking to Sonia about taking revenge on Brian and ruining him forever. She didn't love him, like her daughter DG, she does not know love, she only wants to POSSESS what she thinks she should own and make sure that no one else gets that perceived object of affection. As I recall from the earlier episodes, Lilian wasn't really into Brian at first. He was the one pushing for a relationship, but Lilian at first was backing away like she does with Adolfo. But just as soon as Brian started noticing Marta, that was when Lilian decided she wanted Brian. She only really wanted Brian so that Marta wouldn't take him and this became an obsession.
I do believe that this was the "2nd time" this kind of thing happened. I do remember sometime back that they did get into a physical altercation.
Yes, I heard Lilian mumbling about how Marta robbed her of everyone she loved too and I clearly heard "Luis" and it didn't sound like Lisa. I wonder if Azela Robinson said "Luis" by mistake meaning Lisa, and they just never reshot the scene because no one else really noticed.
I thought it was over the top for David to give Lilian that ultimatum. He has clearly gone to the dark side where they is no thought, wisdom, or knowledge.
It's good to see Miguel as a supportive friend who truly cares, not the possessive, patriarchal, "I'm the man" type of character who imposes his will over Luciana.
Julie..my Vietnamese students are all big pho fans. I have never had it, but we had a party and they brought in a weird bologna type of lunchmeat and sticky rice. I passed on that lunch meat but ate a bit of rice.
My disillusionment (read that as... Hate,) for Dave grows, and I do not care what happens to him or the horse he rode in on. This guy deserves whiny kids, an awful, prejudiced, entitled , bossy mother in-law, and a stone cold killer wife. Adios .
Since I have nojuan to demean and boss into doing the dishes and laundry.....later.
My disillusionment (read that as... Hate,) for Dave grows, and I do not care what happens to him or the horse he rode in on. This guy deserves whiny kids, an awful, prejudiced, entitled , bossy mother in-law, and a stone cold killer wife. Adios .
Since I have nojuan to demean and boss into doing the dishes and laundry.....later.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 1:07:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 1:07:00 PM EDT
Oh another thing: Juan must not watch crime shows on TV like CSI or channels like Investigation Discovery. He wouldn't be so sure of himself that Brian's death can be traced to him if he knew that the police would probably be looking at the dead henchmens' cell phones. I'm sure they can find all kinds of communication between Juan and the henchmen INCLUDING the fact he sent them Carito's photograph. So Juan should be shaking in his boots right now. He should be glad that Perla packed their things a couple episodes ago. But maybe she unpacked already because she stupidly believes his "reassurances" to her.
Cynthia - on the dark side where David is, there is no courage, either. Which really makes me wonder what he is going to do about the employees' ultimatum. If he sticks to his own pattern, he will let the employees leave rather than face the wrath of his in-laws. And then he will have to either do all of the work around the vineyard by himself, or get the women and children to help him out. (Keeping in mind that it was too much work for his own butt-busting employees.) That is too hilarious to contemplate.
Wait! If David has to put his kids to work, Bobby can stop complaining that Daddy doesn't spend enough time with him any more.
The cell phones are not the only things Juan should worry about. He has no idea who else Carito may have discussed her secrets with. He can't know that she didn't tell Marta, for example. Or that she won't tell anyone soon. He can't know what his henchmen might have said with their dying breaths. That's why I said he was making a lot of assumptions. He still thinks he's smarter than everyone else. I guess that's understandable, considering how long he'd been with David, but he's out in the real world now and it will eventually catch up with him.
The cell phones are not the only things Juan should worry about. He has no idea who else Carito may have discussed her secrets with. He can't know that she didn't tell Marta, for example. Or that she won't tell anyone soon. He can't know what his henchmen might have said with their dying breaths. That's why I said he was making a lot of assumptions. He still thinks he's smarter than everyone else. I guess that's understandable, considering how long he'd been with David, but he's out in the real world now and it will eventually catch up with him.
You folks are thinking so much more than any of the characters are.. Or any of the writers ever did. In the words of our dear Carlos (hi, amigo, wherever you are)..Next!!
I need some closure . I am less invested ( heh..by the way, is Dave too depressed to put on his vest and deal with all those tricky buttons..vestless Dave must be some kind of metaphor for his despondency ) ..anyway I am less invested in Juan and Perla and more interested in Rocky and Bullwinkle getting what is coming to them.
Time to identify tissue holders to prove that I am not a robot because robots do not use tissues . I can do this...thanks to my spring allergies. #glasshalffull
I need some closure . I am less invested ( heh..by the way, is Dave too depressed to put on his vest and deal with all those tricky buttons..vestless Dave must be some kind of metaphor for his despondency ) ..anyway I am less invested in Juan and Perla and more interested in Rocky and Bullwinkle getting what is coming to them.
Time to identify tissue holders to prove that I am not a robot because robots do not use tissues . I can do this...thanks to my spring allergies. #glasshalffull
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 1:38:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 1:38:00 PM EDT
All the above said: I'm sticking with Buggs and Yosemite. They are still a shitload more believable than this crock.
A smart talking Rabbit and a two pound cowboy carrying a three pound six shooter vs a confession which busts wide open a year long smuggling ring and there is no trace left after the one LEO dies?
What's up Doc?
A smart talking Rabbit and a two pound cowboy carrying a three pound six shooter vs a confession which busts wide open a year long smuggling ring and there is no trace left after the one LEO dies?
What's up Doc?
Does it strike anyone else funny that Marta told Lilian (her enemy) the truth about Gut's last words, but lied to Ramon? She didn't have to tell Ramon anything, but instead she lied.
I hope Lil does go to Adolfo. I hope she gets there five minutes after Marta moves in.
I hope Lil does go to Adolfo. I hope she gets there five minutes after Marta moves in.
Julie, I didn't even get to that in my rant. Yah, she lied! You were right to wonder how she was going to spin it: she didn't have to spin it or, as you said, say ANYTHING to Ramon! Ramon was going to make lemonade out of piss no matter what cause he's GONE on Marta!
Did "they" intend that lie or was it a slip up like "Luis"?
Another thing that stood out is how David and Perla are both equally mesmerized by their "love" interests. [Loved DG's cap wearing the "tassel earrings of doom!] They both have that dazed/befuddled/think-I-smell-shit-but-I'm-not-sure look on their faces.
Did "they" intend that lie or was it a slip up like "Luis"?
Another thing that stood out is how David and Perla are both equally mesmerized by their "love" interests. [Loved DG's cap wearing the "tassel earrings of doom!] They both have that dazed/befuddled/think-I-smell-shit-but-I'm-not-sure look on their faces.
I'm amazed that Perla isn't dead already.
And David... months ago, I joked that David would marry Luci and then die so that she'd inherit the place. I thought it was a joke because no way would he get killed off. Now I'm not so sure. He's like a magnet for trouble.
However, I'm still willing to see them get married as long as I get that car I asked for. It's only fair. Televisa (or the TV network) gave away a car in Mexico last year to promote Hotel de los Secretos, and I wasn't eligible for that. So I figure they owe me.
And David... months ago, I joked that David would marry Luci and then die so that she'd inherit the place. I thought it was a joke because no way would he get killed off. Now I'm not so sure. He's like a magnet for trouble.
However, I'm still willing to see them get married as long as I get that car I asked for. It's only fair. Televisa (or the TV network) gave away a car in Mexico last year to promote Hotel de los Secretos, and I wasn't eligible for that. So I figure they owe me.
Having some technical difficulties here.
Julie..forgot to tell you how much I loved your captioned screen caps. Reminded me of Carlos's irreverent captions for CI. Can you hear me now?
Julie..forgot to tell you how much I loved your captioned screen caps. Reminded me of Carlos's irreverent captions for CI. Can you hear me now?
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 3:18:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 3:18:00 PM EDT
I tried doing captions before, but could never come up with anything funny. I guess last night I had some inspiration.
And I have found the show "inspiring" lately. A lot of what's happening is really maddening, but there's a lot more "happening" to give us something to work with.
And I have found the show "inspiring" lately. A lot of what's happening is really maddening, but there's a lot more "happening" to give us something to work with.
Okay, Julie..if you are getting the car, I want the car (candy apple red Mustang) AND the trip to Hawaii...the one on the private plane and I somehow do not have to go through the airport hassle.
I also forgot to tell you his much I loved the title. We have left no stone unturned to use every rock reference we can think of.
As to the hypnotic Tassle earrings, didn't we have some kind of Tassle necklace that stirred up a lot of hate on the patio. I think it was in PyP.
This one goes out to a couple folks in Sonoma...Courtesy of Bon Jovi "You Give Love Bad Name."
I also forgot to tell you his much I loved the title. We have left no stone unturned to use every rock reference we can think of.
As to the hypnotic Tassle earrings, didn't we have some kind of Tassle necklace that stirred up a lot of hate on the patio. I think it was in PyP.
This one goes out to a couple folks in Sonoma...Courtesy of Bon Jovi "You Give Love Bad Name."
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 3:29:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 3:29:00 PM EDT
On a brighter note: Shirt pockets are right over a beating heart.
I'm bored with these dueling heiffers. I'm gonna try to get my face slapped.
I'm bored with these dueling heiffers. I'm gonna try to get my face slapped.
So...I was thinking about the ending while I was shoving wet clothes into the dryer a little while ago. If Lu MUST end up with Dumbbunny , I want Grace, Lilian, Juan, and Perla gone either to jail or to whatever afterlife they are getting, and I want everyone else to move into the Big House...Lu , of course since she has to be with Dumbbunny, Ramon and Marta, Sonia and Cubby, Tano and Fer (who may be pregnant if people keep letting her climb all over Tano while he is "working ") and , if course, Booboo. I do not want Carito rewarded with Miguel, so she will be in charge of the new workers in the employee bunkhouse. Soosan has to go live with Cesar. Adolfo and Miguel will double date until they find women worthy of their niceness . Credits roll...grape vines...wind...ad for Bimbo Bread... THE END
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 3:40:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 3:40:00 PM EDT
You guys are going to think I'm crazy, but I would still like to see Luciana and David be together. But David is going to have to do a lot of groveling before Luciana should consent to taking him back. I just don't think we have enough time for all that though. I just hope that DisGrace is exposed for the murderer she is and goes to prison, along with Juan. As for Lilian, I'd love to see her penniless in her apartment in San Diego. At least that's the way I'd write the ending.
Oh forgot to say regarding Perla: She could end up in prison too. There are lots of women who end up in prison because they stupidly followed their bad boyfriends and were accomplices to crime. So Perla, as dumb as she is, (if I were writing this story) should go to prison but with a reduced sentence if she turns over evidence and testifies against Juan.
Bimbo bread and Lala milk!
Perla can probably get a plea deal if she rats out Juan, but I don't think she'll do it.
Squirrel... so... cute... *THUD*
Perla can probably get a plea deal if she rats out Juan, but I don't think she'll do it.
Squirrel... so... cute... *THUD*
Perla is hard to nail down. When the show started, she was just a mean nasty little whore. But as the show has dragged along, she got shorter dresses, improved hair and makeup, and is now acting like a DUMB mean nasty little whore.
kj
kj
Here are some more lessons I've learned from VEA:
- Women are hopelessly fickle.
- Men are hopelessly fickle.
- True love is a fantasy.
- People really can change... they can get meaner and dumber.
- Women are hopelessly fickle.
- Men are hopelessly fickle.
- True love is a fantasy.
- People really can change... they can get meaner and dumber.
Julie, good recap.This was the episode
Of stupidness.I knew dumb-vid would take lil's side.She's his deadbeat mom inlaw. No surprise there,marta is just
The help. Now he's been knowing marta all these years since before those children were born, he's got to know that she's got a quiet spirit and she does not gett violent and mad and upset like that out of the blue. He knows that Lil did something to cause that, so why the hell is he acting like he don't?The only one she should
Apologize to is bobby, or even david, for fighting in his house,but don't ask Her to bow down to a nasty racist disrespectful ingrate like lil.
Stupid #2 perla, how can she be that dence? Telling Juan to swear to her he
Didn't do anything wrong. And Then the
STUPID girl believes it. Think I would have taken those packed bags and get as far away as I could from ground zero, cuz it's gonna blow.
Dave can't run the vineyard alone.Does he really think marta is gonna bow and apologize To that witch? He really do expects her to.I wouldn't either.Thats just to much. She can cook and clean for adolfo and Miguel.
Stupid#3, fern still stupid. I guess
Next week all the stupid will come out. I think "Lewis" was lisa.At times
Those cc3s don't come out right.
Thank you Julie. You did good with what you had to work with.
Of stupidness.I knew dumb-vid would take lil's side.She's his deadbeat mom inlaw. No surprise there,marta is just
The help. Now he's been knowing marta all these years since before those children were born, he's got to know that she's got a quiet spirit and she does not gett violent and mad and upset like that out of the blue. He knows that Lil did something to cause that, so why the hell is he acting like he don't?The only one she should
Apologize to is bobby, or even david, for fighting in his house,but don't ask Her to bow down to a nasty racist disrespectful ingrate like lil.
Stupid #2 perla, how can she be that dence? Telling Juan to swear to her he
Didn't do anything wrong. And Then the
STUPID girl believes it. Think I would have taken those packed bags and get as far away as I could from ground zero, cuz it's gonna blow.
Dave can't run the vineyard alone.Does he really think marta is gonna bow and apologize To that witch? He really do expects her to.I wouldn't either.Thats just to much. She can cook and clean for adolfo and Miguel.
Stupid#3, fern still stupid. I guess
Next week all the stupid will come out. I think "Lewis" was lisa.At times
Those cc3s don't come out right.
Thank you Julie. You did good with what you had to work with.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 6:17:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 6:17:00 PM EDT
I can find no fault in your logic, Kirby. Apart from those brief flashes of self-awareness--mostly due to Carito--Perla has been fairly consistently mean-girl...albeit with great legs. But she's indeed just dumber now, from about the point where she and Juan bailed from BdLA. Or more openly blinded by her love for Juan; either way, we lose.
And, Cynthia: at this point David would have to do so much groveling Grima Wormtongue would look at him and go "It's over, man, give it up, have some self-respect!" before he'd even be worthy of a second glance by Luciana. The bitch of it is that you're right--with ten episodes left and three villains (yeah, that means you, Lil) to deal with, I don't think there's remotely enough time to do it the way it needs to be done. See also Alguien te mira again, where Piedad didn't ever get to grovel at all and skated on a timeskip.
While I was out grocery shopping, it occurred to me that this show could have offset a shirtload of its secondary insanity if it had done one simple thing--if perhaps in two parts: have Marta
1. express some actual damned remorse for her affair with Fernando (this doesn't necessarily go all the way to an apology to Lilian, though that wouldn't happen until after Brian told them that Fernando was a dog);
2. explain at some point, preferably before 1, that she had stuck around BdLA all these years partly because she really did care about David and his family and partly because she felt guilty for said affair and--fork it, have her go full Martyra with it. But she would have to actually say this at length.
Then Show could have continued with Lilian's full-court press on her and we, or at least I, would have been relatively okay with it.
And, Cynthia: at this point David would have to do so much groveling Grima Wormtongue would look at him and go "It's over, man, give it up, have some self-respect!" before he'd even be worthy of a second glance by Luciana. The bitch of it is that you're right--with ten episodes left and three villains (yeah, that means you, Lil) to deal with, I don't think there's remotely enough time to do it the way it needs to be done. See also Alguien te mira again, where Piedad didn't ever get to grovel at all and skated on a timeskip.
While I was out grocery shopping, it occurred to me that this show could have offset a shirtload of its secondary insanity if it had done one simple thing--if perhaps in two parts: have Marta
1. express some actual damned remorse for her affair with Fernando (this doesn't necessarily go all the way to an apology to Lilian, though that wouldn't happen until after Brian told them that Fernando was a dog);
2. explain at some point, preferably before 1, that she had stuck around BdLA all these years partly because she really did care about David and his family and partly because she felt guilty for said affair and--fork it, have her go full Martyra with it. But she would have to actually say this at length.
Then Show could have continued with Lilian's full-court press on her and we, or at least I, would have been relatively okay with it.
But Bill, that secondary insanity is what has helped sustain Show for so long!!
Yeah, it would have been nice to redeem Marta a little bit. Again, I can't quite tell what the writers intended us to think of her.
Yeah, it would have been nice to redeem Marta a little bit. Again, I can't quite tell what the writers intended us to think of her.
Julie, witty and wonderful.
"Marta's little fists of fury" and "Grace responds with all the empathy she can summon - that is, none" were great but my favorite was "If he lets Marta go, he will need to hire a lot of people in a hurry. (I hear Juan knows some people.)>
"(I notice that when Luci hugs her mother, she doesn't make a fist)". Interesting. I think she does when she hugs Miguel, but it's a little looser. Will have to double check.
"Fernanda says Bobby doesn't know how bad she (Luci) is". I think I was one of the few still loitering at Fernanda's table. "She wonders why does everything have to be so complicated now, when at last they were all happy?" - umm really Fernanda? What a delusional world you are inhabiting. You are largely responsible for breaking up your father's relationship with Luci when she was nothing but kind to you, despite the way you treated her. Yet you continue to denigrate her. Enjoy your self at your empty table. Perhaps Tano can be persuaded to keep you company.
Luci says to David, "I don't know what they've been saying to you, but every day you disappoint me more." Yes Luci. You ex is losing any favor he might have curried initially here on the patio. Only his daughter is rivaling him for obnoxious, hard hearted words and attitude.
The obvious choice would have been for "Vestmaster General" (good one Bill) David to comfort Bobby and have Marta come and speak with Bobby herself. He should not have tried to force Marta to apologize to Lili. Although she acts it at times, Marta is not a child. And certainly not his child.
"Lillian could not make Brian love her just as DisGrace can't make David love her". Great insight Urban.
"Barbie doll that suddenly grew like Alice in Wonderland and came to life". Wow Susanlynn. Nailed it.
Kirby, thank you for giving us something to smile about (comment and screen shot).
Cynthia, I always thought it would be Carito who dies, not Perla. Will be interesting to see what happens.
Not sure where to end here but Lila's descriptive summary of "sloppy writing and a bargain basement budget" says it all.
Will say a prayer for your friend Anita. God bless.
Julie, you made my day. Thank you.
Diana
"Marta's little fists of fury" and "Grace responds with all the empathy she can summon - that is, none" were great but my favorite was "If he lets Marta go, he will need to hire a lot of people in a hurry. (I hear Juan knows some people.)>
"(I notice that when Luci hugs her mother, she doesn't make a fist)". Interesting. I think she does when she hugs Miguel, but it's a little looser. Will have to double check.
"Fernanda says Bobby doesn't know how bad she (Luci) is". I think I was one of the few still loitering at Fernanda's table. "She wonders why does everything have to be so complicated now, when at last they were all happy?" - umm really Fernanda? What a delusional world you are inhabiting. You are largely responsible for breaking up your father's relationship with Luci when she was nothing but kind to you, despite the way you treated her. Yet you continue to denigrate her. Enjoy your self at your empty table. Perhaps Tano can be persuaded to keep you company.
Luci says to David, "I don't know what they've been saying to you, but every day you disappoint me more." Yes Luci. You ex is losing any favor he might have curried initially here on the patio. Only his daughter is rivaling him for obnoxious, hard hearted words and attitude.
The obvious choice would have been for "Vestmaster General" (good one Bill) David to comfort Bobby and have Marta come and speak with Bobby herself. He should not have tried to force Marta to apologize to Lili. Although she acts it at times, Marta is not a child. And certainly not his child.
"Lillian could not make Brian love her just as DisGrace can't make David love her". Great insight Urban.
"Barbie doll that suddenly grew like Alice in Wonderland and came to life". Wow Susanlynn. Nailed it.
Kirby, thank you for giving us something to smile about (comment and screen shot).
Cynthia, I always thought it would be Carito who dies, not Perla. Will be interesting to see what happens.
Not sure where to end here but Lila's descriptive summary of "sloppy writing and a bargain basement budget" says it all.
Will say a prayer for your friend Anita. God bless.
Julie, you made my day. Thank you.
Diana
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:30:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:30:00 PM EDT
Julie..we do not have Lala milk around here, but on the way to dinner out with a friend tonight, we passed a big Bimbo factory.
So many lessons learned via this show....all of them depressing .
My fervent hope is that these two women stop wasting their lives on their blood feud over two guys, both of whom are now dead. Basta. I am just hoping that they do not find another dude to bicker over. Stop it. There has been more focus lately on Lilian and Marta than on the supposed leads.
In most telenovelas in the past, women viewers want to be with the galan and male viewers want to be him. In this show..not so much.
Anita..so sorry to hear about your friend's husband. My best friend lost her husband this past summer to cancer of the gall bladder. I know that you will be there to comfort and support your friend.
So many lessons learned via this show....all of them depressing .
My fervent hope is that these two women stop wasting their lives on their blood feud over two guys, both of whom are now dead. Basta. I am just hoping that they do not find another dude to bicker over. Stop it. There has been more focus lately on Lilian and Marta than on the supposed leads.
In most telenovelas in the past, women viewers want to be with the galan and male viewers want to be him. In this show..not so much.
Anita..so sorry to hear about your friend's husband. My best friend lost her husband this past summer to cancer of the gall bladder. I know that you will be there to comfort and support your friend.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:39:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:39:00 PM EDT
Kirby..you evidently have a good relationship with your local squirrels. We have a lot of them and chipmunks in our backyard and surrounding woods, and I stay away from them and chase them off the patio. I guess my aversion started with my dad telling me not to play with the squirrels on my college campus.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:47:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:47:00 PM EDT
David has allowed his life to be upended by his spoiled brat of a daughter and her succubus Tia and mom
In-law from hell. And he can't seem to get a handle on anything thats vomicly screwed up in his house. I've never seen a tn where the galan is as brain dead as This guy. And I really like the actor he plays braindead really well.
In-law from hell. And he can't seem to get a handle on anything thats vomicly screwed up in his house. I've never seen a tn where the galan is as brain dead as This guy. And I really like the actor he plays braindead really well.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:50:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:50:00 PM EDT
Sue: I get along good with animals. We have an understanding of mutual respect. Neither of us wants the other as a posession or pet.
We feed our entire backyard community. Always ensuring we put out enough sunflower seeds and bird food, "our" squirrels and birds always eat together quite amiably. Blue jays, cardinals, doves, squirrels and an occasional rabbit. When the food runs low, the birds take to trees and wail in high pitched complaint, letting us know the supply needs to be replenished.
Can't wait for the hummingbirds to appear.
Diana
Can't wait for the hummingbirds to appear.
Diana
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:53:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:53:00 PM EDT
Nina, you just made me smile.
I really like Gabe Soto too. As Lila and others have pointed out, the writing and directing has really hurt the story and the actors (and US) are the unintended casualties.
Diana
I really like Gabe Soto too. As Lila and others have pointed out, the writing and directing has really hurt the story and the actors (and US) are the unintended casualties.
Diana
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:55:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 7:55:00 PM EDT
I chose that pic of DG with the tassel earrings of doom because of her eyes. She frequently opens them very wide. I guess it's part of her mind control arsenal. Many people do this, of course, but she does it a lot and for some reason it's a little freaky when she does it.
Diana, Good for you. That is how it should be.
Shows about animals are like "Nature" or National Geographic. Shows about humans are like Vino el Amor.
Hmmmmmmm ? Just Saying.................
Shows about animals are like "Nature" or National Geographic. Shows about humans are like Vino el Amor.
Hmmmmmmm ? Just Saying.................
Kirby...there is a new movie "Born in China" that looks really amazing . It is about wild animals in the mountains of China..pandas, monkeys, and cheetahs, I think. The previews look interesting.
We used to have a lot of rabbits around here, but we also have a lot of hawks and Hubba has seen coyotes .
We used to have a lot of rabbits around here, but we also have a lot of hawks and Hubba has seen coyotes .
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 10:02:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 10:02:00 PM EDT
I think DisGaze opens her eyes like that as in 'Wide Eyed Innocence' like a sweet child. As you surmised, just another tool.
I will look for it, thanks.
Speaking of toast.........
I will look for it, thanks.
Speaking of toast.........
I meant to add, I still haven't noticed David rubbing his face. I don't doubt that it happens, but somehow I never see it.
Julie, "freaky" is a spot on description of many of Graciela's intent stares. If that vacant stare were emitted at me, I would be uneasy. Extremely uneasy.
Kirby, I will tack on "Wild" prior to your "Wide Eyed Innocence". Craziness bubbling right beneath the surface.
Diana
Kirby, I will tack on "Wild" prior to your "Wide Eyed Innocence". Craziness bubbling right beneath the surface.
Diana
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 10:25:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 10:25:00 PM EDT
Those pale blue\gray eyes are a little otherworldly. It is hard not to stare at those eyes. Grace knows that and uses it for the Vulcan mind meld that she does on Dave whose mind is probably pretty easy to meld with. I guess almost anyone could do it.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 10:33:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 10:33:00 PM EDT
This is the first telenovela in a decade where I do NOT hope the protagonists, david and Lu, get together!!! I am praying for the only JUST ending------here it is: Juan confessing, upon his arrest, all about Grace-- how together they cheated the vineyard, how she killed Lisa, how she intended to send Bobby to a boarding school, etc etc etc. in sum-- that he brings grace and Lilian down with him!!! And that Fer suffers greatly to learn about her adoring tia, that Bobby learns all but ends up with the love of Marta and Luciana again and recovers quickly...
And Luciana somehow (?) falls in love with Miguel, that Marta marries Ramon, sue marries Cesar, Sonia marries LEON and they all live happily ever after, working and living at Adolfo and Miguel's vineyard. I truly truly want all the above. David is completely pathetic and I have zero sympathy for him. When he asks Marta to apologize or to leave, there is absolutely NOTHING that can redeem him, no matter how repentant he is or becomes!! Even though Marta has acted incredibly stupid throughout, she still deserves a happy ending.
And Luciana somehow (?) falls in love with Miguel, that Marta marries Ramon, sue marries Cesar, Sonia marries LEON and they all live happily ever after, working and living at Adolfo and Miguel's vineyard. I truly truly want all the above. David is completely pathetic and I have zero sympathy for him. When he asks Marta to apologize or to leave, there is absolutely NOTHING that can redeem him, no matter how repentant he is or becomes!! Even though Marta has acted incredibly stupid throughout, she still deserves a happy ending.
Permalink posted by : Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 11:48:00 PM EDT
: Saturday, April 22, 2017 at 11:48:00 PM EDT
Diana: You mentioned: "Cynthia, I always thought it would be Carito who dies, not Perla. Will be interesting to see what happens."
I never said anything about Perla dying. All I said about her is that she could end up in prison on a reduced sentence if she would testify against Juan.
I never said anything about Perla dying. All I said about her is that she could end up in prison on a reduced sentence if she would testify against Juan.
David will need a shrink but after Dr Evil he will be unlikely to trust any of them unless Cesar finds out the low-down on this creep.
Which he should have long ago. What a writing fail.
Which he should have long ago. What a writing fail.
" Vulcan mind meld that she does on Dave whose mind is"
I am surprised she does not close one eye in order not to short circuit David.
:-) :-) :-)
Anon at 11:48 last night;
David is lost. Since most humans can be explained via the family car here goes:
It is like when the adjuster walks up with the clipboard and utters those dreaded (usually) words
"It's Totaled, We'll just get you another car. This one needs to just go to the crusher."
That's David. Even when the Succubii are unattached and destroyed, he will be irreparably altered for life, and little use to himself and anyone else. He will most likely tend not to be so trusting and might, just might, not be quite as crazy about women in general anymore. Poor guy, he is gone. This would have never happened if he had not helped the succubii sooo much. He has no one really to blame but himself. Have fun living the rest of your life doofus.
Happy Sunday.
I am surprised she does not close one eye in order not to short circuit David.
:-) :-) :-)
Anon at 11:48 last night;
David is lost. Since most humans can be explained via the family car here goes:
It is like when the adjuster walks up with the clipboard and utters those dreaded (usually) words
"It's Totaled, We'll just get you another car. This one needs to just go to the crusher."
That's David. Even when the Succubii are unattached and destroyed, he will be irreparably altered for life, and little use to himself and anyone else. He will most likely tend not to be so trusting and might, just might, not be quite as crazy about women in general anymore. Poor guy, he is gone. This would have never happened if he had not helped the succubii sooo much. He has no one really to blame but himself. Have fun living the rest of your life doofus.
Happy Sunday.
Julie--Having to watch and recap this episode was certainly painful, but I hope the comments have raised your spirits. Thanks for the time you had to spend digesting and regurgitating this episode.
Thanks to you, I now have the title of the Post Mortem:
"Along Came Love and It Passed Through and Kept on Going"
It certainly has passed through some Kaka on the way through.
Now to read the rest of the comments and troll for gems.
Thanks to you, I now have the title of the Post Mortem:
"Along Came Love and It Passed Through and Kept on Going"
It certainly has passed through some Kaka on the way through.
Now to read the rest of the comments and troll for gems.
Thank you all for your thoughts and prayers for my friend. This was his second marriage, both lasting almost 30 years--he was considerably older than she is. My friend was fortunate to have a solid, dependable, loving, faithful husband who would do anything for her. That certainly doesn't sound like anyone on this show.
She's a survivor and we'll all be ok once she is able to mourn and get used to the idea of being a young(ish) widow. She has a tight circle of friends who all love her very much.
She's a survivor and we'll all be ok once she is able to mourn and get used to the idea of being a young(ish) widow. She has a tight circle of friends who all love her very much.
Yes, Cynthia, I was just speculating about Perla's fate. I never meant to imply that was your thought as well :)
Diana
Diana
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 12:03:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 12:03:00 PM EDT
My thought on Carito and Perla has been that one of them will die, and that will serve as anvil for the other. But I haven't settled on which one will die. First I thought it was Perla, then I thought it was Carito, now I'm back to thinking it's Perla.
Anita, I'm flattered you will use my title for the postmortem. The title deserves severe mockery, because it is such a lie. This thing was advertised like a traditional telenovela, but the way things stand now, there is no plausible or acceptable way for this mess to have a traditional TN ending.
I am not in the least opposed to seeing the TN genre go off in different directions, though I do believe that there is still plenty of unexplored ground even within the traditional TN format. All I ask is that if they're going to feed us a cynical pile of angst and misery, could they please provide some clue beforehand.
Yago was not a traditional TN, but I loved it. However, I felt that they made it clear from the beginning that it wasn't going to be typical.
I am not in the least opposed to seeing the TN genre go off in different directions, though I do believe that there is still plenty of unexplored ground even within the traditional TN format. All I ask is that if they're going to feed us a cynical pile of angst and misery, could they please provide some clue beforehand.
Yago was not a traditional TN, but I loved it. However, I felt that they made it clear from the beginning that it wasn't going to be typical.
"All I ask is that if they're going to feed us a cynical pile of angst and misery, could they please provide some clue beforehand".
Exactly Julie! So much of this was fragmented and disjointed. In the past, TNs took great care in crafting the characters, who had heart, courage, compassion and dignity. We came to care about them and what happened to them. Here, I am scrounging to find someone to root for. The writers seemed to take great care to make most of these characters truly unlikeable. Now that Brian has passed, it seems Marta and Lili's rivalry has already become even more bitter, if that's possible. I'm tired of their bickering and the time it's taking away from more important people, e.g. Sonia.
Diana
Exactly Julie! So much of this was fragmented and disjointed. In the past, TNs took great care in crafting the characters, who had heart, courage, compassion and dignity. We came to care about them and what happened to them. Here, I am scrounging to find someone to root for. The writers seemed to take great care to make most of these characters truly unlikeable. Now that Brian has passed, it seems Marta and Lili's rivalry has already become even more bitter, if that's possible. I'm tired of their bickering and the time it's taking away from more important people, e.g. Sonia.
Diana
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 12:41:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 12:41:00 PM EDT
Yes, Diana... it's still fun to anticipate the anvils, but it's less rewarding when you're not also anticipating well-deserved happy outcomes for the rest of the characters.
I like characters that I can relate to, and I love characters that I can look up to. With a character that I can relate to, there is plenty of room for flaws. Yet somehow the writers managed to create a whole vineyard full of people who are way worse than I could ever hope to be.
I can't help but wonder if, had Sonia and Leon been bigger roles with more screen time, they wouldn't have ended up going on a crime spree just to ruin those two as well.
I remember someone saying a few months ago that this TN got great ratings in Mexico. I wonder if that was through the entire run, or just towards the end when it turned into a freakshow.
Kirby predicted "goat rodeo" a while back when we were waiting for Fernanda's birthday party. I think we're watching a goat rodeo now. DEAR GOD, WHERE ARE THE CLOWNS??
I like characters that I can relate to, and I love characters that I can look up to. With a character that I can relate to, there is plenty of room for flaws. Yet somehow the writers managed to create a whole vineyard full of people who are way worse than I could ever hope to be.
I can't help but wonder if, had Sonia and Leon been bigger roles with more screen time, they wouldn't have ended up going on a crime spree just to ruin those two as well.
I remember someone saying a few months ago that this TN got great ratings in Mexico. I wonder if that was through the entire run, or just towards the end when it turned into a freakshow.
Kirby predicted "goat rodeo" a while back when we were waiting for Fernanda's birthday party. I think we're watching a goat rodeo now. DEAR GOD, WHERE ARE THE CLOWNS??
I'm also still wondering how much of what we saw was intentional. That is, was Miguel's possessiveness with Luciana supposed to be seen as endearing and appealing? Or was it supposed to be annoying? I felt that we were supposed to see it as a sign of his "love" for her, but I just hated it.
I have enjoyed reading today's comments as I rest up for the week ahead, read the Sunday paper, and finish up a few chores. I have some papers to correct, but I am avoiding them.
Ah yes, I think that we were fooled into thinking that we were in for some old-fashioned romance and characters we could relate to by all those previews of the wind racing through vineyard, plump clusters of grapes, barrels of vino, and people in jeans. Also, I remember being beat down by PyP....who was the galan and who was the bad guy was still unclear at the finale of that one???? I was anxious to get outside in the vineyard and out of the mansions and offices..out of suits and cocktail dresses and into jeans and tee-shirts Anyhoo, I am wondering if telenovelas have changed forever and if the idea of romance and onetruelove is gone .
Here is an interesting quote from John Gray , the author of Men Are from Mars;Women Are from Venus. " Men are motivated when they are needed. Women are motivated when they are cherished " In my experience, these statements are true. We could apply them to our characters in this telenovela. Perhaps the problem is that needing someone and cherishing someone have gone out if style and , therefore out of modern. telenovelas.
Ah yes, I think that we were fooled into thinking that we were in for some old-fashioned romance and characters we could relate to by all those previews of the wind racing through vineyard, plump clusters of grapes, barrels of vino, and people in jeans. Also, I remember being beat down by PyP....who was the galan and who was the bad guy was still unclear at the finale of that one???? I was anxious to get outside in the vineyard and out of the mansions and offices..out of suits and cocktail dresses and into jeans and tee-shirts Anyhoo, I am wondering if telenovelas have changed forever and if the idea of romance and onetruelove is gone .
Here is an interesting quote from John Gray , the author of Men Are from Mars;Women Are from Venus. " Men are motivated when they are needed. Women are motivated when they are cherished " In my experience, these statements are true. We could apply them to our characters in this telenovela. Perhaps the problem is that needing someone and cherishing someone have gone out if style and , therefore out of modern. telenovelas.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 1:29:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 1:29:00 PM EDT
Sniff. Hmmmm I do smell something. Ugh. Yep an old goat. Sniff sniff. Two of them. Neither giving milk anymore. Just running around poopin in each other's stalls.
Julie..I think that you are right about how Miguel was supposed to be perceived. Young and madly in love . I interpreted it that way, but I don't think anyone else did. I was raised on movies, tv shows, and songs about lasting love and soulmates . i guess tgat they influenced my perspective. To each his own.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 1:36:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 1:36:00 PM EDT
OK I admit I didn't know the female equivalent of Billy Goat. Lo and behold all that is sacred my children it is ...... wait for it......
N A N N Y. Nanny goat Nanna goat Marta and Lilly. Perfect, sometimes even a blind hog finds an acorn.
N A N N Y. Nanny goat Nanna goat Marta and Lilly. Perfect, sometimes even a blind hog finds an acorn.
Hmmm.....I just noticed that my TV listing shows " LA Doble Vida.." Tonight at 10.00pm on Uni. Is it starting already?
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 3:16:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 3:16:00 PM EDT
Susanlynn, I also think (hope?) I am a romantic at heart. And while I liked Miguel initially, his controlling and rather fanatical possessiveness was a turn off. But now, I see a kinder and gentler character, one who I would be very happy to have Luci end up with. The only obstacle is that she still loves David. Sigh.
Luci exemplified (as much as she could given the circumstances)the fierce love and devotion that constitute what romance means to me. Luci quietly stepped away, allowing David to convince his children and her reward was betrayal of the worst kind.
Julie, I wonder if the writers just used Sonia as a "filler", not realizing the depth of her appeal here on the patio. I think there were a few who might not have been immediately smitten, but I dare say those folks might not have seen the sultry, sexy Veronica in anything previously. :)
"Goat Rodeo" Kirby? I'm still smiling. Nanny goats indeed!
It's a beautiful day today here - hope it is in everyone's neck of the woods as well!
Diana
Luci exemplified (as much as she could given the circumstances)the fierce love and devotion that constitute what romance means to me. Luci quietly stepped away, allowing David to convince his children and her reward was betrayal of the worst kind.
Julie, I wonder if the writers just used Sonia as a "filler", not realizing the depth of her appeal here on the patio. I think there were a few who might not have been immediately smitten, but I dare say those folks might not have seen the sultry, sexy Veronica in anything previously. :)
"Goat Rodeo" Kirby? I'm still smiling. Nanny goats indeed!
It's a beautiful day today here - hope it is in everyone's neck of the woods as well!
Diana
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 3:38:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 3:38:00 PM EDT
Ratings in Mexico were not very good in the first episodes. They started to improve around episodes 70-75, when all the couples got together (Luciana & David, Erika & Miguel, Sonia & Leon). People were literally starving for some romance and they didn't like Luciana & Miguel or Susan & Tano, who seemed to dominate the show during its first half. In the last weeks the numbers started to decline again, as the audience was fed up with Graciela manipulating everybody. Generally there was a lot of complaining regarding the lack of romance in this TN, especially between Luciana and David. At the end of the show the only couple people could relate to was Sonia and Leon.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 3:44:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 3:44:00 PM EDT
Diana: Okay, I understand now. I just had the impression that you had misunderstood what I previously said about Perla. Sorry about that.
I'm not a fan of killing people off, I like to see them go to prison when they have been bad people. But some people who are the epitome of evil, I don't mind them dying in an "accident". In El Hotel de los Secretos, I HATED Diego, so I kept saying, "Die, Diego, Die!" So I was happy he died in a fire at the end. In ECDLP, the suicide of Rebeca was fitting, but I was sad that her daughter Nora jumped to her death at the end. Sometimes I want to see bad characters rehabilitated, not dead.
In Perla's case, I feel sorry for her because she is so blind to Juan's actions and is so in love with him, he can do no wrong. She believes everything he says and because of that, she will follow him till the bitter end. She views him as her "savior" who will take her away from the drudgery of being in servant type of job and give her everything she has dreamed of having. What that will mean for her life, we can only watch and see if she ends up in prison or whether Juan loses his temper and kills her (he is abusive!) or some other thug comes after her. But I sure hope not. She is one person that I hope comes to her senses and repents of her actions, the same way Carito seems to have done.
I'm not a fan of killing people off, I like to see them go to prison when they have been bad people. But some people who are the epitome of evil, I don't mind them dying in an "accident". In El Hotel de los Secretos, I HATED Diego, so I kept saying, "Die, Diego, Die!" So I was happy he died in a fire at the end. In ECDLP, the suicide of Rebeca was fitting, but I was sad that her daughter Nora jumped to her death at the end. Sometimes I want to see bad characters rehabilitated, not dead.
In Perla's case, I feel sorry for her because she is so blind to Juan's actions and is so in love with him, he can do no wrong. She believes everything he says and because of that, she will follow him till the bitter end. She views him as her "savior" who will take her away from the drudgery of being in servant type of job and give her everything she has dreamed of having. What that will mean for her life, we can only watch and see if she ends up in prison or whether Juan loses his temper and kills her (he is abusive!) or some other thug comes after her. But I sure hope not. She is one person that I hope comes to her senses and repents of her actions, the same way Carito seems to have done.
Perla is still and will always be that little girl who became infatuated with Juan. As you say, Cynthia, Perla hitched her wagon to a guy she thought would be able to give her the life she wanted which was not as a servant. Juan seemed like the answer to her idea of the life she wanted , and even now, she can't give up that dream . it will be her downfall.
Diana, a nice here, too. Only 60 , but the sun as mostly out. Hubba got our front and back yards mowed and just left to mow at the farm.
Diana, a nice here, too. Only 60 , but the sun as mostly out. Hubba got our front and back yards mowed and just left to mow at the farm.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 4:08:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 4:08:00 PM EDT
Good afternoon, Patio Pals! Quietly lurking in between chores. I'm happy this is about to wrap up. Thanks for the report on viewer perception in Mexico, Lisa.
Nanny Goat rodeo! That's great! Certainly describes Friday's episode! I've liked many of the suggested endings. Even though he's not worthy, I know Luci and Dud are going to end up together. I'll just go with the fact that Luci loves the dolt and consider that all this mayhem is the front-loading of their marital problems so that once they get hitched, they'll only have minor annoyances to deal with. The mountainous revelation that the sainted Tia Graciela killed her way into their lives will make any other problems they have look like pimples. I'm prepared for the Dr. Evil mind-control and drugging of Fer, and steering Dumvid toward Grace will NOT be revealed and I also expect Lil to be seen as a victim of Grace and her role in the embezzling of Dumbass to either be NOT revealed, glossed over or just generally forgotten. I don't know how they could do that but Lisa's killing by DG will be seen as her anvil. But what, then, will they do with her? I kinda don't care.
I hate Marta yet I know she's supposed to be seen as a victim of Lil. If she ends up at Adolfo's and then Lil blows a gasket because Adolfo is her friend.....I'll just FF>> through these Nanny Goat shenanigans.
Dumbunny Perla and noJuan will probably both end up dead but not before he's instrumental in facilitating the unmasking of DG. Just let it be over. Is it true blondes have more fun? It is until it isn't when DG hopefully spectacularly DisinteGrates!
Nanny Goat rodeo! That's great! Certainly describes Friday's episode! I've liked many of the suggested endings. Even though he's not worthy, I know Luci and Dud are going to end up together. I'll just go with the fact that Luci loves the dolt and consider that all this mayhem is the front-loading of their marital problems so that once they get hitched, they'll only have minor annoyances to deal with. The mountainous revelation that the sainted Tia Graciela killed her way into their lives will make any other problems they have look like pimples. I'm prepared for the Dr. Evil mind-control and drugging of Fer, and steering Dumvid toward Grace will NOT be revealed and I also expect Lil to be seen as a victim of Grace and her role in the embezzling of Dumbass to either be NOT revealed, glossed over or just generally forgotten. I don't know how they could do that but Lisa's killing by DG will be seen as her anvil. But what, then, will they do with her? I kinda don't care.
I hate Marta yet I know she's supposed to be seen as a victim of Lil. If she ends up at Adolfo's and then Lil blows a gasket because Adolfo is her friend.....I'll just FF>> through these Nanny Goat shenanigans.
Dumbunny Perla and noJuan will probably both end up dead but not before he's instrumental in facilitating the unmasking of DG. Just let it be over. Is it true blondes have more fun? It is until it isn't when DG hopefully spectacularly DisinteGrates!
You know, about Perla, someone mentioned the yuck factor in that noJuan watched her grow up from a skinny little girl and eventually made her childish crush a reality.
When Dud was trying to help Marcos and Luciana when they were deported, Luci was very much a skinny little girl herself; fiesty and spirited, but very much a little girl. While Perla developed her crush on Juan at BdLA, Luci developed hers on Dud as a young woman after she returned from Mexico. Isn't the age difference between Perla/NoJuan and Luci/Dud about the same? Seems there should be a similar yuck factor. nywho, it doesn't matter now just maybe if casting kept the couples closer in age romance would have a better chance. Both noJuan and Dudveed come off as users.
When Dud was trying to help Marcos and Luciana when they were deported, Luci was very much a skinny little girl herself; fiesty and spirited, but very much a little girl. While Perla developed her crush on Juan at BdLA, Luci developed hers on Dud as a young woman after she returned from Mexico. Isn't the age difference between Perla/NoJuan and Luci/Dud about the same? Seems there should be a similar yuck factor. nywho, it doesn't matter now just maybe if casting kept the couples closer in age romance would have a better chance. Both noJuan and Dudveed come off as users.
My students in speaking class were discussing marriage and family in their native countries. I asked if it was common for older men to marry younger women, and they all said yes. Then, I asked if older women ever married younger men, and they all said no. There you go. I know several women married to guys ten years older . Some stayed married , and some got divorces. I guess that it depends on the people. In my favorite novel, a girl falls in love with the hero when she is 8 and he is 16, but he falls in love with a woman who is five years older than he is! The girl carries the torch for him even after he marries the other woman.
I need to see Discharged get her just reward for the killing, the manipulating, and the selfishness . Lilian can end up alone in that apartment she detests. I am not a Marta fan, but I think the writers are. She will end up in the house with Ramon, her kids, and "her" other kids. I don't want Lu and Dave to end up together , but I think that they will. Let's face it, it takes a village to take care of Dunbbunny 🐇🐇🐇🐇 Dave and Lu is head of the village.
I need to see Discharged get her just reward for the killing, the manipulating, and the selfishness . Lilian can end up alone in that apartment she detests. I am not a Marta fan, but I think the writers are. She will end up in the house with Ramon, her kids, and "her" other kids. I don't want Lu and Dave to end up together , but I think that they will. Let's face it, it takes a village to take care of Dunbbunny 🐇🐇🐇🐇 Dave and Lu is head of the village.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 4:59:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 4:59:00 PM EDT
I don't care how it ends as long as the Hanna Barbera rolls at the end
Diana I just shot this today. Some stupid Mockingbird thinks an Eagle is in it's territory and is attacking her in HER tree. Look at about 11:00 above the Eagle and to her left. Nutty little bird.
Diana I just shot this today. Some stupid Mockingbird thinks an Eagle is in it's territory and is attacking her in HER tree. Look at about 11:00 above the Eagle and to her left. Nutty little bird.
Kirby, that shot is amazing! How on earth did you capture that??
If you aren't a professional photographer, you should consider it.
Thank you for (yet) another fabulous avatar.
Diana
If you aren't a professional photographer, you should consider it.
Thank you for (yet) another fabulous avatar.
Diana
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 5:13:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 5:13:00 PM EDT
Lila, the actual age difference between Perla and Juan and David and Luci is significant. And while I've criticized Juan, I haven't criticized David. Well, I haven't criticized him for robbing the cradle, even though I have chastised him for just about everything else!
The patio has noted for quite a few years that the galans seemed to be paired with younger and younger women. There seem to be few couples where the couple are close in age. Maybe that is why I loved Amores Verdaderos so much. Eduardo Yanez and Erica Buenfil (I forget the character's names) shared a deep love as well as age appropriateness.
In terms of David, "it takes a village to take care of Dunbbunny 🐇🐇🐇🐇 Dave and Lu is head of the village". Yes, Susanlynn, sigh. Yes.
Diana
The patio has noted for quite a few years that the galans seemed to be paired with younger and younger women. There seem to be few couples where the couple are close in age. Maybe that is why I loved Amores Verdaderos so much. Eduardo Yanez and Erica Buenfil (I forget the character's names) shared a deep love as well as age appropriateness.
In terms of David, "it takes a village to take care of Dunbbunny 🐇🐇🐇🐇 Dave and Lu is head of the village". Yes, Susanlynn, sigh. Yes.
Diana
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 5:28:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 5:28:00 PM EDT
Well the age differences between Dave and lucy isn't as yucky as it is with Juan And perla. I can see juan lustily enticing a 16 year old to hop in the sack, now that's downright yucky cuz that's something that he'd do cuz he's just that nasty.
I cant say David was a user as far as sex goes, but She did pull his butt out vineyard trouble,and save his brat
Of a selfish daughter's life from fallin and crackin Braindead skull.
Yeah he used and threw her over for
The psycho whose got em all bamboozled
Into thinkin they can't survive with
Out her twisted butt. Now that's a family that needs anvils, except for
Booby. He's gonna defend Lucy to the end,bless his little confused heart or
maybe he's the only one in that family that isn't confused. I hated when fern told Booby "Luciana is always making problems". Thats the lie tia's been telling her dumb butt. Cuz everybody knows Tia wouldn't lie,she luuurves us
They're in for a ride awakening. Soon.
Especially dumb-vid.
I cant say David was a user as far as sex goes, but She did pull his butt out vineyard trouble,and save his brat
Of a selfish daughter's life from fallin and crackin Braindead skull.
Yeah he used and threw her over for
The psycho whose got em all bamboozled
Into thinkin they can't survive with
Out her twisted butt. Now that's a family that needs anvils, except for
Booby. He's gonna defend Lucy to the end,bless his little confused heart or
maybe he's the only one in that family that isn't confused. I hated when fern told Booby "Luciana is always making problems". Thats the lie tia's been telling her dumb butt. Cuz everybody knows Tia wouldn't lie,she luuurves us
They're in for a ride awakening. Soon.
Especially dumb-vid.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 5:36:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 5:36:00 PM EDT
I don't like auto correct. I type rude and corrects it with r i d e. Smartass
Auto correct.
Auto correct.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 5:41:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 5:41:00 PM EDT
Hey, Diana and Susan: I guess May/December is ok in life and novelas when the man is the December. I do believe the age difference in the couples is probably about 20 years in each case, isn't it?
Nina, Furbrain and Booby are about to get Ph.D.'s in the school of cruel irony, thanks to their DumbDaddy who should've cleared their lives of psycho clinging vine DG and her leech momma YEARS ago!
Nina, Furbrain and Booby are about to get Ph.D.'s in the school of cruel irony, thanks to their DumbDaddy who should've cleared their lives of psycho clinging vine DG and her leech momma YEARS ago!
Diana--in AV it was Jose Angel Arriaga and Victoria Balvanera Brizz
It was lightly overcast today, perfect for weeding and planting after the soaking we got Friday and Saturday. The azaleas are in full bloom in a riot of color (minus Stop Sign Red). Transplanted an azalea, hosta; pruned, weeded, moved stepping stones and stone borders; planted delphiniums and columbine. I feel very virtuous.
It was lightly overcast today, perfect for weeding and planting after the soaking we got Friday and Saturday. The azaleas are in full bloom in a riot of color (minus Stop Sign Red). Transplanted an azalea, hosta; pruned, weeded, moved stepping stones and stone borders; planted delphiniums and columbine. I feel very virtuous.
Wow, Anita, you should! I thought about what I would like to do and decided to put it off!
I be slacker. :/
I be slacker. :/
I think Perla and Luci were about the same age and NoJuan and DudBunny were also about the same age. But I don't think there's a 20 year difference. We've talked their ages to death before, but haven't nailed it yet. Luci was 10 when she got deported. Dudbunny and Lisa had Fer who was about 2. The couple could have been in their mid-late 20ies. Luci had graduated from college (20-21?) when she returned to the Vinedo de Desamor, so she'd been gone about 10-11 years--unless she got a graduate degree. It's within the realm of believability, with 12-15 years difference.
Thinking on Perla, though, has she really traded up? Certainly she's not working any more as a servant in the Robles household, but isn't she sort of doing the same thing for Juan? She's always serving him a drink or food. Maybe when you love a guy you don't think of it as being beneath you. The only thing she got out of leaving the vineyard was a better bed and money for shopping.
But, she hardly ever goes out, except for shopping.
Then I remembered she had some money saved up she offered Juan when he needed more to something-or-other and he turned her down. Now that they are in financial straights, what will she do?
Thinking on Perla, though, has she really traded up? Certainly she's not working any more as a servant in the Robles household, but isn't she sort of doing the same thing for Juan? She's always serving him a drink or food. Maybe when you love a guy you don't think of it as being beneath you. The only thing she got out of leaving the vineyard was a better bed and money for shopping.
But, she hardly ever goes out, except for shopping.
Then I remembered she had some money saved up she offered Juan when he needed more to something-or-other and he turned her down. Now that they are in financial straights, what will she do?
Anita..you should feel virtuous. We bought lots of new hostas last year, but something is nibbling on the leaves. Hubba planted some day lilies today. I love anything that just keeps coming up year after year. #lazyflowerlover
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 6:26:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 6:26:00 PM EDT
Not to beat a brain-dead bunny, Anita, but don't you think noJuan and Dud were at least 30 when the story began? That makes Dud 20 years older than Luci probably was and noJuan 11 years older. Anywho, I guess it doesn't matter: both gals LUUURVVE them some noJuan and Dudley DoWrong!
Also, Perla had about $12,000 if I remember correctly and I thought she did give it to noJuan? o_O
Also, Perla had about $12,000 if I remember correctly and I thought she did give it to noJuan? o_O
Juarever, as CountX would say, Lila.
Howevva, doggonit, now you have me pondering the whole age count again. Sticking to Dave, now, there was a time jump at the beginning and Bobby had made his appearance as a schoolage child, at his birthday party when his mother got zonkked? Was he about 8, turning 9? That makes Dave 30 + 9 + 9 mos. (for babymaking) = almost 40. He was out of it for two years, making him 42 (Gabriel Soto's exact age).
We know Televisa and the producers generally see their male leads as younger than they really are, so I'm still going with Dave's circa 35 to Luciana's 22.
Howevva, doggonit, now you have me pondering the whole age count again. Sticking to Dave, now, there was a time jump at the beginning and Bobby had made his appearance as a schoolage child, at his birthday party when his mother got zonkked? Was he about 8, turning 9? That makes Dave 30 + 9 + 9 mos. (for babymaking) = almost 40. He was out of it for two years, making him 42 (Gabriel Soto's exact age).
We know Televisa and the producers generally see their male leads as younger than they really are, so I'm still going with Dave's circa 35 to Luciana's 22.
I guess I go back to the first episodes where a little colt-legged Perla was having palpatations looking at noJuan and spilled his coffee admitting that being around him made her nervous and for Dud, the age he was when Marcos and Luci were deported. Those guys seemed at least 30 if they were a day. So, if we go with you math Dud should have been 23 when the story started?
It's not the only thing that doesn't add up in this piece! Yah, Anita, like you say, Juarever! I'm done!
;D
It's not the only thing that doesn't add up in this piece! Yah, Anita, like you say, Juarever! I'm done!
;D
Wow, you guys were busy this afternoon!
Lisa, thanks for that information about the ratings in Mexico. It sounds as though we were all on the same page after all.
Lila: "front-loading of their marital problems" oh man, if only that could be an actual thing in real life.
As for the yuck factor, I think the difference between Perla/Juan and Luci/David is that Luci and David were out of each other's lives for ten years. He didn't watch her grow up every day for that whole time. That would make a big difference to me.
As for the age difference, I figured about 15 to 20 years.
I think "juarever" came from PEAM.
Lisa, thanks for that information about the ratings in Mexico. It sounds as though we were all on the same page after all.
Lila: "front-loading of their marital problems" oh man, if only that could be an actual thing in real life.
As for the yuck factor, I think the difference between Perla/Juan and Luci/David is that Luci and David were out of each other's lives for ten years. He didn't watch her grow up every day for that whole time. That would make a big difference to me.
As for the age difference, I figured about 15 to 20 years.
I think "juarever" came from PEAM.
OT: a heads-up--it looks like Uni's doing a "sneak preview" of the first episode of La doble vida de Estela Carrillo tonight after the premiere of El Chapo. Uh...yay? (I dunno. Other than Africa Zavala's outfits, I'm not sure about this one.)
Back to this show, and the subject of temporal mechanics: while the show's deliberately never given any sort of timeframe apart from the two-year-ish gap between Graciela rocking Lisa out and Marcos's death, I agree that the fact that David and Lisa and Juan and Graciela were all in college together long before the start of the show had to make them all at least around 30 at the start of the show. That gives David and Lisa about one year after finishing college, assuming traditional ages (around 22-23), to get married and inherit BdLA and have Fer. Somewhere between then and the start of the show is where Juan's dad committed suicide--and, since the show seems to have firmed it up, the early part of this period has to have been where Marta's damned affair with Fernando falls as well.
That said, Anita's comment that Televisa screws with temporal mechanics for its male leads does tend to be fairly valid AIUI...and, yeah, making David <40 probably lowers the May-December levels quite a bit...but, as with so much on this show, the show itself seems to contradict its own intentions.
Back to this show, and the subject of temporal mechanics: while the show's deliberately never given any sort of timeframe apart from the two-year-ish gap between Graciela rocking Lisa out and Marcos's death, I agree that the fact that David and Lisa and Juan and Graciela were all in college together long before the start of the show had to make them all at least around 30 at the start of the show. That gives David and Lisa about one year after finishing college, assuming traditional ages (around 22-23), to get married and inherit BdLA and have Fer. Somewhere between then and the start of the show is where Juan's dad committed suicide--and, since the show seems to have firmed it up, the early part of this period has to have been where Marta's damned affair with Fernando falls as well.
That said, Anita's comment that Televisa screws with temporal mechanics for its male leads does tend to be fairly valid AIUI...and, yeah, making David <40 probably lowers the May-December levels quite a bit...but, as with so much on this show, the show itself seems to contradict its own intentions.
as with so much on this show, the show itself seems to contradict its own intentions.
You said it, Bill! Thanks!
You said it, Bill! Thanks!
Well, the length of Luci and Marcos's deportation was ten years. That was a a clear time frame because it is the length of time one must wait for a visa after being deported.
Is anyone going to watch "LA Doble Vida.." Tonight at 10.00 on Uni ?
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 8:04:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 8:04:00 PM EDT
Susanlynn, thanks for the update on La Doble Vida.
I intend to watch the show, but won't see tonight's (preview??) as I can't stay up that late, especially on Sunday. I am dragging by week's end as it is.
Hope you enjoy it!
Diana
I intend to watch the show, but won't see tonight's (preview??) as I can't stay up that late, especially on Sunday. I am dragging by week's end as it is.
Hope you enjoy it!
Diana
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 8:24:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 8:24:00 PM EDT
What the hey? Was that a really big mosquito?
No Edith, Mosquitoes don't have feathers.
I'm gonna feed him to the boys then if he comes back.
No Edith, Mosquitoes don't have feathers.
I'm gonna feed him to the boys then if he comes back.
Diana, yes, I understand. I have to get up at 6.00 on weekdays, so I need to get to bed by ten. I will record the show. Hooe that you have a good week ahead.
Permalink posted by : Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 8:52:00 PM EDT
: Sunday, April 23, 2017 at 8:52:00 PM EDT
I watched LA Dobe VIDA, and I must say it peaked my interest. Looks like it
Could be a good one, the lead love-ins
Could strike a romantic cord. We'll
See After the wine Fiasco is over.I do like the actors.Like I say we shall Cc
Could be a good one, the lead love-ins
Could strike a romantic cord. We'll
See After the wine Fiasco is over.I do like the actors.Like I say we shall Cc
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 12:02:00 AM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 12:02:00 AM EDT
Nina, I like the actors too. I'm very interested to see Africa as a villain. She was so sweet in La Malquerida.
I am a bit disappointed that David Zepada is the lead. I had read Horacio Pancheri was going to have the role. And then he didn't.
But I will give David a chance. I'm looking forward to this.
Susanlynn, I did think about staying up but 4:00 comes too quickly. Hope you have a good week too!
Diana
I am a bit disappointed that David Zepada is the lead. I had read Horacio Pancheri was going to have the role. And then he didn't.
But I will give David a chance. I'm looking forward to this.
Susanlynn, I did think about staying up but 4:00 comes too quickly. Hope you have a good week too!
Diana
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 8:34:00 AM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 8:34:00 AM EDT
It seems suspicious to me that everything out of Mexico since our Presidential election has an illegal Alien theme. We Americans do not make ONLY movies about illegal drugs coming in from Mexico or the rapes and murders and other crimes committed by illegals against Americans. It is getting old. It is about as transparent as the mind control DisGrace has become so hated for.
Getting back on topic, I think we reviewed the characters' ages before. Luciana and Marcos were gone for 14 years, which now makes Luciana about 25. Lisa is now dead about 3 years.
Since Fernanda is 18, that makes her 3 years old when Luciana was deported at the age of 10. Leon is 2 or three years younger than Luciana (which I think makes him a couple of years younger than Sonia).
David should be about 42 or 43 now, assuming that he and Lisa were married a year out of college and Fernanda was born two or three years later. If DisGrace was in college at the same time as David, Lisa, and Juan, she can't be more than three years younger than Lisa was which would now make her 39 or 40, much older than the actress playing her.
So why isn't DisGrace freaking out over the Sword of Damocles of Soon Becoming 40? Why isn't Lillian even mentioning this?
Anyway, the age difference between David and Luciana would be about 17 or 18 years. This is the same as the real-life age difference between Jorge Salinas and Ana Brenda Contreras who starred in LQNPA. She had seemed to have no issues with being paired with him but she is also a more experienced actress than Irina Baeva who has only two credits before this on her resume.
Since Fernanda is 18, that makes her 3 years old when Luciana was deported at the age of 10. Leon is 2 or three years younger than Luciana (which I think makes him a couple of years younger than Sonia).
David should be about 42 or 43 now, assuming that he and Lisa were married a year out of college and Fernanda was born two or three years later. If DisGrace was in college at the same time as David, Lisa, and Juan, she can't be more than three years younger than Lisa was which would now make her 39 or 40, much older than the actress playing her.
So why isn't DisGrace freaking out over the Sword of Damocles of Soon Becoming 40? Why isn't Lillian even mentioning this?
Anyway, the age difference between David and Luciana would be about 17 or 18 years. This is the same as the real-life age difference between Jorge Salinas and Ana Brenda Contreras who starred in LQNPA. She had seemed to have no issues with being paired with him but she is also a more experienced actress than Irina Baeva who has only two credits before this on her resume.
Going off the first episode I'm not sold on LDVDEC yet (annoyingly, it will be up against La Candidata and Guerra de idolos over on Telemundo; apart from the apparently super-dour El Chapo, I've only got enough patience right now for one more novela), but it certainly looks like it has more money behind it than this poor show ever did. Not to mention the presence of Erika Buenfil.
UA: Graciela might be bothered to care about the big 4-0, assuming she hasn't already hit it, after she's already completed her total conquest of Mount Robles. But considering her relatively low-key vanity (Lilian and Juan skew the curve massively in that regard), her eventually going full Real Housewife on David makes perfect sense. Botox, tucks, pump-ups, the whole schmeer...
Thanks, Julia. Very late to the party, but want you to know how much I enjoyed your recap. You brought a lot of fun to this episode. Loved the photos and captions, especially DisGrace and her Tassel Earrings of Doom.
I don't for one minute think Lil was in love with Gut, but she is sad that the hot guy who put up with her nasty racist I'm-high-class-and-slumming-with-you attitude is no longer around to take her insults and be made to feel like property. Poor Adolfo will probably be her next target.
David is a blockhead, but I gotta defend him this time. The vineyard owner can't give the nanny a pass on giving his suegra a beatdown in his own home in front of his impressionable little boy. David did stick up for Marta pretty well when the Fer affair was revealed and Lil wanted him to bounce Marta out of there.
I don't for one minute think Lil was in love with Gut, but she is sad that the hot guy who put up with her nasty racist I'm-high-class-and-slumming-with-you attitude is no longer around to take her insults and be made to feel like property. Poor Adolfo will probably be her next target.
David is a blockhead, but I gotta defend him this time. The vineyard owner can't give the nanny a pass on giving his suegra a beatdown in his own home in front of his impressionable little boy. David did stick up for Marta pretty well when the Fer affair was revealed and Lil wanted him to bounce Marta out of there.
My problem with David's attitude is that this situation is truly egregious. Lillian was responsible for Marcos and Luciana being deported. She had no business doing that regardless of the motive or the random way she said it happened. David still had other undocumented workers in his vineyard and -- at that point -- no clue that Juan was deliberately delaying anyone's paperwork.
And it's not like the fight started in front of sweet Bobby, whom I hope grows up to become a shrink.
And it's not like the fight started in front of sweet Bobby, whom I hope grows up to become a shrink.
Julie, you said, "I think "juarever" came from PEAM." Indeed it was. It was CountX's hilarious recaps--it was funnier because he knew the geography between addresses and locations and wondered how characters got there so fast and liked to point it out.
And we in Vinoland also wonder how people get to town so quickly on foot and yet it seems to be far enough off-limits for Fer to go to unless she has special permission.
And we in Vinoland also wonder how people get to town so quickly on foot and yet it seems to be far enough off-limits for Fer to go to unless she has special permission.
Transportation on this show is certainly a mystery, Anita. One possibility is that Fernanda refuses to walk that far or isn't allowed to or is afraid to.
But no, it really doesn't make much sense. People seem to teleport from one place to another instantaneously until someone needs to get shot, and then they walk.
But no, it really doesn't make much sense. People seem to teleport from one place to another instantaneously until someone needs to get shot, and then they walk.
My memory isn't always reliable, but I remember the Pablo deal because I was in the middle of a situation with another recapper who quit. Madelaine persuaded Pablo to step in, and he was a GREAT addition to the team.
Julie - Oops, sorry for misspelling your name!
On transportation, strange that the Vino producers couldn't strike a product placement deal with an auto dealer. Anybody remember LQLVMR where Alejandro's SUV was practically a cast member?
On transportation, strange that the Vino producers couldn't strike a product placement deal with an auto dealer. Anybody remember LQLVMR where Alejandro's SUV was practically a cast member?
Now that you mention it, Niecie, have we seen any product placements at all in VEA? I can't think of any. That's something to be grateful for!
Come to think of it, I don't recall seeing any product placement at all in this show--unless you count Lilian's books, I guess. That said, its relative lack of shooting locations...and extras...and, yes, again with the (nonexistent) cars...this gets more and more bizarre. What kind of budget did it have (AIUI, isn't Jose Castro still a favorite-son producer at Televisa?), and where the heck did it go?
Maybe this show was funded with the loose pocket-change they found under seat cushions around the Televisa offices, and Castro took the project on a dare. That would explain a lot.
LOL! Loose change prolly from the luuuurve seat in the MPR!
Lila
Lila
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 11:41:00 AM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 11:41:00 AM EDT
I don't have a problem with product placements that make sense and doesn't annoy us. In my youth it always seemed ridiculous to see things like dishwashing liquid with black tape over the brand names in US soap opera kitchens, especially since one could recognize the shapes and colors of the bottles.
LQNPA had a full sponsor and we saw that company's logo as the name of Rogelio's ranch/plantation and the products themselves in the town's general store. MCET had La Costena as a sponsor with its logo on Fernando's office building and on the ads being reviewed inside. Avon has sponsored several series and been the characters' workplace in those.
LQNPA had a full sponsor and we saw that company's logo as the name of Rogelio's ranch/plantation and the products themselves in the town's general store. MCET had La Costena as a sponsor with its logo on Fernando's office building and on the ads being reviewed inside. Avon has sponsored several series and been the characters' workplace in those.
Julie: that'd probably explain why Sofia Castro is here, too...
"Yeah, Jose, you got your project. We don't care what you do with it. Just go do it."
"Fine. Sofia, honey? Pack some bags, we're going to California."
"But, Papaaaaa..."
"Yeah, Jose, you got your project. We don't care what you do with it. Just go do it."
"Fine. Sofia, honey? Pack some bags, we're going to California."
"But, Papaaaaa..."
I don't mind if the product placements are just that, like seeing a bag of Bimbo bread. But I've seen TNs where an entire scene is devoted to promoting the product. That's annoying.
Since you're on the low budget comments, I've noticed the "love" sofa in the mpr is the same loveseat in Gracie's bedroom. Yes, the weird brown worn-look pleather, along with the polished brass tacks on the arms. Pretty sure it's the same piece, easily recognized by how hideous it is!
L Linda
L Linda
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 12:11:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 12:11:00 PM EDT
Wow, Linda - I'm amazed that you noticed that! So some of the furniture is teleporting itself between vineyards as well??
That piece had no business being in Gracie's room, it is way out of place. Yes, it teleports.
L Linda
L Linda
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 12:34:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 12:34:00 PM EDT
I am so relieved to be in the home stretch of this series and to only have one more episode to deal with after tonight. Two novelas with butchered double episodes at the same time is more than anyone on this blog should have to deal with.
At some point I will have to do some screen grabs of props, costumes, jewelry, cars, etc., for a weekend discussion on where things come and go. Maybe post some photos and let everyone guess.
At some point I will have to do some screen grabs of props, costumes, jewelry, cars, etc., for a weekend discussion on where things come and go. Maybe post some photos and let everyone guess.
Speaking of product placement, I was watching that preview of the new tn LVDEC, I think those are the initials,
Anyway they are using the univision
News van in all its glory in This tn.
I wonder if those are the real media reporters too.And why don't they have cars And suvs in this(VEA)tn? They did at First. When disgrace rocked her sisters World at the river of jealousy &murder. After that nobody drives not anywhere.did Gut walk to the vineyard? How far is The los angelas vineyard from SB? CUZ when Lucy left, she just walked to miguel's Vineyard. One thing for sure, they'll Stay in shape with all that walkin.
Anyway they are using the univision
News van in all its glory in This tn.
I wonder if those are the real media reporters too.And why don't they have cars And suvs in this(VEA)tn? They did at First. When disgrace rocked her sisters World at the river of jealousy &murder. After that nobody drives not anywhere.did Gut walk to the vineyard? How far is The los angelas vineyard from SB? CUZ when Lucy left, she just walked to miguel's Vineyard. One thing for sure, they'll Stay in shape with all that walkin.
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 1:03:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 1:03:00 PM EDT
And every time LuLu is "leaving" she has that little Hobo pack walking down some dirt path. She just needs the shoulder stick and bandana. Don't most girls have one of their orbiters come pick them up or call a cab?
According to Google maps the famous river is actually called Sonoma Creek and appears to be many miles outside downtown where the school and Sheriff's office is
Is that eagle mooning me??
I think giving Luci a bindle stick would be a great idea. She could hit people with it. I wouldn't blame her a bit. Good for whacking pinatas as well.
Luci doesn't have any orbiters except for Miguel, and I think he teleports too. And if David offered her a ride, she'd hit him with that stick.
I figure the way it works is that you have to take a picturesque walk to the edge of the property first, so that you can make a dramatic exit. Then, pow, you're somewhere else.
I think giving Luci a bindle stick would be a great idea. She could hit people with it. I wouldn't blame her a bit. Good for whacking pinatas as well.
Luci doesn't have any orbiters except for Miguel, and I think he teleports too. And if David offered her a ride, she'd hit him with that stick.
I figure the way it works is that you have to take a picturesque walk to the edge of the property first, so that you can make a dramatic exit. Then, pow, you're somewhere else.
Hey y'all a question. When you guys watch telemundo, does it sound like voice overs, or are the actors really
Talking? And the voice has to catchup with the picture? Sometimes it's like that on uni. And the cc3 is running to fast. Thank goodness for recaps.
Talking? And the voice has to catchup with the picture? Sometimes it's like that on uni. And the cc3 is running to fast. Thank goodness for recaps.
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 1:52:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 1:52:00 PM EDT
I've been going around and around, mentally, between Lil and Marta, trying to figure out which one is "worse" and who owes whom an apology. Here are some thoughts.
- It is not okay to beat up on someone no matter how angry you are. Having said that, however, if I put myself in Marta's sensible shoes, I don't know that I wouldn't have skipped the preliminary chatter and gone straight to the hitting. With a heavy object.
- Marta justifies the altercation because of what Lil did to her family. Fine. (I mean, not really fine, but let's accept it for now.) That does not justify taunting her with "he loved me" which is cruel, petty, stupid, meaningless, and most of all, irrelevant to what Marta herself claims is the topic at hand.
- Marta does owe Lilian an apology for the beating, but Lilian owes her AND Luciana an apology for the deportation. If Lil is willing to apologize, Marta should apologize too. Then, because I am mean, I would make them hug. I would also literally make them wear one another's shoes for a full day.
- This leaves the "you stole my husband" vs "you've been mean to me for many years" conflict, but that one's stupid and they need to get over it because Fernando was not stolen. He put himself up for grabs. He was awful to both of them.
- It is not okay to beat up on someone no matter how angry you are. Having said that, however, if I put myself in Marta's sensible shoes, I don't know that I wouldn't have skipped the preliminary chatter and gone straight to the hitting. With a heavy object.
- Marta justifies the altercation because of what Lil did to her family. Fine. (I mean, not really fine, but let's accept it for now.) That does not justify taunting her with "he loved me" which is cruel, petty, stupid, meaningless, and most of all, irrelevant to what Marta herself claims is the topic at hand.
- Marta does owe Lilian an apology for the beating, but Lilian owes her AND Luciana an apology for the deportation. If Lil is willing to apologize, Marta should apologize too. Then, because I am mean, I would make them hug. I would also literally make them wear one another's shoes for a full day.
- This leaves the "you stole my husband" vs "you've been mean to me for many years" conflict, but that one's stupid and they need to get over it because Fernando was not stolen. He put himself up for grabs. He was awful to both of them.
Nina, I don't watch telemundo, but I know what you mean. And when CC3 is like that on Univision, CC1 is usually screwed up as well.
Oh sorry Nina - you mean sometimes the audio doesn't sync up with the video. I never see that any more, but a few years ago I used to see that on multiple channels from time to time. I don't know what causes it, but I think it has to do with the cable company.
Learn something new. Bindle stick.... Thank You Julie
Look at her mouth. The Eagle is telling very large chick #2 that she is feeding chick #1 right now and to STFU for a minute. The recipients of her wisdom are out of view down in the nest.
Look at her mouth. The Eagle is telling very large chick #2 that she is feeding chick #1 right now and to STFU for a minute. The recipients of her wisdom are out of view down in the nest.
Lil siccing Gut on Marta's family to deport them was awful. But Marta didn't do much (after that initial frantic bus trip to find Marcos and Lu) to bring her family back together over the years, even missed Lu's graduation. Some nannies as close to their well-to-do patron's family as Marta was would've pulled out all the stops to get their beloved husband and daughter back. But Marta, not so much. She wasn't THAT into Marcos anyway (cause he was no !Fernando!) and she was pretty content raising the patron's kids. Lu had always been an independent girl she didn't really understand anyway, so she was content with being separated from her. I just feel like Marta's beatdown of Lil was more about the hate between the two women over the men in the middle than about the deportation.
Marta is definitely a kind woman, nice and motherly to all the young'uns like Carito and Miguel. And now that she's willing to settle for Ramon, she'll probably be nice to him.
Marta is definitely a kind woman, nice and motherly to all the young'uns like Carito and Miguel. And now that she's willing to settle for Ramon, she'll probably be nice to him.
Ummm...not to take anything away from how earth shaking the Mar/Lil beatdown is, but the county sheriff has been murdered in cold blood in broad(ha) daylight with at least two witnesses. Just saying if this happened in Tampa Florida 90 percent of the LEO in the state of Flor-I-Duh would be working on this and the two witnesses would be waaaay too busy to administer any ass whippings with 50 news trucks following them even into the bathroom.
Wow..Home from work and enjoying all the new comments.
Regarding product placement, it is sometimes so obvious and I am glad that we did not get it in this telenovela..Other than .."Got wine? " A general acknowledgement that wine is fine. I have a memory of a lot of Bailey's placement in AV, or was that just in my dream?
Julie..That was a very careful analysis and comparison of Lilian and Marta. I would like to count on your advice for the next big decision that I have to make. For me, they are both flawed characters, but Lilian is so nasty and bitter to just about everyone , including her own fammmiiilllyy. At least Marta has a more pleasant disposition and seems to be surrounded by children and friends who love her despite her class so she must be loving them in return. That being said, I would rather spend time with Marta than Lilian (who would probably start bossing me around and insulting me...Like she does everyone else in her orbit.
Regarding product placement, it is sometimes so obvious and I am glad that we did not get it in this telenovela..Other than .."Got wine? " A general acknowledgement that wine is fine. I have a memory of a lot of Bailey's placement in AV, or was that just in my dream?
Julie..That was a very careful analysis and comparison of Lilian and Marta. I would like to count on your advice for the next big decision that I have to make. For me, they are both flawed characters, but Lilian is so nasty and bitter to just about everyone , including her own fammmiiilllyy. At least Marta has a more pleasant disposition and seems to be surrounded by children and friends who love her despite her class so she must be loving them in return. That being said, I would rather spend time with Marta than Lilian (who would probably start bossing me around and insulting me...Like she does everyone else in her orbit.
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 2:42:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 2:42:00 PM EDT
CA is more laid back about shooting popo than Fl I guess. We get ALL bent out of shape down here about those things.
- Marta justifies the altercation because of what Lil did to her family. Fine. (I mean, not really fine, but let's accept it for now.) That does not justify taunting her with "he loved me" which is cruel, petty, stupid, meaningless, and most of all, irrelevant to what Marta herself claims is the topic at hand.--Julie at 1:59
I just feel like Marta's beatdown of Lil was more about the hate between the two women over the men in the middle than about the deportation.--Niecie at 2:23
You two said exactly what I felt and failed to express in my comment of Saturday at 11:00! It was some time before I realized my rant was about Lil and Martyra's man-sharing and NOT about the deportation. At a gut level that's what I felt the fight was about. I'm too lazy and in no way desirous of playing that back but as I remember it, did Marta wail and moan about Lil having Brian send Luci and Marcos away? All I can remember is Marta bawling about how Brian loved HER and not Lilian. And even if no word was ever said about Brian but it was all about the deportation, that kind of physical attack 14 years after the fact when her attempts to get them back or be with them was lukewarm at best. . . nah, I'm not feeling Marta's rage at all.
Marta's self-righteous entitled attitude toward Fernando and the self-proclaimed superiority of her feminine wiles and sexual prowess which she thinks gives her a right to every man Lil has is stupid and sickening and earns my deepest, sincerest contempt. Yes, she crowed several times in Lilian's face about how Lil couldn't satisfy a man and even told her once she needed to improve her bedroom skills so Brian could forget about her. PUH-LEASE!! I hate the bitch even more than Lilian, and that's saying a lot. I wish she could've gone with Brian so we don't have to listen to her gate-mouthed wailing anymore!
I just feel like Marta's beatdown of Lil was more about the hate between the two women over the men in the middle than about the deportation.--Niecie at 2:23
You two said exactly what I felt and failed to express in my comment of Saturday at 11:00! It was some time before I realized my rant was about Lil and Martyra's man-sharing and NOT about the deportation. At a gut level that's what I felt the fight was about. I'm too lazy and in no way desirous of playing that back but as I remember it, did Marta wail and moan about Lil having Brian send Luci and Marcos away? All I can remember is Marta bawling about how Brian loved HER and not Lilian. And even if no word was ever said about Brian but it was all about the deportation, that kind of physical attack 14 years after the fact when her attempts to get them back or be with them was lukewarm at best. . . nah, I'm not feeling Marta's rage at all.
Marta's self-righteous entitled attitude toward Fernando and the self-proclaimed superiority of her feminine wiles and sexual prowess which she thinks gives her a right to every man Lil has is stupid and sickening and earns my deepest, sincerest contempt. Yes, she crowed several times in Lilian's face about how Lil couldn't satisfy a man and even told her once she needed to improve her bedroom skills so Brian could forget about her. PUH-LEASE!! I hate the bitch even more than Lilian, and that's saying a lot. I wish she could've gone with Brian so we don't have to listen to her gate-mouthed wailing anymore!
Julie, I agree that Fernando wronged both women. That was why Brian thought he could get them to stop their fighting when he told them both at the same time. Their fighting was a double waste of energy and he was also tired of it.
Had that been effective, this situation would not have happened. Of course, it could have been avoided entirely if Brian had come clean with Marta about Lillian's involvement in the first place.
Marta did wail about the deportation when it happened. However, she couldn't do much herself because she was still undocumented. She and Leon were documented at some point during the period that was jumped to Luciana's graduation. She did love Marcos but that was the "first love" of a woman who didn't have a single adult life. More about that later.
Had that been effective, this situation would not have happened. Of course, it could have been avoided entirely if Brian had come clean with Marta about Lillian's involvement in the first place.
Marta did wail about the deportation when it happened. However, she couldn't do much herself because she was still undocumented. She and Leon were documented at some point during the period that was jumped to Luciana's graduation. She did love Marcos but that was the "first love" of a woman who didn't have a single adult life. More about that later.
I learned "bindle stick" at an old job. We had a product line called "Hobo" and needed an icon for the software. We all liked the bindle stick & bag, but someone thought it would be bad to associate our product with homelessness. HELLO? Discuss with the company owner who came up with the "Hobo" name...
Yeah, the Sonoma police seem strangely relaxed about the murder of their sheriff.
Lila, I THINK Marta's rant to Lilian had some deportation stuff in it, but most of it was about Brian.
If I had to throw someone out, it would either be both of them so I can get some peace and quiet, or I'd get rid of Lilian because she's useless and she's drinking all my wine. Alas, David is engaged to Lilian's daughter, so he doesn't get to choose that way. But if all of his staff quits, I hope he teaches Lil how to use a, er, grape-wrangling tool or whatever they do on a vineyard.
Yeah, the Sonoma police seem strangely relaxed about the murder of their sheriff.
Lila, I THINK Marta's rant to Lilian had some deportation stuff in it, but most of it was about Brian.
If I had to throw someone out, it would either be both of them so I can get some peace and quiet, or I'd get rid of Lilian because she's useless and she's drinking all my wine. Alas, David is engaged to Lilian's daughter, so he doesn't get to choose that way. But if all of his staff quits, I hope he teaches Lil how to use a, er, grape-wrangling tool or whatever they do on a vineyard.
OK, what I meant by this in the 3:08 post is that Marcos was Marta's first boyfriend and she was 18 years old when they got married. I have a longtime friend who was in a similar situation when she and her husband got married during their senior year of college. They both went from living with parents to being married without having had single, independent lives in between. She had never really dated anyone else. About ten or twelve years later she wondered what she missed out on.
She never had the opportunity Marta had (if one could call it that) so she never cheated on her husband. At some point since then she got over this. Marta probably would have, too, and based on her scenes with him in the early episodes she definitely loved him.
The writers did a very poor job in having thrown shade on her with this adultery. As to why either Fernando or Brian preferred her I believe it is because she has a heart and no prejudices. Lillian can't really make either claim.
She never had the opportunity Marta had (if one could call it that) so she never cheated on her husband. At some point since then she got over this. Marta probably would have, too, and based on her scenes with him in the early episodes she definitely loved him.
The writers did a very poor job in having thrown shade on her with this adultery. As to why either Fernando or Brian preferred her I believe it is because she has a heart and no prejudices. Lillian can't really make either claim.
I don't understand why Marta was portrayed as someone who had to rub Lilian's nose in it every chance she got. It seems unnecessary to give her this nasty side. Her adultery could have remained a sore spot with Lilian without Marta seemingly reveling it and even using Brian against her. What was the point?
Lila I understand your total dislike of Marta. When I first saw lil being so Incredibly nasty and racist to her, (but Shes that way to all latinos). I was like why is she so nasty to this lady?
Then the cheating hubby came up. And
Marta was Walkin round like she didn't
Know what was up, I started thinkin she is not that innocent as she is acting. That said, I'll take Marta any
Day over lil. Lil is evil nasty. Look
How easy it was for her to call folks and a start a smear campaign against Brian. Lil enjoys being nasty to much. And she's good at it.Marta has remorse
Lil has no qualms about hurting anyone
Not even her own. She can't stand her grandkids.Shes cold.Marta is not even perfect, but she'd make a better mom-in-law and grandma than lil. I like
Marta. I want to see another tn now.
Then the cheating hubby came up. And
Marta was Walkin round like she didn't
Know what was up, I started thinkin she is not that innocent as she is acting. That said, I'll take Marta any
Day over lil. Lil is evil nasty. Look
How easy it was for her to call folks and a start a smear campaign against Brian. Lil enjoys being nasty to much. And she's good at it.Marta has remorse
Lil has no qualms about hurting anyone
Not even her own. She can't stand her grandkids.Shes cold.Marta is not even perfect, but she'd make a better mom-in-law and grandma than lil. I like
Marta. I want to see another tn now.
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 4:04:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 4:04:00 PM EDT
The writers did a very poor job in having thrown shade on her with this adultery. As to why either Fernando or Brian preferred her I believe it is because she has a heart and no prejudices. Lillian can't really make either claim. --Urban @ 3:35
It seems unnecessary to give her this nasty side. Her adultery could have remained a sore spot with Lilian without Marta seemingly reveling it and even using Brian against her. What was the point? --Julie @ 3:53
When I first saw lil being so Incredibly nasty and racist to her, (but Shes that way to all latinos). I was like why is she so nasty to this lady? --Nina @ 4:04
Excellent points, my friends! Excellent! I have thought about how Marta acted so innocent at first, as we all did and was puzzled but I'm more puzzled by the whole "I hate Latinos" thing when they both look Gringa to me? I mean, I know Mexicans come in all skin tones, hair textures, eye colors, etc., but what the heck is supposed to be the difference between Lil and Marta? OK, Lil is racist but I think this would have packed a heavier punch if Marta was darker and less European looking.
Now. Don't throw tomatoes, we're all friends here but here's what I think the writers might have been going for and didn't have the nerve or funds or didn't give enough of a fudge to cast it that way: Gringo Lil (I guess she's supposed to have roots in Great Britain the way she speaks English to Brian and Dave uses English with her when he wants to drive a point home), Gringo Lil is hateful towards and perhaps secretly envious of the dark, "hot-blooded", "sexually wanton" Latina woman, Marta, and she's conflicted because she herself is sexually attracted to the dark, passionate Latino men. Lil herself said this at one point. Also, in earlier episodes Miguel and, gosh, what is hair-boy's name? He used to have a nickname earlier in the show, Fer's crush? Anyway him and Miguel talked about the "curse" of having hot Latin blood because it made them want to act sometimes without thinking as in when, Tano, that's his name, Tano wanted to crush Mark's face in. . .
. . .So, the writers have flirted with the Latin stereotypes and the whole Marta/Lil thing would have (been offensive perhaps and still stupid) but would "make sense" if this whole dynamic had been more overtly played to.
Damn. I'm going to have a lot of time freed up when this thing goes off! Nevertheless it is fun chewing the fat with y'all and I'm going to miss it.
Please understand that the above scenario is an acknowledged offensive stereotype, so don't come for me!
It seems unnecessary to give her this nasty side. Her adultery could have remained a sore spot with Lilian without Marta seemingly reveling it and even using Brian against her. What was the point? --Julie @ 3:53
When I first saw lil being so Incredibly nasty and racist to her, (but Shes that way to all latinos). I was like why is she so nasty to this lady? --Nina @ 4:04
Excellent points, my friends! Excellent! I have thought about how Marta acted so innocent at first, as we all did and was puzzled but I'm more puzzled by the whole "I hate Latinos" thing when they both look Gringa to me? I mean, I know Mexicans come in all skin tones, hair textures, eye colors, etc., but what the heck is supposed to be the difference between Lil and Marta? OK, Lil is racist but I think this would have packed a heavier punch if Marta was darker and less European looking.
Now. Don't throw tomatoes, we're all friends here but here's what I think the writers might have been going for and didn't have the nerve or funds or didn't give enough of a fudge to cast it that way: Gringo Lil (I guess she's supposed to have roots in Great Britain the way she speaks English to Brian and Dave uses English with her when he wants to drive a point home), Gringo Lil is hateful towards and perhaps secretly envious of the dark, "hot-blooded", "sexually wanton" Latina woman, Marta, and she's conflicted because she herself is sexually attracted to the dark, passionate Latino men. Lil herself said this at one point. Also, in earlier episodes Miguel and, gosh, what is hair-boy's name? He used to have a nickname earlier in the show, Fer's crush? Anyway him and Miguel talked about the "curse" of having hot Latin blood because it made them want to act sometimes without thinking as in when, Tano, that's his name, Tano wanted to crush Mark's face in. . .
. . .So, the writers have flirted with the Latin stereotypes and the whole Marta/Lil thing would have (been offensive perhaps and still stupid) but would "make sense" if this whole dynamic had been more overtly played to.
Damn. I'm going to have a lot of time freed up when this thing goes off! Nevertheless it is fun chewing the fat with y'all and I'm going to miss it.
Please understand that the above scenario is an acknowledged offensive stereotype, so don't come for me!
I am sick of both these mujers. It's like being stuck in 7th grade study hall with two chicks fighting over the same guy...Well, the same two guys...Well, the same two dead guys..Really? So much time wasted on those two warring matrons abd their love lives instead of the main storyline and the main characters.
As to the finale, we know that Disgrace and Juan are headed for jail or the not so great beyond, but what are the writers going to do with Ms. Cranky pants Lilian? Surely she deserves a small anvil for being a pain in the pants to almost everyone throughout this whole show. Her one redeeming moment was the sympathy she showed for Adolfo, but I do not want her rewarded with a sweet guy like him. Adolfo does not deserve a Lilian anvil.
As to the finale, we know that Disgrace and Juan are headed for jail or the not so great beyond, but what are the writers going to do with Ms. Cranky pants Lilian? Surely she deserves a small anvil for being a pain in the pants to almost everyone throughout this whole show. Her one redeeming moment was the sympathy she showed for Adolfo, but I do not want her rewarded with a sweet guy like him. Adolfo does not deserve a Lilian anvil.
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 4:36:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 4:36:00 PM EDT
Lila, you're probably right. Lilian is supposed to be a gringa. So Marta's out-of-control, over-the-top behavior is the writers' rendition of hot latin blood? Great Caesar's ghost. I've seen hot-blooded behavior in TNs before, but I didn't recognize this as that because I've never seen it so petty and screechy before.
The hair-boy is Tano. That is his nickname... I think his "real" name is Carlos?
The hair-boy is Tano. That is his nickname... I think his "real" name is Carlos?
I get what you're saying Lila about Marta and lil. " okay Lil is racist but I think this would have packed a heavier punch if Marta was darker and less European looking". I think the writers were maybe playin it safe, so
They put two ladys in the roles whose skin color is almost the same,on mytv lil Is a bit lighter complected than marta. I guess they maybe didn't want the racist part to show as much as
Being heard. Lilian didn't bit her tongue when she voiced how she feels about latinos. I wonder if fernando was dark skinned.
They put two ladys in the roles whose skin color is almost the same,on mytv lil Is a bit lighter complected than marta. I guess they maybe didn't want the racist part to show as much as
Being heard. Lilian didn't bit her tongue when she voiced how she feels about latinos. I wonder if fernando was dark skinned.
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 4:55:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 4:55:00 PM EDT
Yes, that's his real name. His nick is the one that doesn't make any sense. With the right haircut he would be hot.
Both Cynthia Klitbo and Azela Robinson are half gringa and half Mexican. They were cast in this series because they are both bilingual.
What doesn't make sense about Lillian is her racism and her craving for hot Latin men (She must hate herself for that particular craving). If she were as racist as she talks why would she be speaking Spanish 80% of the screentime? Why would she have been in the press as Brian's main squeeze? Why did she have "friends" who clearly were Latino that she was speaking Spanish with them on the phone? Did David's parents (when they were alive) not count because they had been born in California?
Both Cynthia Klitbo and Azela Robinson are half gringa and half Mexican. They were cast in this series because they are both bilingual.
What doesn't make sense about Lillian is her racism and her craving for hot Latin men (She must hate herself for that particular craving). If she were as racist as she talks why would she be speaking Spanish 80% of the screentime? Why would she have been in the press as Brian's main squeeze? Why did she have "friends" who clearly were Latino that she was speaking Spanish with them on the phone? Did David's parents (when they were alive) not count because they had been born in California?
Yah, I'm tired of these two old broads, too! Jeezo-pete! I guess they're stalling because we all know the big story is. . .
THE ROCK!
THE ROCK!
OOPs. Nina, to answer your question, Fernando was fair-skinned with dark hair. They showed one family photo taken when their daughters were old enough to be portrayed by the two actresses. I didn't recognize the actor who stood in for him, so he must be a minor player at the network.
No,adolfo does not Deserve to be stuck
With THAT WOMAN. He's been through enough heartache. It's time for some happiness these people are miserable.
The weather is beautiful outside it's a pretty spring day. But these people can't enjoy it cuz they're greedy and
Selfish and fightin over two dead guys
And marrying the wrong person, and are
Fighting with the olive oil guy next door. Stop the madness.
With THAT WOMAN. He's been through enough heartache. It's time for some happiness these people are miserable.
The weather is beautiful outside it's a pretty spring day. But these people can't enjoy it cuz they're greedy and
Selfish and fightin over two dead guys
And marrying the wrong person, and are
Fighting with the olive oil guy next door. Stop the madness.
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 5:13:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 5:13:00 PM EDT
Julie..Have you ever seen "Weekend at Bernie's?"
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 7:13:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 7:13:00 PM EDT
171 comments. 169 of them about these two old mangey nanny goats.
Slow day on the patio?
The next TN should be "Menopause Mayhem", it will break records.
It could all be shot on location in Macy's.
Slow day on the patio?
The next TN should be "Menopause Mayhem", it will break records.
It could all be shot on location in Macy's.
Never seen that movie,, Susanlynn, but I get the joke. :-)
Kirby, if it's menopause, they'll be too hot to fight. They'll just gaze at one another wearily and ask, "what the hell is wrong with the air conditioner??"
Kirby, if it's menopause, they'll be too hot to fight. They'll just gaze at one another wearily and ask, "what the hell is wrong with the air conditioner??"
Maybe they could start competing for both Ramon and Adolfo. They seem to enjoy fighting over guys.
Permalink posted by : Monday, April 24, 2017 at 8:46:00 PM EDT
: Monday, April 24, 2017 at 8:46:00 PM EDT
I feel a fight over Adolfo brewing. Hopefully he won't put up with such nonsense and tell them both to take a hike!
If this lasts four years, I will lose my mind. I just might agree to party with a dead guy if it will get me access to a swimming pool.
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